Got an X51 air box, GT3 TB & Plenum - before & after dyno's
04-25-2013, 04:07 AM
#16
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That second hole in the decklid will make a BIG difference. Makes sense though as you're pushing in twice as more air as you are now. I had my car the same way as you for about 2 days before I completed the decklid cut out and it was night and day.
04-25-2013, 01:21 PM
#18
Hi Gibbo,
Did you change your oil to NT yet?
Which weight did you use, or plan to use?
IIRC, Hartech is recommending 10W-50 for water cooled engines in UK climate. Is that the viscosity that you have chosen?
I;ve been running 5W-40 NT for last about 300 kms. Overall, very quiet and smoothly running piece of machinery mounted behind my back.
Very curious about the NT technology. Looking forward to your input.
Cheers,
Luke
Did you change your oil to NT yet?
Which weight did you use, or plan to use?
IIRC, Hartech is recommending 10W-50 for water cooled engines in UK climate. Is that the viscosity that you have chosen?
I;ve been running 5W-40 NT for last about 300 kms. Overall, very quiet and smoothly running piece of machinery mounted behind my back.
Very curious about the NT technology. Looking forward to your input.
Cheers,
Luke
04-26-2013, 10:08 AM
#20
Rennlist Member
actually, i was going to ask you how you "extended" the wiring. new (OEM) extended harness? or did you solder in a patch?
04-26-2013, 05:48 PM
#21
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Hi there
Ok got BMC filters in, allowed throttle body to adjust and went for a good drive, I'd say what I've noticed is:-
Throttle response is now better than the stock paper filters, but marginally less slight than before stock BMC airbox and stock throttlebody, this is no doubt the effect going from 76mm - 82mm throttle body, is it an issue, well no, it's marginal and hard to notice.
Maybe a marginal torque loss sub 3000rpm but it could just be the fact the car seems smoother in power delivery now, as the car seems to accelerate faster.
4000rpm and above the car pulls harder, but at 5500rpm and above it feels like it's pulling way harder and would keep pulling so hard right upto 9000rpm if the engine could spin that fast. Put it this way floor it in 2nd gear at 4000rpm and you need to be very quick to get the change upto 3rd.
It seems 1-2mph quicker by a landmark I regular accelerate too on my route to work. If I was to have the dyno in my head I'd be thinking similar/same power upto 3500rpm but then a steeping upwards curve above 3500rpm with more top-end power for sure.
Onto the noise, sorry GT3 guys but from inside the cabin to my ears it's better, from the outside I'd say it's not, but on the inside it's like a race/cup car when the revs pass 5000rpm, infact 5000rpm now sounds like 7000rpm did previously, it's absolute music to my ears.
Shall aim to get on dyno next week and to see if there is any change power/torque.
P.S. Still need to sort rubber bellow on right side to seal against warm air but the gap is less than an inch so doubt it's having a noticeable effect on performance.
Ok got BMC filters in, allowed throttle body to adjust and went for a good drive, I'd say what I've noticed is:-
Throttle response is now better than the stock paper filters, but marginally less slight than before stock BMC airbox and stock throttlebody, this is no doubt the effect going from 76mm - 82mm throttle body, is it an issue, well no, it's marginal and hard to notice.
Maybe a marginal torque loss sub 3000rpm but it could just be the fact the car seems smoother in power delivery now, as the car seems to accelerate faster.
4000rpm and above the car pulls harder, but at 5500rpm and above it feels like it's pulling way harder and would keep pulling so hard right upto 9000rpm if the engine could spin that fast. Put it this way floor it in 2nd gear at 4000rpm and you need to be very quick to get the change upto 3rd.
It seems 1-2mph quicker by a landmark I regular accelerate too on my route to work. If I was to have the dyno in my head I'd be thinking similar/same power upto 3500rpm but then a steeping upwards curve above 3500rpm with more top-end power for sure.
Onto the noise, sorry GT3 guys but from inside the cabin to my ears it's better, from the outside I'd say it's not, but on the inside it's like a race/cup car when the revs pass 5000rpm, infact 5000rpm now sounds like 7000rpm did previously, it's absolute music to my ears.
Shall aim to get on dyno next week and to see if there is any change power/torque.
P.S. Still need to sort rubber bellow on right side to seal against warm air but the gap is less than an inch so doubt it's having a noticeable effect on performance.
04-27-2013, 01:48 PM
#22
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Dremel the bellow of my old Airbox and it fits perfectly over the X51 snorkel, so now it's only getting cold air. Noise and power vastly improved, get to dyno next weekend.
Looks almost OEM
Needs good clean now.
Looks almost OEM
Needs good clean now.
05-03-2013, 04:13 PM
#23
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Hi there
Well went to the dyno today in short with 82mm, tb, plenum and X51 Airbox car made 375BHP, 4BHP more peak than last time, but had lost torque and power sub 3000rpm.
So put stock tb and plenum back on and throttle response improved and the low-down torque/power came back but car made 370BHP peak.
However both runs had a major issue, car was lean, LEAN LEAN!!
This shop does tuning for several makes, but not Porsche unfortunately, however they have got down to the bottom of the cause:
The tube where the maf inserts on the stock and X51 Airbox are different in diameter. The X51 Airbox has a larger diameter tube and the stock or the softronic map can't account for this. Due to the larger diameter the X51 Airbox flows a lot more air pass the maf without it realising this. Because maf calculates airflow based on speed of airflow, problem is with larger diameter tube you chase Venturi effect and as such far more air flows across the maf. As the stock maps are based on air speed and set diameter of the stock Airbox when you increase this diameter the air speed slows down but your getting more air. As such on stock map or even softronic the car air fuel ratio goes out, very badly.
As such anyone who has upgraded their car with X51 Airbox and are running the stock remap or softronic, YOUR CAR IS RUNNING LEAN!!
The only way to fix this will be to either get the X51 map from Porsche or get a custom live map done. I shall speak with Scott at softronic to see if he can help.
The dyno shop feel that with the right map which adds fuel I'd also be able to run 82mm tb and have good throttle response as with stock but also make more power everywhere and no doubt get over 380ish peak.
Well went to the dyno today in short with 82mm, tb, plenum and X51 Airbox car made 375BHP, 4BHP more peak than last time, but had lost torque and power sub 3000rpm.
So put stock tb and plenum back on and throttle response improved and the low-down torque/power came back but car made 370BHP peak.
However both runs had a major issue, car was lean, LEAN LEAN!!
This shop does tuning for several makes, but not Porsche unfortunately, however they have got down to the bottom of the cause:
The tube where the maf inserts on the stock and X51 Airbox are different in diameter. The X51 Airbox has a larger diameter tube and the stock or the softronic map can't account for this. Due to the larger diameter the X51 Airbox flows a lot more air pass the maf without it realising this. Because maf calculates airflow based on speed of airflow, problem is with larger diameter tube you chase Venturi effect and as such far more air flows across the maf. As the stock maps are based on air speed and set diameter of the stock Airbox when you increase this diameter the air speed slows down but your getting more air. As such on stock map or even softronic the car air fuel ratio goes out, very badly.
As such anyone who has upgraded their car with X51 Airbox and are running the stock remap or softronic, YOUR CAR IS RUNNING LEAN!!
The only way to fix this will be to either get the X51 map from Porsche or get a custom live map done. I shall speak with Scott at softronic to see if he can help.
The dyno shop feel that with the right map which adds fuel I'd also be able to run 82mm tb and have good throttle response as with stock but also make more power everywhere and no doubt get over 380ish peak.
05-03-2013, 06:01 PM
#24
Rennlist Member
Hi there
Well went to the dyno today in short with 82mm, tb, plenum and X51 Airbox car made 375BHP, 4BHP more peak than last time, but had lost torque and power sub 3000rpm.
So put stock tb and plenum back on and throttle response improved and the low-down torque/power came back but car made 370BHP peak.
However both runs had a major issue, car was lean, LEAN LEAN!!
This shop does tuning for several makes, but not Porsche unfortunately, however they have got down to the bottom of the cause:
The tube where the maf inserts on the stock and X51 Airbox are different in diameter. The X51 Airbox has a larger diameter tube and the stock or the softronic map can't account for this. Due to the larger diameter the X51 Airbox flows a lot more air pass the maf without it realising this. Because maf calculates airflow based on speed of airflow, problem is with larger diameter tube you chase Venturi effect and as such far more air flows across the maf. As the stock maps are based on air speed and set diameter of the stock Airbox when you increase this diameter the air speed slows down but your getting more air. As such on stock map or even softronic the car air fuel ratio goes out, very badly.
As such anyone who has upgraded their car with X51 Airbox and are running the stock remap or softronic, YOUR CAR IS RUNNING LEAN!!
The only way to fix this will be to either get the X51 map from Porsche or get a custom live map done. I shall speak with Scott at softronic to see if he can help.
The dyno shop feel that with the right map which adds fuel I'd also be able to run 82mm tb and have good throttle response as with stock but also make more power everywhere and no doubt get over 380ish peak.
Well went to the dyno today in short with 82mm, tb, plenum and X51 Airbox car made 375BHP, 4BHP more peak than last time, but had lost torque and power sub 3000rpm.
So put stock tb and plenum back on and throttle response improved and the low-down torque/power came back but car made 370BHP peak.
However both runs had a major issue, car was lean, LEAN LEAN!!
This shop does tuning for several makes, but not Porsche unfortunately, however they have got down to the bottom of the cause:
The tube where the maf inserts on the stock and X51 Airbox are different in diameter. The X51 Airbox has a larger diameter tube and the stock or the softronic map can't account for this. Due to the larger diameter the X51 Airbox flows a lot more air pass the maf without it realising this. Because maf calculates airflow based on speed of airflow, problem is with larger diameter tube you chase Venturi effect and as such far more air flows across the maf. As the stock maps are based on air speed and set diameter of the stock Airbox when you increase this diameter the air speed slows down but your getting more air. As such on stock map or even softronic the car air fuel ratio goes out, very badly.
As such anyone who has upgraded their car with X51 Airbox and are running the stock remap or softronic, YOUR CAR IS RUNNING LEAN!!
The only way to fix this will be to either get the X51 map from Porsche or get a custom live map done. I shall speak with Scott at softronic to see if he can help.
The dyno shop feel that with the right map which adds fuel I'd also be able to run 82mm tb and have good throttle response as with stock but also make more power everywhere and no doubt get over 380ish peak.
Ask suncoast, see if they can provide a mapping. I know with a full X51 kit sale, the mapping was included.
05-07-2013, 05:04 PM
#25
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Hi there
Got my AFR data from the dyno last week:-
1500 - 6000rpm @ 14.7 AFR at WOT
6000 - 7400rpm @ 13.4 AFR at WOT
So above 6000rpm things are OK as for best power you want around 13 AFR I believe on an NA car, but below 6000rpm it's quite lean which will rob power, response and things will run hotter.
Worked closely with Scott on a custom map, he's taken a Porsche X51 map and modified it work on my car, butt dyno it feels great and car is very responsive, even at low rpms.
I shall try to remember to post up the graph later/tomorrow. Am heading back to dyno this Friday to re-check AFR and power run to see how the new custom map is.
Got my AFR data from the dyno last week:-
1500 - 6000rpm @ 14.7 AFR at WOT
6000 - 7400rpm @ 13.4 AFR at WOT
So above 6000rpm things are OK as for best power you want around 13 AFR I believe on an NA car, but below 6000rpm it's quite lean which will rob power, response and things will run hotter.
Worked closely with Scott on a custom map, he's taken a Porsche X51 map and modified it work on my car, butt dyno it feels great and car is very responsive, even at low rpms.
I shall try to remember to post up the graph later/tomorrow. Am heading back to dyno this Friday to re-check AFR and power run to see how the new custom map is.
05-07-2013, 06:47 PM
#26
Drifting
Hi there
Got my AFR data from the dyno last week:-
1500 - 6000rpm @ 14.7 AFR at WOT
6000 - 7400rpm @ 13.4 AFR at WOT
So above 6000rpm things are OK as for best power you want around 13 AFR I believe on an NA car, but below 6000rpm it's quite lean which will rob power, response and things will run hotter.
Worked closely with Scott on a custom map, he's taken a Porsche X51 map and modified it work on my car, butt dyno it feels great and car is very responsive, even at low rpms.
I shall try to remember to post up the graph later/tomorrow. Am heading back to dyno this Friday to re-check AFR and power run to see how the new custom map is.
Got my AFR data from the dyno last week:-
1500 - 6000rpm @ 14.7 AFR at WOT
6000 - 7400rpm @ 13.4 AFR at WOT
So above 6000rpm things are OK as for best power you want around 13 AFR I believe on an NA car, but below 6000rpm it's quite lean which will rob power, response and things will run hotter.
Worked closely with Scott on a custom map, he's taken a Porsche X51 map and modified it work on my car, butt dyno it feels great and car is very responsive, even at low rpms.
I shall try to remember to post up the graph later/tomorrow. Am heading back to dyno this Friday to re-check AFR and power run to see how the new custom map is.
05-07-2013, 07:16 PM
#27
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I had a similar issue with low end response on my setup - GT3 TB, IPD comp plenum, and EVOM geared towards 82mm vs. the stock 74mm intake. Add to the equation an FVD exhaust system - long piped exhaust manifold, 200 cell cats, cans, and tips - 70mm vs. 62.5mm. All added up to nice top end but lost of torque on the low end. An FVD remap brought back low end torque and then some. Very happy with the setup. Call Rhonda at FVD if you'd like them to give you a second opinion/option. BTW, no CEL and I passed the state emissions test.
Is FVD flash also softronic based, as in you connect to their servers, they take your original file and give you a tuned file back?
05-07-2013, 08:18 PM
#28
Drifting
FVD programs for Porsche Motorsport so they have the source code and map over the Porsche baseline. With my car I provided them with my list of mods and they in turn had me connect their cable to the ODBC II port and run their app which connects to their server via the internet. A day later they send you a custom tuned remap file for your car and a base code file. Not sure which state you're located in but look into the emission testing issues. Some remap providers (not sure about softronics) require that you load the factory code to pass emission as their tuned map will turn off secondary air systems and emission sensors to avoid issuing CEL codes especially if you have 200 cell cats. I like how my FVD tune code does not require this = I don't have to remap back to stock then tuned after going thru emission test and my car does not have to relearn each year I take it in for a state safety/emission test. It's apparently difficult to formulate a well balanced system with mods which issues no CEL, has a tuned remap, addresses low and high end power, and has no issues with emissions testing. Getting two out of four is common place but getting all of these addressed is like threading a needle. GL and let us know the outcome. BTW, that airbox is the a nice looking piece of equipment.
05-07-2013, 09:01 PM
#29
.
05-07-2013, 10:23 PM
#30
Race Director
I believe Softronic uses Promotive for the tune and Softronic provides the program to flash the tune into your car. Promotive is one of the if not the best in the industry.