Crazy Canuck

I've driven my 997s and 996 GT3 (no PSM) extensively on the track. I stand by what I said.

RonCT

Hobard,

From what you describe, your fun had nothing to do with PSM. For you to come out of a turn and hit the gas and have the car accelerate more quickly, something other than PSM being off had to be at work. PSM simply doesn't work that way. For PSM to even kick in, you have to be doing something horribly wrong - so wrong that the computer is convinced you are going to crash. For example, on the track, it basically never kicks in, even with me experiencing 20 degrees of yaw (meaning, tail is 20 degrees out of alignment with the front wheels).

It sounds like you are describing some sort of NOS, supercharger, turbo, afterburner, or some other feature. Press a button and the car has more performance. PSM is never on when you have been driving your car - it's in the background and will only actually engage if your car is sideways.

Maybe you are talking about the Sport Chrono button and not PSM? If so, it's still placebo because Sport doesn't actually change the performance / power of the car. It tricks you into thinking it does because it "shortens" the throttle position. For example, if for 50% throttle you needed to push the pedal 10mm, with sport on it will give you 50% throttle with 8mm pushed. The solution if you don't have sport chrono is to simply push the pedal that extra 2mm. One dealer tried to impress me during a test drive by pushing the sport button while we were just cruising along at say 50 MPH. He said "Now watch how much more powerful the car is when I press Sport". He pressed it and my foot didn't change position, so the throttle advanced. But the car was still making the same HP and torque.

Great to hear you are enjoying your car. Whatever it is that happened for you, keep doing it!

Edit - you posted while I was typing.

I've run my 07 C2S, my 07 GT3 (no PSM), and my 09 C2S on the track (thousands of track miles in the most advanced groups). With PSM on, With it off, Without it even being in the car. The performance is no different whatsoever.

Coochas

At PSDS you can take a hot lap with Hurley Haywood or any of the other fine instructors and PSM never (or very rarely) kicks in.
Their philosophy, which is the Porsche philosophy, is that if you are driving smoothly and properly PSM will not intervene. It truly is a Please Save Me in its current form.

Hockeyman11385

My father was lucky enough to get to do a hot lap with one of the instructors in the 997 GT3 at Barber when he attended the PSDS. He said that the instructor never touched the traction control and it never kicked in, even when going "flat out".

cello

This is spot on.

At Barber (PSDS), there is 'replica' of the L-S corkscrew. The top turn is at the end of a medium length straight. Speeds before the braking zone are ~100+ mph. Trail braking into the top sets one up for the middle section nicely by rotating the car without scrubbing too much speed. At no time did PSM engage - even when I felt some over-rotation (causing me to lighten the brake pressure to reign the rear in, or back to nuetral - more accurately). The Instructors flew thru the top section essentially turning the car on brakes initially. No PSM.

One has to "work at it" to get it to intervene, in my experience. Running with it off will not add performance (unless one is in a 'drifting' competiton, of course )

soltino

"Maybe you are talking about the Sport Chrono button and not PSM? If so, it's still placebo because Sport doesn't actually change the performance / power of the car. It tricks you into thinking it does because it "shortens" the throttle position."

Right, that's why i won't have a SSK. It just makes your shifts faster.


(-%

tino

ADias

RonCT and Coochas got it right as expected. {Irony hat on} But what's that about 'smooth driving'? Isn't driving sideways, wheel-spinning on the ragged edge, proper performance driving?

RonCT

SC doesn't make the car even a fraction faster, unless you think that the time to press the gas pedal 1 or 2 mm is measurable. Think about it, for me to press the gas that extra 1 or 2 mm is maybe 1 millionth of a second. Also, most trackers report that they bought SC thinking it would improve track driving and later discovered that the remap is worse on the track because it's jumpy, less linear than stock, etc. So in the end they don't put sport on for track driving.

Same goes for short shifters - I'll bet if you put even a pro driver into the same car with and without a SSK, the performance difference will be immeasurable. Similar to the gas pedal example above - we talking about 1 millionth of a second difference? But then again, one could argue that SSK reduces performance because of how stiff and unsmooth the shifting can be, as well as the potential for missing a shift. Many of the guys that track with me have debated and / or tried SSK and stuck with stock because there are times when it's just not smooth enough, such as when you are in pit lane waiting to go out and idling in neutral, get the signal and put it into 1st only to have it bounce back and then you muscle it into gear - having a rough 3/2 downshift. As everyone knows, smooth is fast on the track whether it's your line, throttle / brake transitions, steering input, up or down shifting, etc. I enjoyed the SSK that came stock on my 997.1 GT3, but it did have its downsides (cold performance in particular was terrible).

So, my 3rd 997 product in, and with my driving about 50/50 street vs. track, I avoided SC and SSK and am happy I did so. But there are practical dollars to spend on performance modifications, such as: Cup control arms and track-oriented alignment, wheels / tires, fluid and pads, Softronic software, and Sharkwerks primary bypass.

Sadiq

PSM off would make you either go the same speed or significantly slower than PSM on

russo

The thrill in not having the PSM engaged is when the car starts to go sideways its up to your driving talents to bring the car back. PSM will never allow you to experience that.

RonCT

Sure PSM will allow you to experience that - it happens to me every time I'm on the track. I've found after several thousand track miles that whether you turn it off or leave it on it simply is not a factor. I've been 20 degrees "sideways" without meaning to be at places like the top of the Esses at Watkins Glen at 110+ MPH on my way to 150 at the Bus Stop. Being Flat out at that transition at the top and having the weight shift and back end kick out, but then wrestle it gently back in is fun, but PSM simply doesn't get involved.

russo

That's funny, all PSM cars I have driven won't let you step out of line. Maybe I am confused with PASM?

RonCT

Maybe, but what vintage car have you driven where you feel PSM has gotten in the way? The early PSM is known to be intrusive, while the 2005-2008 is "invisible" and the 2009+ even more so.

JSeven

The car become a little more nervous with PSM off, specialy on slipery surfaces. The back end becomes more alive trying to get traction, at least thatīs what I feel on my 997.2 S PDK, and to have it slide the way I like it, only with PSM off is possible.

This PSM lets you play a little with the car, when itīs on, it only kicks when you are over the "rules". Itīs very well tuned I must say, but for pathetic fun that some of us like to have, only with it off is possible to have the beast throw at you. I love to drive with PSM off in the rain for instance in a safe enviroment. Sometimes before I get to a roundabout, I switch off PSM, make my "litlle" power slide, and them keep on my way with PSM on again.

Back in 1998 I use to have a 2.5L Boxster with turbo engine from TTP (German tuner) That car had a short 5 speed gearbox and not even a traction control, forget about PSM. It was maybe the most funny toy Iīve had till today for this kind of "nonsence to some of you", with 300 turbo horse power on a light chassi without TC, it was WOW,or UFFF all the time

J.Seven

996FourEss

have a look at the promo video on the Porsche website for the nwe GT3 RS, that is what happens when PSM is off and you take full use of it being off.........