Luckily Porsche cars sell themselves and not dealerships!
04-15-2006, 10:54 AM
#31
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depends. There are Porsche dealerships which sell ten cars a year and those that sell, I dunno..., 150 cars (?). Sometimes both in the same city/region.
Naturally the one that sells the most cars is gonna be better, and I venture to say *way better*, than one which sells just ten a year.
Naturally the one that sells the most cars is gonna be better, and I venture to say *way better*, than one which sells just ten a year.
04-15-2006, 10:56 AM
#32
Our 1st Porsche purchase 2 years ago (Cayenne) was terrible. Loved the car, salesman was OK, but took 4 + hours to get the paperwork signed. This is from a dealer who wanted to know why all of my Mercedes Benz purchases in the past, were not from him. Had to call 4 or 5 times to get the floor mats promised as part of the deal! They were a combo Benz/Porsche dealership.
I will never buy any vehicle from this dealer again. This dealer was 1 1/2 hours from home.
2nd purchase (911) was from a dealer 3 hours from home. Different story somewhat, although salesman kept talking about the monthly payment amount. Finally told him "I don't care about that, buying the car or not depended upon the price paid, not the monthly payments." He offered to deliver 911 to my home (wonder if he would have) spent some time with us going over details. Called several times after the sale. Overall not a great experience, but an OK one.
We will see what today brings: going to a Mercedes dealership in college town of my daughter to see about buying a 2006 SLK for her 21st birthday/college graduation. Hopefully it will be a good experience, but in my 40 years of buying vehicles, I only remember one that was outstanding! My first Mercedes. Salesman spent all of the time needed to help me understand the brand and why I should purchase one. Personally delived vehicle to my office (1 hour) and even told me he would pickup and deliver E-300 for service. That dealer would have had my business for life, except they went out of business. lol
I will never buy any vehicle from this dealer again. This dealer was 1 1/2 hours from home.
2nd purchase (911) was from a dealer 3 hours from home. Different story somewhat, although salesman kept talking about the monthly payment amount. Finally told him "I don't care about that, buying the car or not depended upon the price paid, not the monthly payments." He offered to deliver 911 to my home (wonder if he would have) spent some time with us going over details. Called several times after the sale. Overall not a great experience, but an OK one.
We will see what today brings: going to a Mercedes dealership in college town of my daughter to see about buying a 2006 SLK for her 21st birthday/college graduation. Hopefully it will be a good experience, but in my 40 years of buying vehicles, I only remember one that was outstanding! My first Mercedes. Salesman spent all of the time needed to help me understand the brand and why I should purchase one. Personally delived vehicle to my office (1 hour) and even told me he would pickup and deliver E-300 for service. That dealer would have had my business for life, except they went out of business. lol
04-15-2006, 12:12 PM
#33
Rennlist Member
My experience has been very positive. The relationship is with the sales person, not the dealership. Institutions have no loyalty, only people do. I've bought 4 Porsches thru the same sales person (Andrew Smith at Loeber, Lincolnwood, Ill.) and everything goes smoothly.
Since the cars are a commodity, you know the right price from the outset, so the negotiating range is very small. The valuation of your trade is probably the biggest variable.
My advice: If you find a salesman you can work well with, stay with him. If he switches dealerships, go there to buy. Typically, after several purchases, your leverage also goes up. They know you are for real. AS
Since the cars are a commodity, you know the right price from the outset, so the negotiating range is very small. The valuation of your trade is probably the biggest variable.
My advice: If you find a salesman you can work well with, stay with him. If he switches dealerships, go there to buy. Typically, after several purchases, your leverage also goes up. They know you are for real. AS
04-15-2006, 01:14 PM
#35
Poseur
Rennlist Member
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For such a new thread it is certainly getting a lot of response! That shows how we feel about this proces,--I hope PCNA and PAG are listening.
The first salesman I spoke to never called me back to answer a few basic questions I had about car options that I wanted in this one. He was arrogant and apparently thought HE was too important to take care of business. I sought out our PCA representative who I had spoken to a couple years earlier. He's much more cordial, drives a Boxster himself, and is active with PCA activities. But, like all 'salesmen,' promised the world until things start to fall on the floor. I suspect a lot of this is due to PAG and PCNA not providing the sales offices the information they need to do their jobs. Having been a Porsche customer for over 30 years, I have learned that they are arrogant and usually uninformed,--all the way to the factory. Unfortunately, to get one of these fine automobiles, we have to deal with this.
Like a couple others, I have been working on getting a European Delivery and the lack of information there is rediculous. It's like they have never done one of these before. I'm working with a dealership that sells dozens of Porsches yearly so they can't claim ignorance.
I, too, dislike the entire negotiation process on automobiles but think I can hold my own with the 'walkaway' mentality,--critical to getting any sort of deal with these people,--even on a custom order. With what they make on each sale (12%) they can afford to bend a little.
Dan
997 S Cabriolet 6-speed
98 Non-Metallic Paint to Sample (J1 Blue Turquoise)
06 Natural Leather Brown
CDZ Gear Lever Trim Leather
CUC Painted Model Desig Rear Lid
CUV Storage Cmpt Lid W/Model Logo
CZD Interior Light Cover Leather
M6H Brown Floor Mats
P01L Adaptive Sports Sts Lthr Int
V9 Black Top
XCZ Sport Shifter
XLF Sport Exhaust System
XMP Lthr Sun Visors Lighted Mirror
XMZ Rear Center Console - Leather
XRR 19" Carrera Sport wheel
XSB Sport Seat Backs in Leather
XTV Door Finishers Lthr
267 Self Dimming Mirrors
342 Heated Front Seats
451 Makassar Str Whl Multifctn
446 Wheel Caps w/Colored Crest
450 Ceramic Composite Brakes-PCCB
482 TPMS
498 Delete Model Designation
509 Fire Extinguisher
550 Hard Top
640 Sport Chrono Package Plus
672 Extended Nav Module
680 Bose High End Sound Package
692 Remote CD Changer
801 Makassar Package
TD5 Tourist Delivery
The first salesman I spoke to never called me back to answer a few basic questions I had about car options that I wanted in this one. He was arrogant and apparently thought HE was too important to take care of business. I sought out our PCA representative who I had spoken to a couple years earlier. He's much more cordial, drives a Boxster himself, and is active with PCA activities. But, like all 'salesmen,' promised the world until things start to fall on the floor. I suspect a lot of this is due to PAG and PCNA not providing the sales offices the information they need to do their jobs. Having been a Porsche customer for over 30 years, I have learned that they are arrogant and usually uninformed,--all the way to the factory. Unfortunately, to get one of these fine automobiles, we have to deal with this.
Like a couple others, I have been working on getting a European Delivery and the lack of information there is rediculous. It's like they have never done one of these before. I'm working with a dealership that sells dozens of Porsches yearly so they can't claim ignorance.
I, too, dislike the entire negotiation process on automobiles but think I can hold my own with the 'walkaway' mentality,--critical to getting any sort of deal with these people,--even on a custom order. With what they make on each sale (12%) they can afford to bend a little.
Dan
997 S Cabriolet 6-speed
98 Non-Metallic Paint to Sample (J1 Blue Turquoise)
06 Natural Leather Brown
CDZ Gear Lever Trim Leather
CUC Painted Model Desig Rear Lid
CUV Storage Cmpt Lid W/Model Logo
CZD Interior Light Cover Leather
M6H Brown Floor Mats
P01L Adaptive Sports Sts Lthr Int
V9 Black Top
XCZ Sport Shifter
XLF Sport Exhaust System
XMP Lthr Sun Visors Lighted Mirror
XMZ Rear Center Console - Leather
XRR 19" Carrera Sport wheel
XSB Sport Seat Backs in Leather
XTV Door Finishers Lthr
267 Self Dimming Mirrors
342 Heated Front Seats
451 Makassar Str Whl Multifctn
446 Wheel Caps w/Colored Crest
450 Ceramic Composite Brakes-PCCB
482 TPMS
498 Delete Model Designation
509 Fire Extinguisher
550 Hard Top
640 Sport Chrono Package Plus
672 Extended Nav Module
680 Bose High End Sound Package
692 Remote CD Changer
801 Makassar Package
TD5 Tourist Delivery
04-15-2006, 02:25 PM
#36
Rennlist Member
It's been my experience that auto dealerships (of any marque) are like any other business in that "management" is the key to how the place operates. Enlightened ownership/management will generally make for a pleasant experience whether you're having dinner or buying a new car.
Having said that - it's not unreasonable to expect superior treatment in store that sells $100k cars. Over the years we've owned lots of different makes of cars, and bought a lot of them new. My very best buying experience was at a Lexus dealer.
My 997S purchase was my first new Porsche. The dealer within 10-minutes of my house was so arrogant I left within five-minutes. How they stay in business is beyond me.
My second stop was on the recommendation of a friend in the PCA - Rusnak in Thousand Oaks. While my salesman was not as well-informed as I might have liked (forgivable IMO), the New Car Sales Manager stepped up and communicated every step of the ordering/waiting/anguishing/delivering process to me. I would buy another car there.
I've learned a couple of things buying new cars over the years: (1) NEVER trade-in your old car! Always sell it yourself; (2) Car dealers vary considerably in their levels of service, and if one doesn't treat you right, go to another. Now, with the internet and resources like this forum, buying a car is even easier.
Having said that - it's not unreasonable to expect superior treatment in store that sells $100k cars. Over the years we've owned lots of different makes of cars, and bought a lot of them new. My very best buying experience was at a Lexus dealer.
My 997S purchase was my first new Porsche. The dealer within 10-minutes of my house was so arrogant I left within five-minutes. How they stay in business is beyond me.
My second stop was on the recommendation of a friend in the PCA - Rusnak in Thousand Oaks. While my salesman was not as well-informed as I might have liked (forgivable IMO), the New Car Sales Manager stepped up and communicated every step of the ordering/waiting/anguishing/delivering process to me. I would buy another car there.
I've learned a couple of things buying new cars over the years: (1) NEVER trade-in your old car! Always sell it yourself; (2) Car dealers vary considerably in their levels of service, and if one doesn't treat you right, go to another. Now, with the internet and resources like this forum, buying a car is even easier.
04-15-2006, 03:47 PM
#37
Dan
You'd do better getting info on Euro Delivery from Rennlist.
I've done it a few times(3 times with Porsche) so if you have any questions, feel free to ask.
As for dealing with it, I disagree. If I'm paying a premium and don't get what I deem to be good service then I won't buy again. If the car turns out to be crappy or has bad service staff, there's no way I'd buy one again, no matter how much I love the car.Unlike many, I'm unwilling to put up with crappy service. And I think the general population would agree. The enthusiast crowd Porsche knows they got a lock on.
You'd do better getting info on Euro Delivery from Rennlist.
I've done it a few times(3 times with Porsche) so if you have any questions, feel free to ask.
As for dealing with it, I disagree. If I'm paying a premium and don't get what I deem to be good service then I won't buy again. If the car turns out to be crappy or has bad service staff, there's no way I'd buy one again, no matter how much I love the car.Unlike many, I'm unwilling to put up with crappy service. And I think the general population would agree. The enthusiast crowd Porsche knows they got a lock on.
Originally Posted by Edgy01
For such a new thread it is certainly getting a lot of response! That shows how we feel about this proces,--I hope PCNA and PAG are listening.
Having been a Porsche customer for over 30 years, I have learned that they are arrogant and usually uninformed,--all the way to the factory. Unfortunately, to get one of these fine automobiles, we have to deal with this.
Like a couple others, I have been working on getting a European Delivery and the lack of information there is rediculous. It's like they have never done one of these before. I'm working with a dealership that sells dozens of Porsches yearly so they can't claim ignorance.
Dan
Having been a Porsche customer for over 30 years, I have learned that they are arrogant and usually uninformed,--all the way to the factory. Unfortunately, to get one of these fine automobiles, we have to deal with this.
Like a couple others, I have been working on getting a European Delivery and the lack of information there is rediculous. It's like they have never done one of these before. I'm working with a dealership that sells dozens of Porsches yearly so they can't claim ignorance.
Dan
04-15-2006, 03:50 PM
#38
Leader
Lemme guess? Beverly Hills and Downtown?
Lemme guess? Beverly Hills and Downtown?
Originally Posted by Leader
It's been my experience that auto dealerships (of any marque) are like any other business in that "management" is the key to how the place operates. Enlightened ownership/management will generally make for a pleasant experience whether you're having dinner or buying a new car.
Having said that - it's not unreasonable to expect superior treatment in store that sells $100k cars. Over the years we've owned lots of different makes of cars, and bought a lot of them new. My very best buying experience was at a Lexus dealer.
My 997S purchase was my first new Porsche. The dealer within 10-minutes of my house was so arrogant I left within five-minutes. How they stay in business is beyond me.
(2) Car dealers vary considerably in their levels of service, and if one doesn't treat you right, go to another. Now, with the internet and resources like this forum, buying a car is even easier.
Having said that - it's not unreasonable to expect superior treatment in store that sells $100k cars. Over the years we've owned lots of different makes of cars, and bought a lot of them new. My very best buying experience was at a Lexus dealer.
My 997S purchase was my first new Porsche. The dealer within 10-minutes of my house was so arrogant I left within five-minutes. How they stay in business is beyond me.
(2) Car dealers vary considerably in their levels of service, and if one doesn't treat you right, go to another. Now, with the internet and resources like this forum, buying a car is even easier.
04-15-2006, 04:56 PM
#39
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The thing that amazes me is that if the sales reps just read the brochures they might have a better understanding of the product. Wow, can you imagine how knowledgeable they would be if they read the Porsche site and some trade articles! If they found there way to a site like this I think they would not know what to do with themselves! 
Dan, I agree. It starts at the factory. It felt that way in 1984 and it still feels that way today.
Dan, I agree. It starts at the factory. It felt that way in 1984 and it still feels that way today.
04-15-2006, 05:38 PM
#40
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by tkids
Wow, can you imagine how knowledgeable they would be if they read the Porsche site and some trade articles! If they found there way to a site like this I think they would not know what to do with themselves!
the lack of dealer and sales people participation.
seems like there would be a bunch of posters from dealers!
making contacts and learning.
as far as i can tell there is very few.
and the dealerships i have dealt with don't keep up with the site!
i have heard porsche has a forum for dealers and their sales people but apparently the public is not allowed.
i guess they just post to themselves !?!?
04-15-2006, 08:17 PM
#41
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I purchased my 997S cabrio from Porsche of Huntington, Long Island,NY. The salesman was Jason Terrence. He did a great job explaining everything when I ordered the car, during the wait and at delivery. The dealership really treats customers well and has a first rate service department. Their salesmen are all sent for PCNA training when a new vehicle is launched. The only drawback is little to nothing off the list price.
Competition BMW of Smithtown is a first rate dealership also, with a really good service department.
Competition BMW of Smithtown is a first rate dealership also, with a really good service department.
04-15-2006, 08:48 PM
#42
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I can't rave enough about my local Porsche dealer. The last car I bought from them was a 2006 911 S Cabriolet, and I got the KBB value for my trade and $9k off sticker.
Of course, I have been a good customer for them, as they also have the M-B dealership as well. Over the past few years I've bought a GT3, CLK500, Carrera GT, Cayenne Turbo, and my current 911. Still, they are eager to deal, and I know that I can get just about anyone $3-5K off MSRP for most 911's if you're in the market. Other models may vary.
Of course, I have been a good customer for them, as they also have the M-B dealership as well. Over the past few years I've bought a GT3, CLK500, Carrera GT, Cayenne Turbo, and my current 911. Still, they are eager to deal, and I know that I can get just about anyone $3-5K off MSRP for most 911's if you're in the market. Other models may vary.
04-16-2006, 03:22 AM
#43
I didn't buy from dealer but had excellent service experience. I find issue with most salesperson no matter which brand of car they sell. They either:
1. don't know much about their car
2. don't know how to close the sale - ramble on about their personal opinion instead of focusing on the customer's needs
3. rude or careless - had a MB person who walked off after a test drive, no where to be found!
4. don't want you to drive without a price first - wtf is that?
My best sales experience is at Acura. I told him I'm not buying and he still spend 10min demonstrating the Nav. No sales pressure at all but he was there to help and didn't ignore me. Lexus wasn't so great bc sales just give short test drives.
1. don't know much about their car
2. don't know how to close the sale - ramble on about their personal opinion instead of focusing on the customer's needs
3. rude or careless - had a MB person who walked off after a test drive, no where to be found!
4. don't want you to drive without a price first - wtf is that?
My best sales experience is at Acura. I told him I'm not buying and he still spend 10min demonstrating the Nav. No sales pressure at all but he was there to help and didn't ignore me. Lexus wasn't so great bc sales just give short test drives.
04-16-2006, 06:17 AM
#44
Originally Posted by icon
that is something i thought was odd since i have been posting on rennlist!
the lack of dealer and sales people participation.
seems like there would be a bunch of posters from dealers!
making contacts and learning.
as far as i can tell there is very few.
and the dealerships i have dealt with don't keep up with the site!
i have heard porsche has a forum for dealers and their sales people but apparently the public is not allowed.
i guess they just post to themselves !?!?
the lack of dealer and sales people participation.
seems like there would be a bunch of posters from dealers!
making contacts and learning.
as far as i can tell there is very few.
and the dealerships i have dealt with don't keep up with the site!
i have heard porsche has a forum for dealers and their sales people but apparently the public is not allowed.
i guess they just post to themselves !?!?
04-16-2006, 07:21 AM
#45
I've gone to Len Stoler in MD a couple of times and I really enjoyed the experience. It's been almost two years since I was last there and maybe things have changed because of new people, but when I was there I was treated like royalty even though I had never bought a car there before. I was given a tour of their new facilities, was introduced to their Porsche Service writer, and met the Porsche Certified Mechanics and Porsche GM. Complimentary beverages were always being offered, and they even invited me to take the 996 on an overnight extended test drive to make certain that it was the car for me.