When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
It seems to be impossible to get any comments on this product. I'm surprised, as it's 1/2 the price of the Sharkwerks or AWE - you would think SOMEONE would have tried it.
I tried a xover pipe, then went to agency power xover and muffler system, I paid about 1300. on ebay. Bigger improvement with the free flow mufflers. and very good sound.
I just posted this in the Gundo thread in response to Dan from Sharkwerks:
I have nothing bad to say about Sharkwerks or your products and appreciate the support your company provides to the Porsche community. However, in response to your post, I will offer my thoughts/opinions.
I ordered from Jegs where the B&B is $573 shipped all day long. Same thing from LMperformance. If I were patient I probably could've gotten it cheaper.
I don't know if anyone copied anyone but I will agree that the systems look really similar. However, if you are trying to make pipes that replace the third muffler on 997.2, I am not sure there are many ways to go about it.
Tbh I agonized over whether it was worth the extra money to buy your product since both designs are essentially two metal pipes welded together. Either way you go is expensive with that in mind but I understand these are not Camaro exhausts and that as a result there is always some form of Porsche tax.
Regardless, I decided to take the chance on the B&B because it was cheaper and because I have had good experiences with their exhaust products in the past. Furthermore, if you compare the two designs, I felt that the B&B design took a slightly more direct path when you compare the manner in which, on the Sharkwerks, the pipe that comes off the driver's side cat seems to snake behind the other pipe before coming forward to connect to the passenger side muffler. However, it might simply be the angle of the picture on the Sharkwerks website vs the B&B picture. However, the routing is definitely different between the two designs if you compare the two. I felt the B&B routing was/is better. No idea if it actually is. I also liked that the B&B uses larger diameter pipe. This is clearly evident in the pictures. However, upon installation it ended up not mattering since both designs have to drop down to the same size to be slid inside the clamp that connects the pipe to the muffler. I don't have the Sharkwerks but I have obviously seen pictures and it seems as though it is a uniform pipe width throughout whereas the B&B is larger for the most part but then reduces down to fit inside the aforementioned clamp.
I was very concerned about the PSE clearance as I have PSE cans tbh as the pictures do make it look like it has less clearance than your design. However, they clear the PSE pipes that go into the dual exhaust tips just fine. I was worried it would rub or rattle if it fit at all but actually I had plenty of clearance.
You are correct that it floats and does not mount to the stock third muffler support. I did not like this but upon installation it seems quite solid and I have not had any unwanted vibrations or anything of that nature. At first I believed this was not preferable to the Sharkwerks design and time will tell if this is true. However, a potential unintended benefit is that some Sharkwerks installs on PSE cars will cause the vibration at idle that I have read so much about. My understanding is that it comes from this mounting point. With this mounting point removed from the equation, I have experienced no odd vibration at idle that was not present prior to the install. Time will tell whether this extra support is needed.
I will say that the installation instructions with the product were nonexistent which was disappointing but not entirely surprising given the price. The finish of the product as far as welds go and whatnot seemed quite good but the fit was pretty good but not great. I could not get the clamps that mate the pipes to the mufflers to line up quite right and as a result I have a very small exhaust leak from the clamps in which a small amount of water will leak out of the end of the clamp on cold start indicating a small leak. It does not cause an increase in sound as it is incredibly tiny but it still bothered me because, as you can tell from the several paragraphs I have written already about bypass pipes, I tend to obsess about things. I will say that the fault may not have been with the product, it may have been my install as I could not be more amateur in my mechanic skills. However, nothing I could do as far as realigning the exhaust could stop the small leak so I left it. Fwiw, others with Sharkwerks brand pipes have posted about the same thing so it certainly could be the install.
In summation, I have no doubt that the Sharkwerks are an excellent, and perhaps even better product than the B&B, which is/was rough around the edges in several areas. However, I could not justify the price delta between the two products to get an equivalent (or perhaps just slightly better) product.
Thanks Phaphaphooey, I had also sent a PM to Alex asking him to explain what the advantages of the SW product are. Actually, you can get the BB from Jegs for ~$520 shipped, as there are 10% off coupon codes floating around everywhere.
Did the B&B come with any gaskets or hardware? Is there anything you recommend buying?
Thanks
OKB, thank you for your response... but it would be great if you could post some detailed videos on the AP product. Any chance you can do that?
I bought the B&B around Christmas and couldn't find any codes at the time. As Dan notes, it does come with gaskets, longer bolts, and new nuts for the cat bolts.
Do the gundo first, if I were to do it again, that alone would be enough for me
I already have the gundo and I love it. Would this make the exhaust significantly louder or add any drone?
I like the weight savings and maybe the added performance but I don't need it to be any louder. Thanks
I also decided to order the B&B instead of the sharkwerks because of price. Stupid me paid ~$750 from vivid racing. Didn't know Jegs sold B&B at such a discount.
I have a GTS with PSE, and could not get the pipe to fit. I even took the bumper off so I could get to the cat/muffler hangers. No matter what I did the left side pipe would hit hard on the 2nd pipe from the PSE mufflers.
So, I requested a return authorization, that took 2 weeks to get, then I was told there would be a 10% re-stocking fee, which pissed me off. Finally sent it back to them and am STILL waiting on a refund.
In the first pic you can see how far off the muffler pipes are from centered in the opening. 2nd pic you can see the PSE pipe hitting hard on the crossover pipe.
The stock muffler & the sharkwerks pipe both use a larger radius bend to get around the protrusion on the left side of the motor. You can see that the small bend->straight->bend causes the interference.
Below is how far off the crossover pipe is from the left muffler. The clamp is almost completely off the muffler pipe, and is mis-aligned by over 1/2"
I will be purchasing the sharkwerks pipe if I ever get my money back from Vivid.
04-15-2011, 10:18 AM
