drbf

What brand of wax are you using? I want my car to feel faster........

mglobe

I get 2-4 hp increase for each coat of Zaino Z2 I put on. I get an additional 1-2 hp if I sniff the bottle of Zaino before I drive off. Oh, and Zaino Leather in a Bottle is good for another 1-2 hp.

I can prove it.

meaker

I wish that the next person on this forum,that is thinking of doing this AWE system. Would please have a scale to weigh with and do a before and after dnyo(on the same dyno). So this argument would have a answer..I think personally you are going to have a gain in power(high rpm) for the headers(if you seen how bad the stocks look) and cats(I don't think that a car manf. could get away with high flow cats), but it seems you would lose some lowend torque..

MichaelL

The issue about actual rear wheel horsepower increases is a valid concern. It was impractical for me to get before & after dyno runs when I had the work done. I fully agree that dyno testing on the car being modified, corrected for temperature & air pressure and also on the same machine, is the way to go. It is on my list of things to do. I may do an ECU reflash first.

I don't think that the weight of the parts is a significant concern, probably more effective to unload the cargo and put the driver on a diet. For someone really concerned about exhaust system weight, Eisenmann makes a titanium, lightweight exhaust for about $15,000.

Many of the more reputable aftermarket tuners publish dynamometer data for their products. One can assume that they are not a fiction, as the consequences of falsifying claims can have highly adverse effects on future business. Published results, however, can be crankshaft or rear wheel power, a 16 to 18 percent difference and may not be corrected for standard temperature and pressure. There are certainly many over-inflated claims out there.

The published horsepower and torque improvements also have to be viewed in a realistic manner. Percentages do not multiply together, nor do power gains necessarily add together. The only way to determine the improvements from various upgrade parts is to test them together.

The power improvements with the complete AWE exhaust system and Evo airbox I had installed are real and there is no loss in bottom end torque. Low rpm throttle roll-ons are better and from 4000 rpm up, there is a strong top end charge. The parts flow more air, and consequently, generate more power and torque. There is no question that these parts are manufactured to a higher quality and at a greater cost(without regard to PCNA's list prices) than stock components. It would be interesting to test them all, individually and collectively, on a flow bench.

From all the advertising out there, and correspondence with many aftermarket tuners, I think the following power improvements may be reasonable: headers, 5 to 10 hp; catalytics, 5 to 10 hp; mufflers, 0 to 10 hp; intakes, 5 hp and ECU reflash, 5 to 10 hp. Needless to say, I cannot guarantee any of these figures.

gpjli2

The moral here, I guess, is that no matter how great the outcry for objectivism and measurement, people will continue to put their mouth where their money is.

Eggplant Cab

Well to be fair to those who actually go ahead with the mods, it's their money and they are trying to provide info for others. Sure naysayers like myself want to see definitive proof from a dyno. Why should they go with the expense of 2 dyno tests to please others? If you're satisfied then you should be happy.
What do they say? Being creatures led by senses, if it's louder, it'll feel like 20hp more just on aural feedback alone. I was guilty of that when I modified my 90 964 with exhaust (with cat) (gained 5hp) on dyno. Only when I changed the intake with a K&N cone and a chip to match the headers did I get just 15hp and 8ft/lbs. I'd imagined it had the promised 28hp as advertised. The mind does play tricks. Later I tried just the chip alone.. just 3hp.

jjporsch43

Look at it this way.....Fabspeed, AWE, Tubi.....whatever floats your boat. If you're happy so be it. I could care less about all you people whining about the effectiveness of aftermarket mods. I really don't care. I have the full AWE exhaust-if you find fault or question it's effectiveness...again I don't give a flip. Go dive your cars and have fun!!! Later,

John J
SA Texas

mglobe

John,

That's the smartest thing said in this thread. I know I've made some fun of the whole modding thing with my wax comments, but the truth is I really don't care if people want to mod their exhausts etc. I wouldn't mind a little more throaty sound myself. I just wish I could get independant proof on the performance issue.

Drive on!

Mike

Mike/A.W.E.

Is there anyone in the Philly area that is looking to have this work done? I'm looking for an S model (preferably bone stock) without PSE.

The first person to email me will get the following deal:

I will comp the install and give you free dyno dyno time. We will first do a baseline dyno run. Next, we will remove your system and install ours. We will then redyno. If you don't like it, I will remove the system free of charge that day no questions asked. If you like it, you pay full price for the exhaust system only! You can watch the entire process from start to finish and get a very good education. You will be saving $577.50.

I just want everyone to keep in mind that we are not the only shop that owns a dyno. Someone can just as easily do a before and after at another shop. We're taking a big risk by posting our findings and claiming the gains. We have the most to lose.

I bet you can all name a few exhaust manufacturers that do not even post dyno sheets. We also have competitors manufacturing exhausts with no testing equipment other than "the butt dyno".

We on the other hand happen to be slaves to our dyno. If the product does not make power, we don't sell it. If it makes less than what our competitors are claiming, we are the first to say it. We're not interested in selling fluff. We are also very busy, so we are going to concentrate on making the products that work.

The 996 GT3 headers are a pefect example of this. We spent weeks developing multiple sets of headers only to be dynoed with little to no result. We could have easily not posted a dyno sheet and said they made power, but we don't operate that way. Never have, never will. We all like to sleep at night.

I really hope someone steps up and accepts the offer. It would be good for the forum.

Re: Weights

3.8 S model non-Sport exhaust
OEM muffler- 23 lbs
OEM cat sections- 12 lbs
OEM headers- 6 lbs
Total- 41 lbs

AWE muffler- 17 lbs
AWE cat sections- 6 lbs
AWE headers- 8 lbs



**edited for spelling error**

mdrums

Wish I lived in Philly...Tampa FL is a little far. This sounds like a good and honest deal and someone should jump on it. There is nothing to lose.
Mike

Dro

Anyone know the weight with PSE?

Rick in Colorado

I agree. This would help to address the issues that are being discussed in the "eternal exhaust debate thread". I, also, live too far away, but I'd love to see someone post the results. BTW, I'm in the "better breathing adds power" camp. The main issue to be determined is if the intake/exhaust system is already optimized or if it's a bottleneck (I think that it has to be - to some degree).

Mike/A.W.E.

I bet it's more, but not by much. There are small pieces of additional tubing that are on the PSE mufflers not found on the standard setup.

mglobe

Impressive offer Mike. If I had an S, and lived in Philly, I'd be all over it. Hope someone steps up to give it a try. It would be great to have some real data to help settle this debate.

Till then, I'm gonna keep putting more wax on my car.

Mike

florindi

Mike,

I sent you an email at sales@awe-tuning.com to discuss the possibilty of using my bone stock 2005 S. I have also dynoed the car so I already have a baseline. This will also help prove how your dyno will correlate to my previous numbers.

Anthony