Harvey in FL

From autoblog......

Thus, in the wake of recent allegations of unintended acceleration in Toyota vehicles, a movement has begun to equip all cars with black box data recorders.

Representative Gene Green (D-TX) has already introduced legislation that would mandate the installation of such event data recorders, or black boxes, in all new vehicles.

alexb76

BIG BROTHER in our cars...

This whole Toyota investigation is A JOKE! One guy was asking Toyoda to guarantee that his Camry won't have a recall in 10 years!!!

I am actually not sure what's behind all this Toyota bashing... I understand the need to beat em up to benefit of Ford/GM, but it's gone soo far, I am suspecting maybe there's some other hidden agenda (black box), that's driving some of this madness.

LlBr

ALERT

Say I'm driving frisky, that is, speeding "safely" up until an animal jumps out and then I crash the car. While waiting for help to arrive How do I destroy the current black box that's in our cars so the cop can't nail me for going 100mph?

Edgy01

I'm sure they'll make the black boxes out of indestructible material and place them securely at the base of the empennage to assure survival. (Oops--that's an aircraft!)

MJones

We already have recorders and have for quite some time....but only Porsche can access the recording...

stubenhocker

The tyranny of technology!

ADias

Two items behind the Toyota crucifixion: Government Motors and the Unions.

alexb76

Most probably! It's actually interesting that there's a conflict of interest when US Government questions a Japanese car manufacturer, as they are part owner of GM! It's like Porsche interviewing Ferrari about their safety record...

But there are congressman from the states that makes Toyota, I don't understand how come they don't come to their defence?!

Mike in CA

I consider this political pandering and due to cost and other issues, hopefully it will fail.....

LlBr

I heard the current Porsche black box is under one of the seats and can be "neutralized" by the owner if necessary. Theory is that the seat will survive a crash, or at least will be one of the last things to be completely destroyed.

Again, I don't want to "self-incriminate" if I do something stupid and crash my car.

Macster

If you're driving over the limit where animals can enter the road then you're not speeding "safely".

The current black box saves around 5 seconds of data. The oldest data is constantly overwritten with the newest data.

Just a handful of data items saved (though this will undoubtly go up as time goes by): speed, seat occupancy, seat belt usage, brake pedal useage, throttle, door lock states, and some info related to PSM and such.

Mainy this info collected to monitor the performance (or not as the case may be) of the airbags, safety restraint systems, and more recently stability control management software.

If the device destroyed it clearly won't reflect well on your claim you were not driving unsafely. I'm not a lawyer but have spoken with a few and generally they tell me the courts do not look favorably upon a defendant or plantiff that destroys evidence that could clear him in the case of a defendant or make his bolster his case for him if he's the plaintiff.

Besides I know of as least one situation - terrible terrible multicar accident -- in which had the data logging device (aftermarket and one I'm intimately familiar with) been installed when it should have been -- it was left uninstalled by the driver -- just an oversight by the driver nothing sinsiter -- it would have cleared him of responsibility for a serious injury sustained by another person in another vehicle. As it was without the device and its data, the driver claimed he was innocent of his vehicle striking the vehicle in front of him, but it was his word against the driver of the vehicle which was probably at fault. A huge injury award was at stake one that could affect an individual for years afterwards or raise all kinds of heck with a business if the driver had been driving a commercial vehicle.

More direct experience: I was involved in two accidents last year. In the first my Boxster was struck from behind while stopped at a stop light. My data logger (black make that blue box actually) data showed my car was stopped at the time of impact. The other driver did accept responsibility so I didn't need this data.

In the second accident my Cayman S was struck from the front passenger side by another car. The data showed my Cayman S was barely moving as I was slowly advancing to make a right hand turn and was still several car lengths from the intersection.

Neither accident my fault.

But my insurance company expert tells me that more and more often the at fault driver will lie and deny and with no witnesses the case goes to arbitration. Arbitration cuts the baby in half and each driver's insurance is responsible for his driver's car and other damages.

Now in the case of my Boxster, that would have meant my insurance company was on the hook for nearly $6K to repair my Boxster and the other at fault driver's insurance company only responsible for just a few hundred dollars for damage to her vehicle.

In the case of my *new* Cayman S the car (25 days old) was declared a total loss and my insurance company would have been out over $60K while the other at fault driver's car (POS '89 Volvo) was relatively undamaged to the point she could drive it away from the accident after exchange of info. Didn't even smash a headlight. Was hanging from a wire and still on.

Thankfully there was a witness and with my pics taken right away of the scene the other driver's insurance company took responsibility and I didn't need the data logger's data collected at the time of the accident.

But it is nice to have it.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Bob Rouleau

I suspect JC Whitney will have a portable EMP device for those in need

aka_Sven

You are quite correct about there being serious repercussions where evidence is destroyed on purpose. Have a look at Wikipedia's explanation of "spoliation of evidence" (note spelling).

nyca

There is no stopping this, as many have said here - cars already have this, the issue is who has the right to access the data.

It's going to get really bad - it won't just be accidents in which injuries occur where this data will be obtained by the courts, eventually you'll see it make its way to civil cases for personal injury as well. Where you speeding? Or worse yet, maybe your braking reaction time as measured by the ECU could have been "better", and as such you injured my client's neck because you didn't slow down fast enough - etc, etc.

When you have a government that operates without any bounds, then anything is possible.

LlBr

Nah, while I'm bleeding and going into shock waiting for ambulance I will download the info from the black box and then erase the black box! It's MY information and I want to keep it safe. I can't help it if my laptop disappeared during the rescue effort and ambulance ride.

Now if somebody could just tell us how to pre-wire the black box so it can be erased while we're passing out from pain and blood loss..., that would be a good DIY hack!