quantimouse

I ask this as a serious question. I have said recently I plan on keeping my RS4 and adding a p-car to my garage. Originally I was set on the C4S. Or maybe the Targa S.

But now I'm looking maybe for a harder edge in the choice. I am still heavily considering the forthcoming R8 as well (not a harder edge). But I think it would be wiser to wait for the 500+hp version of that car.

So I got to thinking about the GT3 RS (forthcoming) and wondering, given how the Cayman provides what most people agree is a better platform, which would be a better track car? We've seen what RUF did with the car. Their kit can be had and when added to the Cayman it will be under or near the GT3. Will it outperform it? Hard to define what that means. I don't just mean in terms of times, but in terms of handling dynamics with the mid engine.

Interesting question. Any takers? I am 100% open to being persuaded My wife does like the GT3 RS in green however, it might be hard to talk her into the I-Robot-esque R8.

RonCT

I am by no means an expert, but I researched both the GT3 and the Cayman and for many reasons ended up with a 997S - go figure. My feelings on the GT3 are that it will be a great car, but I couldn't get past the sunroof mandate - just rubbed me the wrong way that Porsche would spend millions to lighten these cars, and then make us have 50 lbs on top of the roof on a GT3. The RS is even worse in that respect - a GT3RS with a sunroof, give me a break... The RS is so watered down here in the US that I wonder who will buy it? The serious track enthusiast may be more likely to take a 997S and modify than to take an RS with a trick suspension, sunroof, and few of the world market parts and pieces. The Cayman is a great platform, no doubt, but I've always liked the 911. Get what you like and not what you think might make a better track platform.

MJones

Unless your on a list with a deposit your chances of ordering an RS are nill.

In other words, my dealer, who is in the top 10 in sales only got 10 allocations for the GT3 thru June of '07 out of 588 spread over 202 dealers in the country.
The RS spaces will be slimer

$45k in Cayman tuning will not get you close to the GT3 or RS as the engines are totally different starting from the block, two entirely different animals. as is the suspension and on and on.

Learn how to really drive whatever car at the limit on the track...thats where the fun is..it's all about seat time.

Done PDE?

MCoupe

How about this? I track regularly and teach as well. I am coming from the BMW side and had my own race car for the ITS group.

I purchased the 997 S as a weekend car and DE for me and students and was very impressed by its abilities. But I regret it!! Love the car but I feel I am missing out...

All that said, I had the opportunity to see what a GT3 can do on the track bone stock. I am talking 996 not 997. If I had the $$ and the time, I would purchase a 996 GT3 and make it a dedicated track car. You are starting on a great platform, you can do some more weight savings, roll cage, better seat(s), engine tuning.

In my opinion it will a much more raw and fun car to drive than the Cayman. Seems that money is no issue for you but the money saved will help you fine tune the car as you get better at it and better driver.

My 2 cents.

icon

i think you would get a better response in either the cayman or the gt3rs forum or both.
ruf charges $39,900 to install the 3.8L engine and $59,000 to install it supercharged.
then you would still need other upgrades like suspension.
the ruf cayman rk coupe sells for $242,000

but farnbacher-loles has a nice version of the cayman called a gtr that runs $118,500. (see pic)
fully upgraded including:

405-HP 3.8 liter X-51 Engine
REVO Software
Cold Air Intake
Custom Headers and Free-Flow Exhaust
Third Radiator for Additional Cooling
Hi-Performance Clutch
Limited Slip Differential
Short Shifter
CROSS 15-way Adjustable Coilover Suspension
Upgraded Front and Rear Sway Bars
Porsche Ceramic Brakes (PCCB)
Fikse Lightweight Wheels
245/35-19 (f) and 285/30-19 (r) Yokohama ADVAN Sport Tires
997 Euro Cup Aero Front with Splitter
Carbon Fiber Height-Adjustable Rear Spoiler
Carbon Fiber Side Intakes
Carbon Fiber Side Mirror Housings
- plus optional interior upgrades

farnbacher says it will walk off and leave a 996gt3.

no need to wonder ron.
they're sold out!
and they could easily sell more if they wanted to produce them.
also doesnt have a sunroof.

Alan Smithee

quantimouse, what kind of track experience do you have? I don't get the idea you're driving at the level that warrants a GT3 RS...starting with a Cayman S will enable you to take steps with modifications as your talent increases.

For what it's worth, the latest rumors are that the GT3 RS will NOT have a sunroof.

quantimouse

Yeah I was going to post about the GT3 RS not having a sunroof, apparently the voices were heard.

Do I have the stuff to pilot the GT3 RS? No, but don't worry about me. I like to play with extreme things and part of it all is the collector aspect. I'm weird that way.

I also think this is an interesting question, I didn't realize there was a GT3 forum, appologies. I thought 997 covered it all, and I was referring to the 997 GT3 RS, of course.

texas911

Cayman.

RonCT

Jeff,
I know they are sold out - I was wondering what type of buyer... The hard-core track guys I know were at first interested in the RS, but once the final specifications came out, they said "why bother with a watered down RSA?" The curiosity I have is will it be non-track guys, collectors, etc.? Will the RS ever see the track, what percentage?

I guess I missed something because all reports I read were that ALL 997 product in the US will have a mandatory sunroof with no delete option. Maybe you are talking about the world market?

Ron

mooty

ron,

the jury on rs is not out yet. IF it's 10k (opposed to 20k) over GT3, then i think it's right on and worth the money for track guys. it will not be a RSA. based on the info or rumor on RL as of now. it will only be missing plexiglass, seats, roll bar. all of those are easily retrofitted for 10k or so. thus you will have a REAL ROW RS for 20% more than GT3. (this is of course based on the info we have now from RL).

btw, if you are serious about tracking a RS, the cgt seats is useless and if you wear a hans it gives you a bad neck pain b/c it pushes your helmet forward. ALL race seat does that. try on that's hans specific then you will IMMEDIATELY realized what you have been missing. i would stuff a OMP or recaro HANS seat in the RS anyways, better seat and less $$$ than CGT seats.

allegretto

A trick Cayman will be near worthless when you trade it in.

An RS will likelly be worth "all the money" when you turn it.

blake

I'm not so sure about that Allegretto... The Cayman S forum has a lot of buzz among enthusiats interested in increasing the HP and "tricking out" the car for DE... In the few days that I have attended DE's myself, I have seen MANY Boxsters and a few Caymans. Almost all of the Boxster owners were drooling over the Cayman and expressed interest in moving in that direction. I personally expect to see a growing following for the Cayman as a track car as the tuners bring more product to market. Others have said this, but I look at it as this decades "944 Turbo" - a nearly complete track car with the right modifications...

So a "trick" Cayman might be "worthless" on dealer trade-in, but should hold its value for the DE crowd on the open market. Just look at the 964 RSA versus the base 964....

My $0.02.
-Blake

Putt-Putt

Here's my opinion, for what it's worth(less):

If you're young (20-35) you'll like the Cayman. If you're over 35 years of age, you'll pbly like the 911 better.

Alan Smithee

I agree completely. There's a wave of track-prepped E46 M3s coming on the market...sellers of very fast cars are struggling to get retail, even with very pricey and effective modifications.

With modified cars, there is a VERY narrow range of buyers, and those buyers are well aware of it. There's always the concern of who did the work, and if they did it well. For resale, nothing compares to a factory-built track car, especially one built in limited numbers.

Regarding availability of the GT3 and GT3 RS...I'd wager that at least half of those on the 'waiting lists' are speculators, and that when the cars aren't trading hands for substantially over MSRP they will fall by the way-side, leaving cars on dealers lots and open order slots for those who want them. If I'm wrong, there are always the 2008 models...

clubrcr

While having the opportunity to race both factory cars and purpose built cars, I completely agree with the above. When you start with a better tub, seam welded and have a purpose drivetrain and suspension, there is little comparsion. I believe there are tuners out there that can build a great, fast competitive cars, but for the original post, you would be better off with a factory car. Even if the Cayman was faster, I think it will be many miles of track time before you can take the car to the limit. Bottom line... the resale will be higher a factory built car, with a few exceptions.