Kika

Where in so cal are you?

We had about 14 993s over at a RLers house a few weeks ago for some beers, pizza and tie rod pinning. Thread here: https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...er-record.html

That's how the so cal 993guys roll!!!

The next weekend, they did another 4 cars. Lots of us around.
Lots of suspension packages as well.

My 993 is my 3rd Porsche, previous cars were a 68 912, which was actually my wife's car, and an 80 911SC.
Newer cars are less "raw" than their predecessors, they become more powerful and more refined. So a lot has to do with what you are used to. My wife can't get over having a 911 that has a decent air conditioner, as none of the 911s prior to the 993 had AC worth a stink.

I will refine my earlier comment a little, as just driving one 993 doesn't necessarily represent the entirety of that version. At the aforementioned 993 gathering, another RLers took my car out to try out the suspension. His being a M029 US suspension with Monroe shocks, and mind being an M030 suspension, corner balanced and aligned for aggressive driving. Not quite RS settings however.

The difference was night and day, even though both of our cars are 96 C2 cars.

I suspect the same is true of 997s in that many have individualized their suspensions to handle the way they want them to. Tis one of. The fantastic things about Porsches, is that there is a range of suspension adjustments and parts available to personalize the handling characteristics to your own needs/desires.

You really can't go wrong with either car. I am not sure why there a number of comments regarding cost of ownership, most of my 993 expenses are performance related, and less maintenance. In the last year, all I did was an oil change, $328, registration, $200, rear tires, $375, and smog $68 as far as maintenance.

Performance wise I did WEVO motor mounts & row turbo sway bars.

I do not drive my 993 daily however, since I work at home. Actually I hardly drive at all these days. There are a lot of 993 s that are driven daily however.

The 993 guys are a great bunch, As are the 997 guys here, like I said before, you really can't go wrong either way.

Good luck

Sorry, I am probably not making this any easier for you to make a decision. But I will offer this, if you would like to drive a well set up 993, you are welcome to drive my car.

USMC_DS1

Kika, +993... a great fellow enthusiast. Wish I had driven your gorgeous 993 during our meet with Uncle Tom. I love my 997 but I wonder at times if a 993 would have served just as well to put grins on my face after a hill country run. Sounds like you guys have a great time DIYing the service and maintenance on your cars. Another thing we share in common.

Kika

Next time you are out this way, give me a call. I am sure we can arrange something.

lordsinclair

Hey Kika thanks for the offer- very cool. Yeah I'm still pondering but no stress, good decision to have to make in life! Meantime enjoying the opinions of you addicts!

Kika

!!!! There are certainly worse problems in life to have than which 911 to buy.

slicky rick

Totally true...like wanting a 911 and not able to buy it.

lbastie

I had a 993 targa, which was great, all black. Though, I sold it to buy a big car for my wife and the kids. I missed it so much. In the end I came back to Porsche, and after some research opted for a 997.1 C4. I am so in love with the car. I don't remember being so excited with the 993. Honestly, the 993 felt more like a car from the early eighties. the 997 is a modern car. It has the beauty of the 911, and a very refined interior. it feels straight on the road.

dtm407

I'll repeat what i said in the past when a similar question was posted:

My purchase of a 993 is not the usual path.
Purchased a 997S (first porsche was a rs america that was a victim to no back seat a small children). Restarted DEing in the 997S-I was hooked again.
Realized that i was going to trash my 997S doing track events.
Decided this time around I would invest my money in professional instruction rather than upgrades to the car
Found a professional instructor and said "find me a car"
Was told " the 993 has the advanced suspension and not enough power to get yourself in trouble
(found out later that most crashes at the track were with GT3's, vettes, cobra's etc- guys with more money than talent-IOW cars with too much HP vs driver talent)
Bought a track 993-monoballs, cage, brakes, suspension etc for 40 cents on the dollar
The initial plan was that the 993 would be a transitional car-IOW don't get emotionally attached to it.
Learned to drive via the 993-jokingly called the miata of porsches.
Started kicking GT3's, vettes,. cobras, 997s's asses at the track-hmmm(maybe the most important upgrade is between the steering wheel and the seat)
Got emotionally attached to the 993- named her "rudaba"
Got into racing
Everyone at the race shop likes rudaba-tracks like a train on rails (this is from a guy who has driven and won the rolex 24)
Realized that the 997s felt like a lexus(the ultimate put down)-felt detached from the road compared to the 993.
Sold the 997s
bought a 993 and installed a short box transmission
lived happily ever after.


doug

Cowhorn

I'll second one of each!

callipygian 911

I know this thread is a little old now, but after reading this I couldn't help myself:

And you'd be dead wrong. I quote Falcondrvr: "I just sold my 180,000 mile 993 for mid-high $30s. Engine has never been apart. Keep ahead of the maintenance items and fix anything that looks like it might be getting worn."

Source:

https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...le-engine.html

Also, I've dalied my 993 for 3 years and it's been an easy and enjoyable experience. No problems through heavy SoCal traffic. I wouldn't want to do it in Phoenix or LA without upgrading the AC with some tech from Grifiths, a very sensible mod.

I'd also suggest that a 993 is much cheaper to maintain than a newer 911 with an expired warranty. The car is mechanical and far simpler to diagnose and repair than a 997 or 991, which are burdened with dozens if not hundreds of computer controlled parts. You think those will be trivial to repair?

If the power to weight ratio isn't enough for you, there are many paths to making the 993 perform competitively with newer 911s. My 993 is incredibly quick (see my signature). I purchased my car and performed these mods for less the cost than a new base model Carrera. Just this week, KaiB raced against 997s and dominated.

I quote: "Seems our boys put on a show in a car neither had seen, much less driven until the day of the endure.

Best lap time is better than MANY of the 6 and 7Cups. Won GT4!!!

14 #751 M. WHYMAN / J. GAMROTH GT4
Laps Total Time Best Lap Best Time Diff Gap
GT 96 993

38 01:31:45.215 16 01:59.790 1.400
SILVER"

Source:

https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...ebuild-20.html

Just some food for thought, guys.

PS I'm the guy that Kika mentioned earlier, the one that drove his car and was impressed with the difference in suspension. I've since upgraded my suspension ... and a bit more. Kika is a classy guy, no doubt.

MJBird993

I wrote:
---Quote (Originally by MJBird993)---
And I disagree with the comments that 993s will continue to go up in price. Especially a high mileage driver. No one wants to pay $30K for a 16 year-old car with 180,000 miles on it.
---End Quote---

I stand corrected. Absolutely flummoxed, and corrected.

That's just nutty. I'm sorry, but I think it's totally nutty to spend $35K on a car that old with that many miles. I'll also suggest that it was better maintained than the average 993. The last one I looked at needed paint, the SRS light was on, it needed a new clutch and at $28K I passed on it. Maybe I shouldn't have. I bought a 997 instead, and sold it after 5 months.

But I don't think the OP was asking between a 993 and 997 as an investment, rather as a car to use. As an investment, no question the 993 is a superior choice.

Chris W. - '96 Targa

I dunno. I daily drove my 993 Targa for 10 years and 105k miles before selling it and getting the 997. Over the 10 years I owned the 993, I averaged $3.5k/year in routine maintenance (tires included).

I've been driving the 997 daily now for 2.5 years and 25k miles (now has 53k on the clock). I enjoyed the 993, and also enjoy the 997. The 997 has, so far, only needed about $2k in maintenance (tires included), and never had any warranty issues.

I know the 993 values have gone up since I sold mine, but I have no regrets. I'm glad to see the values going up on all of the cars. And, now that you can't get a stick in the GT3 or Turbo, it should [eventually] help the values of our manual 997s too.

For me, I just drive it and enjoy it.



-Chris

9114Scab

I am obviously the minority on this point.

I would rather have a 997 over a 993, any day of the week.

poparelly

Can you help me understand why the 993 needed $3.5k per year in maintenance? New tires and brakes every year? I have a 997.1 C4S cab, and the maintenance is very reasonable, but I only drive about 3500 miles per year in my 911. I have a truck for most work days (I own a construction company).

callipygian 911

Even though 100k on the clock versus 25k on the clock isn't an apples to apples comparison for maintenance, $3500/year seems extremely on the high side if we're talking about averages, here. The engines are bulletproof, my clutches can last a very long time ... what the hell were you doing to that car??? Were you tracking it? My costs were half that.

I also dailied a 1984 Carrera for about 10 years, and the running costs of my 993 seem about comparable, right around $1500/year with the occasional bump every few years. Then again, I'm not a guy who tends to thrash cars. I drive them hard, I just don't abuse the gearbox and clutch. I never had to change the clutch in my 84. When Gamroth took apart my 993 G50, he remarked that it looked like a new transmission from the internals.

Of course, after this past year, I've destroyed my average 993 expenditures, but what I did wasn't exactly routine maintenance.

I agree about 997s rising in value due to the scarcity of the manual transmission, especially anything with a rebuildable engine (read: Mezger). This is good news. I hope I can get a 997 GT3 at the bottom of the depreciation curve ...