mdrobc1213

Okay buddy of mine sent me this clip (tried to embed it) from the Nürburgring showing some driver's previous misfortunes there.

Am curious as to the following:

• Do any of you track your Porsche or other cars?
• If any of you have driven the Ring before? If so your impressions?
• Thoughts of the best car for the Ring? Porsche? 911? ect? (I'd think a small mid-engine car like the Cayman would do best!)
• Which turn is this that they keep showing repeatedly? It seems to eat all kinds of cars and drivers alike?
• Is it just me or are there alot of Porsche's crashing? Why? (probably more p-car drivers there running the track likely)

Am sure most of you are aware that you can drive the Ring yourself in your own car if ever in Germany or that some select rentals (I think at the track) will let you do so also. Have been there myself in 09 while on deployment but didn't get to drive the track as it was winter, snowing, and nighttime when I visited. But I DID leave with parting gifts and it IS still on my bucket list if/when I am ever back in Germany again especially if I have my car. Enclosed a few pics from my winter travel to the driving mecca of many! Enjoy

MD

Also for those interested in the Ring here's their website.
http://www.nuerburgring.de/en/servic...not-found.html

http://youtu.be/O2bZWQNbCN4

Section8

I don't own a P car yet, but I have been doing track events in my 93 RX7 or my wife's RX8 since 2005. I drove the 'Ring last year in May, rented a 99 M3 from rent2drive.de (http://www.hausmarvin.de/rent2drive/preise.php) I met up with a friend from Belgium that has around 250 laps or so under his belt at the 'ring as well as some personal instruction from Nissan GTR test drivers. He led me through a few laps in his car with me riding shotgun before I got into my rental car, where he rode with me to give me pointers. Even though i had a lot of track experience, I would still highly advise anyone to try and get instruction before driving the track no matter how much track driving you have done. There are at least 120 turns and it is impossible to remember them all, even if you have driven the track on something like GT5. GT5 also doesn't convey the massive elevation and camber changes on the track.

The turn you see so many cars going off on in that video is Brunnchen i believe, there is a large spectator area there so lots of video gets taken. I only did about 6 laps total when I was there, and every single lap there was at least 1 car in the armco barrier, and usually a high dollar car (specifically Bergwerk)

I did notice a nigh number of P cars off when I was there. I can't begin to explain why.

As for the best car - the best car for the 'ring is the one you are in. Nothing compares to driving there, even slowly. Learn the track, learn your own limits, and learn whatever car you have and you will have fun there.

Mike in CA

I agree completely with Section8's observations. I was there in '99 in my new tourist delivery 996. It was near the end of the trip so the car had about 1800 miles on it and was pretty well broken in. I also did 6 laps, one with my wife in the car (that was enough for her), and 5 on my own. I wouldn't worry too much about what car you're driving since if it's capable of any reasonable speed at all you won't be at it's limit anyway unless you are either very highly skilled or insane. There's just no way to learn the Ring in a few laps and you can see the results in the video of what happens if you don't show it proper respect.

Arrange a ride on the Ring Taxi or similar, get some instruction if possible, and when you go out on your own take the track at 8/10's and stay within your limits. You'll pass a few cars, get passed by many more (including plenty of motorcycles) but you'll make it back in one piece with an experience you won't forget.

alexb76

I was at the Ring this summer, Ring Taxi is NOT running anymore, PLUS, NO instructors are allowed to sit in with you ANYMORE. This is all due to to leasing the track to a new private company who's putting these rules in, and are forcing folks to only work with the *official* Ring instructors (at triple the cost).

I've NEVER tracked my P-car as I never shipped it to DE, BUT, have rented from Ring4Rent, and have enjoyed those cars immensely. I HIGHLY recommend just to rent a car from these guys, don't have to go crazy, I managed 10min laps with Stage-2 Suzuki, and dropped it to under 10mins after some practice. That car is INSANE, it's not that fast from standing still, but it's got sooo much GO in high RPM revs, and handling is absolutely 100% dialed-in. I was much faster in corners than many 997s actually!

http://www.rent4ring.de/en/info/index.html

This is BY FAR, the BEST, and SAFEST way to learn the Ring, and most economical. However, if I had a European delivery, and just picked up a 911 there, would DEFINITELY take the car there for a few laps, specially now that I've got some laps under the belt.

Mike in CA

Interesting, as the BMW Ring Taxi site appears to be fully up and working, although they are apparently at the present time fully booked; quite different from "NOT running anymore".

http://www.bmw-motorsport.com/ms_en/...axi_experience

Also, are you saying that passengers are no longer allowed? Seems to me that's the only way anyone could prevent you from riding as a passenger with someone who knows the course, or taking someone along who could provide advice (instruction). Unless they climb into the car with you wearing a big "I'm an Instructor" sign I don't see how anyone could restrict you, regardless of what the new "rules" are. Maybe you could clarify.

alexb76

Well, I am not sure HOW you figure out it's still going on? Here's what it says when you look at dates:

I think they are maybe accomodating people who PAID in the past. This is all new... they may have specific dates reserved (see below). Above was available ALL the time in the last couple of years I visited Ring.

Although things might have changed since July... BUT, basically the folks who you could rent cars from in the past (RSS, Rent4Ring, etc), WERE NOT allowed to have anyone sit with you, OR, to drive in front of you teaching you the right lines, NOR you could do the Ring Taxi on *regular days*. This was as-of July 2011.

You could have regular passengers no problem. But track owners KNOW the rental companies ppl so if they saw them, they'd stop you going through the gate. They were ALL VERY UPSET at this and said business has been down significantly due to these restrictions.

My first session in 2009, I paid one of the Rent4Ring racers to sit next to me and walk me through the track while I drove. I also had the option to pay for him to drive in front of me and to follow his line. This is NOT POSSIBLE anymore, at least NOT during regular days.

The changes (as of July) was:
- Only open to public on Weekends, and on Weekday AFTER 5pm (not the case before)
- Only Official Ring owners (forgot the name) can provide instruction or Taxi
- The ONLY exception to above, was EXCLUSIVE DAYS when those companies rented the whole Ring for a day, for instacne, Ring4Rent had an exclusive day on Sep. 27 where you signed up and had the whole track to yourself and you could do anything you wanted. BMW must have some dates reserved as well for people who booked Taxi in the past.

Basically, it's a lot harder/more expensive to enjoy the Ring than in the past years... which is a shame!

Alan Smithee

The BMW Ring Taxi crashed yesterday...

http://www.autoevolution.com/news/nu...ved-39230.html

alexb76

Another STUPID British driver... they are MENACE on the track.. specially the stupid Motorbikes. I actually have a footage of a bike crashing RIGHT in front of me on video, I heard he had severe injuries and some rumors he died! They closed the track after that accident!

Mike in CA

Because they are still providing rides and have an active website? Because they offer to e-mail you as soon as more tickets are available? Edit: Because apparently a Ring Taxi crashed yesterday?

I assumed that they were booked so far in advance that they were no longer taking reservations at this time. Could be WRONG, though.

Where there's a will, there's a way. Perhaps take Walter Rohrl along in disguise as your brother/father/uncle/friend? Seriously, though, it sounds far more restrictive in all respects than when I was there 10+ years ago. A shame indeed.

alexb76

Yes, it is a shame indeed... all this is new in 2011. I see Ring Taxi is active, maybe they paid something to get special treatment since July, or maybe they only go on weekends. I know for sure I couldn't book on one a weekday, again in July.

markiii

ring taxi is now run by a different company using 3 series rather than 5 series

your both right

it was canned,

they awarded it to someone else and restarted it. Rumour has it the new drivers are nowhere as experienced

no more Sabine in the ring Taxis either

alexb76

Ok, that makes more sense, thanks for correction... that also explains why they just crashed last week! Sabine wouldn't have crashed that easily...

GrahamML

There is certainly quite a bit of good wisdom and insight to the Ring mentioned in these posts. Driving at 8/10's of your ability is one of the most practical pieces of advice. None of us, no matter how good we are or think we are will put enough laps in to 'learn' the ring - particularly with the constant changing weather. My last laps there over the summer I went through two rain showers and two sun filled areas on the same lap.

As for risk - if you stay within the 8/10's of your ability, your biggest risk is other drivers making mistakes. Look back to the video and see how many caught accidents in their camera by the car who just passed them. Or, how many got wrapped in to an accident by the cars around them.

If you go, weekends are for watching and taking video and weekdays are for driving. If you get in congestion, back out and whatever you do, don't clock your time and try to get under 10 or 9 min - it is not worth the insurance hassle for your rental.

Minok

That corner is known to be hard / deceptive... its got a good run-up and folks just overcook it because you cannot see its tighter/slower until you are too far in.. and the Nordschleife has a lot of turns to remember.

The fact that the guardrail is set back several meters with a gravel trap in front is a clear sign that corner is known to eat vehicles.

It looks like several of the crashes appear to be from drivers letting off the gas and the weight transfer in the car is pushing them out of stability.

I think the Nordschleife is just a public road right? Its a one-way toll road.. you pay our toll, and in you go.