The problem is, as you all know- *Consistantcy* amoungst the dealer network. One dealer quotes one rate, while the other quotes another. To put things into perspective, using this promotion from Porsche, it's actually very explainable.

One rate, is the "buy" rate that PFS sells the money to the dealership. We inturn are allowed to 'mark up' the rate by 1%. And 1% only.


What I've learned is that people, generally- do NOT have an issue with someone making money, let alone being successful. The issue is to use your word- transparency. Let's use another word "Integrty". Or, "honesty". Here's the rub; dealerships, not all- but many; think that if by 'giving you' the BUY rate; that you'll buy a car. Its the same mentality that Chrysler, and GM and any other manufactorer have by issuing you ALL sorts of cash back, incentives and rebates.

It's NOT about the money. It's about doing business with someone you trust. Why do people consistantly refer Doctors? Because they ((heres that word))

TRUST!! THEY TRUST THAT DOCTOR!!!! *shocker!!**

Meaning- that it's more important to a human to buy from another human whom they trust. It's that simple. Not the stupid 'buy' rate.


Same goes for Sales Professionals. Restuarants. House Cleaning Services. Lawn Care. ect ect. But more so when dealing with a 'negotiations' situation.

It F***ing pisses me off when I talk to a car salesman and they boast about doing 'x, y or z' to a client. - But trust me, their day is HERE and now. They're about to be served HUGE amounts of Karma, thank you very much.


And that's why I love doing what I do. Because it should be FUN, EASY and all about the CAR- not me. Not the negotiations. Not the dumb rate. Just deliver what I promise, and be open and honest. Does it sell a car each an every time? Certainly not. But it's the right thing to do. And it yeilds high levels of success.

So, with that- I understand the need to make sure you're getting a great deal. And I promise to deliver exactly what I've quoted you. No less.


We use the same analogy with clients who walk into a dealership- "Do people go to McDonalds and say "I'm just looking!" after they've ordered their food?"

Hellz no.

People go to a dealership because (big shocker) they WANT to buy a car. They walk out, generally because their fears have been validated, and/or insulted/ and/or just generally have a bad vibe.

You can do a smokey burn out on their front lawn with your shiney....new.....

 

I agree with the above three posters, just dont discount the car as much and give 2.9 %, and be honest about it. Integrity can make or break the dealer-customer relationship

 

Absolutely Doc. See my post above!

How about telling the client the whole truth and giving them a few scenarios to choose from?

Example: You could spend X on this scenario; we're selling the car for this OR you could spend Y, but the interest is less in this scenario OR you could take the cash back, but finance at a higher rate in this scenario.


Once things are plainly layed out- it's easy. Put the power of spending money in the clients hands. It's simple.

 

It would be nice if a doc could go into a grocery store, get any bill mortgage or not, buy a car etc and pay 1/3 of the bill like docs get reimbursed from insurance companies and medicare. Wonder if I can go out and eat and just tell them to bill me. Everything should be up front and transparent. It is hard at times to get that done with the dealer that Pdealer that I have done repeat business with for years.

 

Agree with a previous post that dealers (and their sales folks) should expect to make a reasonable return on their investment and services. Still, I don't think the doctor comparison holds true. I think selling cars, even Porsches, is more of a commodity business than medical services.

Having said this, the significant deterioration in the standard of care by doctors, owing in large part to modern day insurance reimbursement practices, makes me seriously question whether medicine is something more than a commodity. If I made my clients wait 45 minutes after their scheduled appointment in a waiting room with other sick people, and then another 15 minutes in an examination room, for 10 to, at best, 15 minutes of the doctor's time, I wouldn't be in business long.

 

well imagine how much better it will be if the current administration gets its way and negotiates prices downward for medical care....ooops not a political thread, my bad

 

Chris, I have to disagree with your logic here. It most certainly IS about the money; transparency about this is what builds trust for me and many others I know. I've sold in the past, so I understand why you bump points: it's one of the last few profit centers that many buyers aren't aware of. Even those shopping for $90k+ cars don't do their homework sometimes.

The doctor's office analogy and the supermarket analogy don't apply here. I'm paying my doctor for professional services rendered by her, with a reasonable expectation that her training and credentials ensure a safe and effective treatment. At my supermarket, I pay an acceptable price for a commodity good and am given choices in price and quality to suit my want. In both of these examples I'm the salesperson, educating and advising myself to a choice that suits me. My decisions are largely objective because I don't pay a commission to myself, other than what I might save by buying the store brand or choosing a doctor who accepts insurance instead of private pay.

At the dealership, I pay a premium for the convenience of test-drive, sales, financing and after-sales services. All of the sales department's services are rendered with no guarantee of minimum service or quality and are therefore mostly subjective. So, I want to know that I've priced your services according to what I think they're worth.

Without knowing both your invoice and buy rate, I can't do that. When I buy a house, I know what I'm paying my agent. If I sell my house, I know what I'm paying both agents. When I shop for anything over a few thousand dollars (i.e., a significant purchase for someone making less than seven figures a year), I want to know what the salesperson's load is so I can determine how much of their service I need and how much I want to pay for it. There's always someone willing to do it cheaper, and I can research on my own instead of relying on advice from someone who has a financial interest in my purchase decision.

I'm certainly not arguing that you don't deserve any money for the work you do. I'm arguing that there's a reason for the tradition of haggling when buying a car, and it's the subjectivity of what your services are worth to the buyer. Some value it more, some less. Wherever a buyer stands, it's in their interest to know exactly what they're paying for that value.

 

and one percent of a 35k bimmer is much less than 1% of a 95K car...

 

Sorry to disagree with you; but there is 'no' guarantee that I'll get my moneys worth at the Doctors office. It's subjective, and believe it not, even with car transactions, no 'two' individual car buying situations are exactly the same. Thus varied end results. Even knowing invoice and msrp and margins doesn't guarantee you of anything but - just knowing- what the margins are.

For example, just because you know the total profit margin doesn't mean, nor entitle you the car to be sold at a minimum profit. You have websites showing "TMV", averaging a $350 discount, yet you somehow expect it's reasonable to assume a $3500 discount. Doesn't make logical sense.

Thus my point. YOU think it's all about the money; for you -knowing as many facts as possible is where credibility is built. I AGREE(its important -that is). However, and generally speaking- People BUY from People. Almost all businesses out there are realationship based. Yes, money is an important element. But it's not THE element to which persuades most clients to make their decisions.


NADA conducted a survey of a few hundred potential buyers. They asked the potential clients to list, in order from 1 - 5 (highest to lowest priority) how they'd consider purchasing a car.

Before they purchased; No 1 motivator for buying a car was Price. No. 5 was Sales Person.

After they purchased; No 1 motivator for making the transaction? The Sales Person. No. 5 was price.

Still more? Back in the '90s a large Auto Franchise opend a series of dealerships in which there was 'Haggle Free Zone'- Zero negotiations on the car. The price was listed on the window. No Sales People. Just 'delivery specialist".

That business model failed in under 12 months. The reason? People 'need' to negotiate. Ergo, people buy from people.

A low interest rate is a gift from Porsche. If you still don't think so; just pay cash like most 911 buyers do.

 

Ps. I charge a 10% hidden fee, minus 15% for you being awesomeness and then back into the number using Pi divided by a obtuse angle...


....carry the one....oh wait......



















shoot. I gotta do that over again.

 

PPS. Chad just found out how to 'rotate' pictures on our website. And seems to be extemely happy and proud of that fact.

Please email him and tell him I said he's a "Moron. Welcome to teh Internetz".

 

I didn't say it's all about the money. I said it's about pricing your services accurately. I agree that it's still most efficient to interface with a person to buy a car, since the process is subjective. When I go to the doctor, I do have a guarantee I'll get my money's worth. Their accreditation, professional training and liability for their actions constitutes a guarantee. You offer me no guarantee I'll be satisfied. If I pay too much, that's my problem. If I don't like your service, again, I have no recourse other than to not buy from you. So, I decide how much your service, without its guarantee, is worth to me.

All things being equal: If I find someone willing to accept what I'm willing to pay, I go with them. I do this within reason, making sure I'm not spending my time and gas money to drive to every dealer in a 300-mile radius; if I go to 2-3 dealers expecting to pay X and the lowest I get is Y, I adjust my budget to Y. I'm not unreasonable, I'm not asking for holdback and your first born. I'm asking you to meet my price, and if you say no I go elsewhere or raise my price. I don't take it personally, nor should you.

Transparency--knowing all the facts--brings trustworthiness, which is a primary component of credibility. Your product knowledge, professional attitude, the way you dress, your handshake, and the tchotchke you throw in as part of the sale are all very secondary, and don't raise the price I'm willing to pay, but may lower it if they're missing.

Your dealer-funded survey suggests that a) I'm right about price being the most important factor in a large transaction and b) once people are done buying their car and spending the hours that most do on the process, they want to know that the known or unknown premium they paid on their car went toward something they consider tangible, in this case their salesperson. Otherwise it's money down the toilet.

A low interest rate is no "gift," it's incentive to meet lack of demand. And the "no haggle" concept is alive and well, one failure doesn't count much against the many successes. Same concept: when people know THE actual price of the car (in this case the no-haggle price) they can then determine the value of paying that price if it compares favorably to market value, or spend their time haggling it out with another dealer. Either way they're informed, which lends to the dealer's credibility.

I've said my piece. The next time I'm up for a new Porsche I'll give you a call, try not to run for the hills.

 

all of you have very valid points! It seems there are people here with integrity. Chris, it has been a pleasure dealing with you! if most dealers were this honest, GM and Chrysler would still be doing big business.
PS Can you mail me my new car and I'll send you a check!!!

 

The rates are there.
The negotiating potential is there...
PCNA is throwing money back to dealers, 10k in the case of Turbos to get you behind the wheel.
A bunch less for Carreras, but still they are getting some $$, so that the dealers can deal on price.

A good time to get behind the wheel !!

 

i was quoted 15k off a new c2 pdk and 20k off a pcna c2 launch car with 4k on the clock..plus the buy rate for lease....cant get better than that can it....although the economy is still faltering and the road to recovery appears to be longer each week. i have to imagine its gonna be a long summer for porsche. its may and there are still 2008 cars on lots and the 2009's are backed up, only slightly helped by the recent incentive program. without it sales would even more "off". remember porsche did not factor in the recession when they were cranking out the 2009's last year. They may have scaled back 2010 production, but a glut of 2009's have been built. I can't imagine PFS ending hte one program that has actually increased sales for them in april/may. It would be like turning off a fire hydrant after starting to contain a fire