Is the 911 underpowered?
03-29-2008, 12:57 AM
#31
Rennlist Member
I think it depends on what you want from a car. I've driven a 996 Turbo. Own a 997S and a Ferrari 328.
In the context of your Interstate/on-off Ramp, cruising transportation setting, I'd say the TT is one of the best road-going, transportation vehicles on the planet. Insulated, camouflaged speed, and no skill required.
But, if it's a sports car that will give a wider range of fun on most roads, the 997S is better. It's light and quick. I do not track. But, why anyone would want more power on the street than the 997S has is beyond me. (and you can feel it
) This car's power, at least on the street, is not the weak link in the chain. It's public safetly and my own driving limitations. I cannot imagine needing more power, on the street, than the 997S offers.
In the same vein...the Ferrari 328, is just a different breed of car altogether. By todays speed/power standards, it's a real snail. But, the fun factor is off the charts. It's "just right" the way it is...
Just as the 997S is, imvho. I still scare myself sometimes, as it is.
Maybe I'm ready for some track time
In the context of your Interstate/on-off Ramp, cruising transportation setting, I'd say the TT is one of the best road-going, transportation vehicles on the planet. Insulated, camouflaged speed, and no skill required.
But, if it's a sports car that will give a wider range of fun on most roads, the 997S is better. It's light and quick. I do not track. But, why anyone would want more power on the street than the 997S has is beyond me. (and you can feel it
) This car's power, at least on the street, is not the weak link in the chain. It's public safetly and my own driving limitations. I cannot imagine needing more power, on the street, than the 997S offers. In the same vein...the Ferrari 328, is just a different breed of car altogether. By todays speed/power standards, it's a real snail. But, the fun factor is off the charts. It's "just right" the way it is...
Just as the 997S is, imvho.
I still scare myself sometimes, as it is. Maybe I'm ready for some track time
03-29-2008, 01:01 AM
#32
The Penguin King
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Take your 997 or 997s to the track, and see how much of the track you can run WOT. Then ask yourself if the car needs more power.
03-29-2008, 05:36 AM
#33
i couldn't agree more=i have had a 996tt and a 997tt-i have the most fun with my 997s-i can't come anything close to opening any of these cars up on the roads. the s feels lighter and nimble, like a sports car. underpowered in an indy car race, but not on the u.s. streets and highways-remember the s has a top speed of 181. just because you are buying a car that does 193 doesn't mean it will help you on i-95.
03-29-2008, 08:17 AM
#34
Rennlist Member
Admittedly, I'm a "more is better" person when is comes to hp & torque. As much as I'd like the 415 hp of the GT3, if I'm honest, I can't really use the 355 hp.
Accelerate hard through the first 3 gears and you are well over any speed limit in this country. Just very difficult to use the power as it is intended anywhere but the track.
Accelerate hard through the first 3 gears and you are well over any speed limit in this country. Just very difficult to use the power as it is intended anywhere but the track.
03-29-2008, 10:21 AM
#35
Instructor
Thread Starter
Love the 328! A good friend had one and I always enjoyed riding around in it. It definitely provided a different, more raw experience. I've driven it a couple of times and was never interested in going fast or even carving up twisties .... it was just a fun car to drive, even just going up and down the gears in a straight line.
I think it depends on what you want from a car. I've driven a 996 Turbo. Own a 997S and a Ferrari 328.
In the context of your Interstate/on-off Ramp, cruising transportation setting, I'd say the TT is one of the best road-going, transportation vehicles on the planet. Insulated, camouflaged speed, and no skill required.
But, if it's a sports car that will give a wider range of fun on most roads, the 997S is better. It's light and quick. I do not track. But, why anyone would want more power on the street than the 997S has is beyond me. (and you can feel it) This car's power, at least on the street, is not the weak link in the chain. It's public safetly and my own driving limitations. I cannot imagine needing more power, on the street, than the 997S offers.
In the same vein...the Ferrari 328, is just a different breed of car altogether. By todays speed/power standards, it's a real snail. But, the fun factor is off the charts. It's "just right" the way it is...
Just as the 997S is, imvho. I still scare myself sometimes, as it is.
Maybe I'm ready for some track time
In the context of your Interstate/on-off Ramp, cruising transportation setting, I'd say the TT is one of the best road-going, transportation vehicles on the planet. Insulated, camouflaged speed, and no skill required.
But, if it's a sports car that will give a wider range of fun on most roads, the 997S is better. It's light and quick. I do not track. But, why anyone would want more power on the street than the 997S has is beyond me. (and you can feel it
) This car's power, at least on the street, is not the weak link in the chain. It's public safetly and my own driving limitations. I cannot imagine needing more power, on the street, than the 997S offers. In the same vein...the Ferrari 328, is just a different breed of car altogether. By todays speed/power standards, it's a real snail. But, the fun factor is off the charts. It's "just right" the way it is...
Just as the 997S is, imvho.
I still scare myself sometimes, as it is. Maybe I'm ready for some track time
03-29-2008, 10:41 AM
#36
Instructor
Thread Starter
Agreed, on a track it's a different perspective altogether.
But, I'd venture to say most 911 owners (not the Rennlist bunch!) have never and will never go on a track of any sort.
For people who track, maybe this makes up about 1-2% of total drive time?? I think the Lotus Elise in a sense is a tool whose existence can be justified by explaining that it's strenghts are on the track, but not the 911.
What I see in many folks opinions is that "it's good (powerful) enough" why would you want more?
What really made me start this thread is that I believe that with Porsche's and the 911s heritage, the 911 should be the performance benchmark in it's class and I'm not so sure it is any more. There clearly is not an easy way to just say outright that it is better than a E92 M3 or sad to say a Corvette in overall performance. Most discussions go down to, well if we go to the track ....
Most people won't go to the track and if so I'm guessing the M3 and Corvettes are not slouchy either. Interestingly enough on the track subject, most people I know spend significant amounts of money on suspension/brake upgrades. After spending 80K on car (new) that's supposed to be a great track performer I don't think that's right ... at least on the suspension part because I do believe that stock is not that great on the street even compared to something like PSS9s.
But, I'd venture to say most 911 owners (not the Rennlist bunch!) have never and will never go on a track of any sort.
For people who track, maybe this makes up about 1-2% of total drive time?? I think the Lotus Elise in a sense is a tool whose existence can be justified by explaining that it's strenghts are on the track, but not the 911.
What I see in many folks opinions is that "it's good (powerful) enough" why would you want more?
What really made me start this thread is that I believe that with Porsche's and the 911s heritage, the 911 should be the performance benchmark in it's class and I'm not so sure it is any more. There clearly is not an easy way to just say outright that it is better than a E92 M3 or sad to say a Corvette in overall performance. Most discussions go down to, well if we go to the track ....
Most people won't go to the track and if so I'm guessing the M3 and Corvettes are not slouchy either. Interestingly enough on the track subject, most people I know spend significant amounts of money on suspension/brake upgrades. After spending 80K on car (new) that's supposed to be a great track performer I don't think that's right ... at least on the suspension part because I do believe that stock is not that great on the street even compared to something like PSS9s.
i couldn't agree more=i have had a 996tt and a 997tt-i have the most fun with my 997s-i can't come anything close to opening any of these cars up on the roads. the s feels lighter and nimble, like a sports car. underpowered in an indy car race, but not on the u.s. streets and highways-remember the s has a top speed of 181. just because you are buying a car that does 193 doesn't mean it will help you on i-95.
03-29-2008, 10:48 AM
#37
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I'd say a measly 325hp propelling a car in 4.7 seconds is pretty F***ing sweet.
You guys who think the 911 is underpowered have been brainwashed in 'bigger is better' 'more is superior'.
The cars that are producing massive hp are also very inefficient in regards to actually containing, and handling that power.
Anyone can go fast in a straight line. I think we've proven that since the '50's. It's applying that power so you can enter an "S" curve and exiting it in a manner that enable you to win races.
You guys who think the 911 is underpowered have been brainwashed in 'bigger is better' 'more is superior'.
The cars that are producing massive hp are also very inefficient in regards to actually containing, and handling that power.
Anyone can go fast in a straight line. I think we've proven that since the '50's. It's applying that power so you can enter an "S" curve and exiting it in a manner that enable you to win races.
03-29-2008, 10:54 AM
#38
Three Wheelin'
I'd say a measly 325hp propelling a car in 4.7 seconds is pretty F***ing sweet.
You guys who think the 911 is underpowered have been brainwashed in 'bigger is better' 'more is superior'.
The cars that are producing massive hp are also very inefficient in regards to actually containing, and handling that power.
Anyone can go fast in a straight line. I think we've proven that since the '50's. It's applying that power so you can enter an "S" curve and exiting it in a manner that enable you to win races.
You guys who think the 911 is underpowered have been brainwashed in 'bigger is better' 'more is superior'.
The cars that are producing massive hp are also very inefficient in regards to actually containing, and handling that power.
Anyone can go fast in a straight line. I think we've proven that since the '50's. It's applying that power so you can enter an "S" curve and exiting it in a manner that enable you to win races.
Spoken like a true car salesman.
03-29-2008, 11:15 AM
#39
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shuddyup would ya? I'd say the same damn thing if I wasn't selling cars. I did exist prior to 2002. So did my beliefs.
I sell 500+hp Mercedes Benz's as well. And I STILL think a Porsche is a more efficient machine at putting power to the ground.
PS. I'm still right though. Even if I am a Car Salesman.
I sell 500+hp Mercedes Benz's as well. And I STILL think a Porsche is a more efficient machine at putting power to the ground.
PS. I'm still right though. Even if I am a Car Salesman.
03-29-2008, 12:47 PM
#40
Three Wheelin'
I've tracked various cars over the years and recently took mine to Laguna Seca. On the main straightaway I couldn't pull away from Audi A4's and Nissan 350ZX's.
Rode with a friend on another track day in a new Z06 and nothing could stay with us in the corners or straights and he had no previous track experience.
I wouldn't trade my car for any of the above, its my 12th and favorite Porsche but for 100K it should be in the league of the faster tier cars.
Just one loyal Porsche fanatic's opinion.
Rode with a friend on another track day in a new Z06 and nothing could stay with us in the corners or straights and he had no previous track experience.
I wouldn't trade my car for any of the above, its my 12th and favorite Porsche but for 100K it should be in the league of the faster tier cars.
Just one loyal Porsche fanatic's opinion.
03-29-2008, 01:39 PM
#41
Burning Brakes
03-29-2008, 02:13 PM
#42
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I have the X-51 package and no - it is not underpowered.....
IF you want to drag race - get a Corvette or Viper - if you want a race car get a Porsche!
IF you want to drag race - get a Corvette or Viper - if you want a race car get a Porsche!
03-29-2008, 03:34 PM
#43
Three Wheelin'
I just discussed the addition of a supercharger with my wife due to the relative lack of power being discussed here. She confirmed that no way in hell is the car underpowered and I can drop it right now.
03-29-2008, 03:42 PM
#44
Rennlist Member
Great sig Draxa....Mr. Richards looks like he is nearing 120. Was it intentional that his shirt matches your little Tapir buddy?
Oh, and no, not my carrera S is not underpowered....but then again 400 hp would be nice...or 450 or 500....or....
Oh, and no, not my carrera S is not underpowered....but then again 400 hp would be nice...or 450 or 500....or....
03-29-2008, 03:46 PM
#45
Burning Brakes
He's fronting the latest Louis Vuitton luggage ad; you should see how great this pic looks in A4 size - delightful touches with the dainty tea-set in the background and a nod to his age, a magnifying glass on the book he's reading.
Superb quality shot of KR, too. A real 'lived in' face. One of my favourite dudes.