What has the best potential as a track car? The GT3 RS or a Cayman w/45k in tuning?
10-22-2006, 07:00 PM
#32
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To answer the original question, a GT3RS is the better track car than the Cayman, no matter how much you spend on a Cayman. End of story. The GT3Rs has a better engine, better transmission, better suspension, etc...
For DEs and street use the Cayman is as good as any other M96 based car and would do just fine. But for weekly track use I'll take a GT3RS in a heartbeat.
For DEs and street use the Cayman is as good as any other M96 based car and would do just fine. But for weekly track use I'll take a GT3RS in a heartbeat.
10-22-2006, 07:21 PM
#33
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by DJ 996
To answer the original question, a GT3RS is the better track car than the Cayman, no matter how much you spend on a Cayman. End of story.
but you can provide the definitive answer. LOL!
10-22-2006, 07:58 PM
#34
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I had a 996 GT3, a 997 car, and have driven the gaymans a bit. The coxster is a fantastic car and fundamentally superior layout than ****-heavy 911's, but it doesn't have the decades of engineering and refinement behind the chassis (and engine) to put it in even the same league as the GT3 variants.
A fully sorted track car benefiting from 1,000's of hours of refinement and tuning from Porsche vs. a low production conversion?
It's a rather silly question actually.
A fully sorted track car benefiting from 1,000's of hours of refinement and tuning from Porsche vs. a low production conversion?
It's a rather silly question actually.
10-22-2006, 10:43 PM
#35
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Originally Posted by icon
997 gt3rs hasn't even started production yet bonehead!
but you can provide the definitive answer. LOL!
but you can provide the definitive answer. LOL!
Drop the attitude.
10-22-2006, 11:06 PM
#36
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Originally Posted by frayed
I had a 996 GT3, a 997 car, and have driven the gaymans a bit. The coxster is a fantastic car and fundamentally superior layout than ****-heavy 911's, but it doesn't have the decades of engineering and refinement behind the chassis (and engine) to put it in even the same league as the GT3 variants.
A fully sorted track car benefiting from 1,000's of hours of refinement and tuning from Porsche vs. a low production conversion?
It's a rather silly question actually.
A fully sorted track car benefiting from 1,000's of hours of refinement and tuning from Porsche vs. a low production conversion?
It's a rather silly question actually.
10-23-2006, 09:11 AM
#38
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by DJ 996
It's a no brainer...bonehead!
Drop the attitude.
Drop the attitude.
you're the one that made a statement about a car that hasn't even started production yet, and finished w/ "end of story".
a good tuner can take a tin can and mod it to beat a stock car.
the coming ruf rk coupe cayman will most likely run the rs off the track.
youre right about the no brainer part though.
i shouldn't have called you "bonehead" though, so i will apologize for that
Originally Posted by frayed
doesn't have the decades of engineering and refinement behind the chassis (and engine) to put it in even the same league as the GT3 variants.
A fully sorted track car benefiting from 1,000's of hours of refinement and tuning from Porsche vs. a low production conversion?
It's a rather silly question actually.
A fully sorted track car benefiting from 1,000's of hours of refinement and tuning from Porsche vs. a low production conversion?
It's a rather silly question actually.
cars don't need decades of engineering and refinement! that's absurd!
you don't think they take what they learn from one model and apply it to another?
tuners can put caymans in the same league w/ stock gt3 variants whether you want to believe it or not.
sure the car with more history is most likely going to be more reliable and sorted.
i'm not saying one is better than the other and i would much prefer an oem product.
but i'm not making the ridiculous statements that the tuner caymans can't be competitive.
also why tell a new poster his question was silly?
Originally Posted by C4S Surgeon
A GT3RS and a modded gaymen ain't even in the same solar system!
Now, that's a no brainer.
Now, that's a no brainer.
you're not really a surgeon are you?
10-23-2006, 10:38 AM
#41
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All kidding aside, they do have the makings of a good track car, there is a good write up on a cayman PCA class car in Pano a month or so ago. Stupid name though.
It may be a good car, but I think the 911 platform is superior.
It may be a good car, but I think the 911 platform is superior.
10-23-2006, 11:05 AM
#42
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Originally Posted by icon
i've had a 914, 911's, boxster's, 996's, 997's, a gt3 and a cayman as well.
cars don't need decades of engineering and refinement! that's absurd!
you don't think they take what they learn from one model and apply it to another?
tuners can put caymans in the same league w/ stock gt3 variants whether you want to believe it or not.
sure the car with more history is most likely going to be more reliable and sorted.
i'm not saying one is better than the other and i would much prefer an oem product.
but i'm not making the ridiculous statements that the tuner caymans can't be competitive.
also why tell a new poster his question was silly?
cars don't need decades of engineering and refinement! that's absurd!
you don't think they take what they learn from one model and apply it to another?
tuners can put caymans in the same league w/ stock gt3 variants whether you want to believe it or not.
sure the car with more history is most likely going to be more reliable and sorted.
i'm not saying one is better than the other and i would much prefer an oem product.
but i'm not making the ridiculous statements that the tuner caymans can't be competitive.
also why tell a new poster his question was silly?
You said it yourself, a good race shop or tuner can make a tin can fast. Even handle well. That does not mean the end product is a *great* car. It means it is a fast car.
There's a veritable chasm b/t what posterity considers a great car and what is just another fast car. Think about it.
Can RUF, 9ff, Farbachereeloleodlels, etc. make a GT3 beater out of a Cayman conversion? Absolutely. Will the end product have the sheer depth, full spectrum performance and reliabilty as the OE solution? Very unlikely. The desirability and resale? You've got to be kidding (I'm talking conversions here, not an OEM RUF RK Spider, which are clearly in the stratosphere).
The more you drive modded cars and appreciate what's lost in the process, you come to understand exactly what clubrcr already stated above.
10-23-2006, 11:31 AM
#43
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by frayed
Where did I write "tuner caymans can't be competitive"? Get your head on straight icon.
You said it yourself, a good race shop or tuner can make a tin can fast. Even handle well. That does not mean the end product is a *great* car. It means it is a fast car.
There's a veritable chasm b/t what posterity considers a great car and what is just another fast car. Think about it.
Can RUF, 9ff, Farbachereeloleodlels, etc. make a GT3 beater out of a Cayman conversion? Absolutely. Will the end product have the sheer depth, full spectrum performance and reliabilty as the OE solution? Very unlikely. The desirability and resale? You've got to be kidding (I'm talking conversions here, not an OEM RUF RK Spider, which are clearly in the stratosphere).
The more you drive modded cars and appreciate what's lost in the process, you come to understand exactly what clubrcr already stated above.
You said it yourself, a good race shop or tuner can make a tin can fast. Even handle well. That does not mean the end product is a *great* car. It means it is a fast car.
There's a veritable chasm b/t what posterity considers a great car and what is just another fast car. Think about it.
Can RUF, 9ff, Farbachereeloleodlels, etc. make a GT3 beater out of a Cayman conversion? Absolutely. Will the end product have the sheer depth, full spectrum performance and reliabilty as the OE solution? Very unlikely. The desirability and resale? You've got to be kidding (I'm talking conversions here, not an OEM RUF RK Spider, which are clearly in the stratosphere).
The more you drive modded cars and appreciate what's lost in the process, you come to understand exactly what clubrcr already stated above.
Originally Posted by frayed
A fully sorted track car benefiting from 1,000's of hours of refinement and tuning from Porsche vs. a low production conversion?
It's a rather silly question actually.
It's a rather silly question actually.
or that it would be as reliable as the oem.
or as desirable?
or have the resale?
i was talking tuner cars including the ruf rk coupe and farnbacher-loles gtr both of which i brought up in my initial post in this thread.
so i guess we are in agreement?
my apologies for my apparent misunderstanding!
10-23-2006, 12:07 PM
#44
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The excessive hours in development of a car like the GT3 and RS pay off not just in terms of sheer speed, but briliance over a wide spectrum of conditions and usage. My quote above has nothing to do with laptimes, but the 'whole package'.
The original question was what's a better track car, a GT3 RS or a converted Cayman? To me, that question brings into the definition more than just how it performs against the stopwatch, and extends to things like desirability, resale, tractability, forgiveness, usability, reliability, toughness, etc. Marrying speed with these traits come at quite a cost, but for those who can appreciate them. . . . we have Porsche's GT cars.
And sheeit, I don't even own one (at the moment).
The original question was what's a better track car, a GT3 RS or a converted Cayman? To me, that question brings into the definition more than just how it performs against the stopwatch, and extends to things like desirability, resale, tractability, forgiveness, usability, reliability, toughness, etc. Marrying speed with these traits come at quite a cost, but for those who can appreciate them. . . . we have Porsche's GT cars.
And sheeit, I don't even own one (at the moment).
10-23-2006, 08:48 PM
#45
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by frayed
for those who can appreciate them. . . . we have Porsche's GT cars. And sheeit, I don't even own one (at the moment).
And sheeit, I don't even own one (at the moment).and it hurt's really bad!
my bonehead self cancelled no. 1 spots on both the 997gt3 & 997gt3rs.
would have had the gt3 in 3 or 4 weeks!
