OT: NEW VW Beetle - Baby Porsche?
04-19-2011, 02:48 AM
#16
Rennlist Member
The 2011 Jetta is a TOTALLY CHEAPENED OUT VERSION of Golf, MEANT for NA market only, to compete with Corolla, Civic, GM cars by having the same price point, hence lower in quality and made in Mexico/Brazil ONLY.
The Golf, GTI, or Tiguan are on the other hand European made cars and WAY BETTER CARS, however, they're a few thousands more.
VW actually is a GREAT car for what it is, if I wanted to buy a small sized car, Golf or GTI are absolutely PERFECT. I had a MK4 GTI and it was one of the most fun cars I've ever owned!
The Golf, GTI, or Tiguan are on the other hand European made cars and WAY BETTER CARS, however, they're a few thousands more.
VW actually is a GREAT car for what it is, if I wanted to buy a small sized car, Golf or GTI are absolutely PERFECT. I had a MK4 GTI and it was one of the most fun cars I've ever owned!
Problem is, the 2011 Jetta is just the beginning. Where do you think this Beetle will be built? Right alongside, with the next gen Golf to follow. The US-made Passat is also being designed to be built for a price with only volume in mind.
VW used to be a great car as a low-priced alternative to the Japanese and American brands (which is why I requested my third Jetta). No longer.
04-19-2011, 03:20 AM
#17
Rennlist Member
Looks more like on of the old "Things"!.
04-19-2011, 04:37 AM
#18
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I cannot begin to explain what a POS the 2011 Jetta is. It is truly the worst new car I have driven in recent memory, and I spend a lot of time in rental cars. I've never driven a car with such a soft suspension, yet with poor ride quality. The body not just creaks, but cracks on its bump stops over every medium-sized pothole. And this with tall, high-profile tires. Don't get me started on the interior. The 2.5 was never great, but compared to other modern small car powerplants in 2011, it sounds positively agricultural. And it will continue to be used in the 2012 Beetle (along with the twist-beam rear axle).
Problem is, the 2011 Jetta is just the beginning. Where do you think this Beetle will be built? Right alongside, with the next gen Golf to follow. The US-made Passat is also being designed to be built for a price with only volume in mind.
VW used to be a great car as a low-priced alternative to the Japanese and American brands (which is why I requested my third Jetta). No longer.
Problem is, the 2011 Jetta is just the beginning. Where do you think this Beetle will be built? Right alongside, with the next gen Golf to follow. The US-made Passat is also being designed to be built for a price with only volume in mind.
VW used to be a great car as a low-priced alternative to the Japanese and American brands (which is why I requested my third Jetta). No longer.
Before, Jetta, Golf and GTI were pretty much the same, just different options and GTI had better engine/suspension... now Jetta is literally a different car, for instance while Golf/GTI have independant rear suspension, the 2011 Jetta has torsion-beam axle rear suspsion, etc.. Check out the comparison pics here... you'd see that even DOOR HANDLES are different!
http://autos.msn.com/research/compar...lf&year2=2011#
However, the Jetta in EU is a different story
Our initial opinion of the 2011 Volkswagen Jetta went something like this; nice enough vehicle that still outpaces the Toyota Corolla and Honda Civic, but the cost-cutting is evident. Soft touch materials have been replaced with harder plastics that don't feel particularly good and almost look as bad. But the U.S. Jetta starts at a class-competitive $15,995, and chopping thousands off of an MSRP doesn't come without sacrifices. But will these cost-cutting measures fly in Europe, where a higher premium is placed on an upscale interior and sporting characteristics?
Fortunately for the folks overseas, they apparently won't have to worry about it. Automotive News reports that the Euro Jetta, which launches in March 2011, will feature a more upscale interior and a four-link independent rear suspension instead of the lower cost 'built for comfort' beam axle setup we have in the U.S.-spec sedan. VW development chief Ulrich Hackenberg says the Jetta will be fitted with "higher value" materials like soft-touch panels and upgraded build materials.
Before you get the urge to bemoan the fact that the Euro Jetta will be better than the one we have here, keep in mind that increased luxury comes with a higher price tag. The Euro Jetta will start at €20,900 ($28,941 U.S.) and head all the way up to €29,950 ($41,473 U.S.) in Highline trim.
Fortunately for the folks overseas, they apparently won't have to worry about it. Automotive News reports that the Euro Jetta, which launches in March 2011, will feature a more upscale interior and a four-link independent rear suspension instead of the lower cost 'built for comfort' beam axle setup we have in the U.S.-spec sedan. VW development chief Ulrich Hackenberg says the Jetta will be fitted with "higher value" materials like soft-touch panels and upgraded build materials.
Before you get the urge to bemoan the fact that the Euro Jetta will be better than the one we have here, keep in mind that increased luxury comes with a higher price tag. The Euro Jetta will start at €20,900 ($28,941 U.S.) and head all the way up to €29,950 ($41,473 U.S.) in Highline trim.
04-19-2011, 09:46 AM
#19
Rennlist Member
04-19-2011, 12:09 PM
#21
Rennlist Member
Yeah but its not just about WHERE it is made, all other VW cars are made all over the world the same way, with the pretty much the same parts... however, 2011 Jetta is made intentionally with cheaper parts and material and only in lower cost manufacturing countries. I bet Beetle will be built with higher quality material similar to GTI, as it's a more premium car.
Before, Jetta, Golf and GTI were pretty much the same, just different options and GTI had better engine/suspension... now Jetta is literally a different car, for instance while Golf/GTI have independant rear suspension, the 2011 Jetta has torsion-beam axle rear suspsion, etc.. Check out the comparison pics here... you'd see that even DOOR HANDLES are different!
However, the Jetta in EU is a different story
Before, Jetta, Golf and GTI were pretty much the same, just different options and GTI had better engine/suspension... now Jetta is literally a different car, for instance while Golf/GTI have independant rear suspension, the 2011 Jetta has torsion-beam axle rear suspsion, etc.. Check out the comparison pics here... you'd see that even DOOR HANDLES are different!
However, the Jetta in EU is a different story
Yes, the current (and outgoing) Golf still has the independent rear suspension. As I mentioned in the previous post, the Beetle shares the cheap, crappy suspension and drivetrain with the Jetta. You can bet the next gen Golf will as well. These are the cars intended to be volume sellers and built to a price, not the European made GTI/GLI models. They are crap, and along with historically mediocre (to be generous) quality ratings, will do nothing to sway buyers from the new Focus (hecho en Mexico asi), Cruze, Hyundai/Kia models, upcoming Civic, Corollas, etc.
04-19-2011, 08:44 PM
#22
Burning Brakes
I must be out of step because I liked it. The red one would be a great little errand car. I think it has character and it would be nice to own a car you can park anywhere.
04-19-2011, 08:54 PM
#23
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Agreed that VW can easily fall into the GM trap of too many brands and too little quality. That said, VW at the moment is more similar to GM in the 50's than GM fifty years later. Most of VW's North American brands are doing pretty well. And while the VW brand itself has had cars of questionable quality in the early noughties, the current cars (as a whole) are much better.
I myself have a fully optioned 2010 GTI DSG since new; it's an absolute hoot to drive. I love it -so much, that I ask myself if I really need a weekend car such as my Porsche. The answer is 'yes,' of course, but I'm impressed by the fact that the GTI driving experience makes me ponder that thought.
An aside, the VW dealerships are certainly playing catch-up to VDub car quality, at least in the area where I live, Northern California.
And yes, add me to the individuals who see a German version of the PT Cruiser in the new New Beetle. Hope the revised version fixes that problem!!
I myself have a fully optioned 2010 GTI DSG since new; it's an absolute hoot to drive. I love it -so much, that I ask myself if I really need a weekend car such as my Porsche. The answer is 'yes,' of course, but I'm impressed by the fact that the GTI driving experience makes me ponder that thought.
An aside, the VW dealerships are certainly playing catch-up to VDub car quality, at least in the area where I live, Northern California.
And yes, add me to the individuals who see a German version of the PT Cruiser in the new New Beetle. Hope the revised version fixes that problem!!
04-20-2011, 02:23 PM
#24
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I think they're after the market of the Mini.
That's what they make the new Beetle sportier.
Not sure there is a reference to Porsche. The turbo aims to become the new Cooper. VW hates to see this market go to BMW.
That's what they make the new Beetle sportier.
Not sure there is a reference to Porsche. The turbo aims to become the new Cooper. VW hates to see this market go to BMW.
04-20-2011, 03:10 PM
#25
Race Director
its certainly more masculine and the previous model. I sure hope they offer an off road model w/ huge nobby tires. The as campaign could be- " GIant Bettle, the Raptor killer."
04-20-2011, 04:43 PM
#26
Rennlist Member
i bought my 17 year old daughter a 2010 'Final Edition' New Beetle last August, as her first car. It's been wonderful, and the car is just absolutely perfect. I think this new Beetle will be a worthy successor.
I am amazed how many of the new Jettas I see around my town in South Texas. At the gym last night alone, I counted 5 in the parking lot - most with the dealer tags still on - 1 in what looked like what Porsche calls 'Macadamia metallic.'
I am amazed how many of the new Jettas I see around my town in South Texas. At the gym last night alone, I counted 5 in the parking lot - most with the dealer tags still on - 1 in what looked like what Porsche calls 'Macadamia metallic.'
04-22-2011, 10:14 PM
#27
Drifting
The new Beetle is finally unveilved (in China of all places!)... Some resemblance to Porsche IMO (look at the rear spoiler!)... what do you guys think?
http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/n...tle-2011-04-18
http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/n...tle-2011-04-18
I'm not sure about it... it looses some of the cute/quaint ness of the New Beetle generation, and looks more car like.. but then its really so much like a Golf that it begs the question, why are you not buying a Golf? All you get is an engine bay thats much harder to work in because of the front-end styling, less storage due to the hatch design and roofline, and now, I'm guessing, less of that expansive interior space that was so remarkable about the New Beetle.
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04-22-2011, 10:17 PM
#28
Drifting
Audi A3 isn't available in the engine-trans config I want, and the Golf looks like pants from the back-end. Whats a guy to do.
04-25-2011, 09:34 PM
#30
Rennlist Member
I really liked my 00 turbo beetle. The only problem I had was the right hand headlight bulb was always burning out. I'm sure I will like the new new beetle when I see it.
Last edited by ecostellodo; 04-25-2011 at 10:50 PM.