roll bar for cab?
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Instructor
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: East Bay, CA
roll bar for cab?
Has anyone done track day with PCA or outside with a cab?
I read that some clubs and tracks require “Open cars with roll bar/protection”
Does a stock cab fit the requirement? If not, how difficult is a roll bar to install and remove?
I read that some clubs and tracks require “Open cars with roll bar/protection”
Does a stock cab fit the requirement? If not, how difficult is a roll bar to install and remove?
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From: In a van down by the Ottawa River ...
Last year when I asked this same question, I was told by Bob Rouleau, PCA Rennsport Region's Director of Driver Education, that the 997 Cabs do qualify for PCA DE track events, as long as the soft top is up, you have a Snell approved helmet and a pre-track inspection.
Whether this differs from other PCA regional policy...
Whether this differs from other PCA regional policy...
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From: Raleigh, NC
PCA Requires "factory roll over protection". Thus, from PCA's standpoint, Boxsters, 996 and 997 cabriolets may be used for drivers ed, with the top up (protection from thrown debris). Various tracks have their own policies. In the Southeast, for example, VIR requires a rollbar, whereas Rockingham does not. Each PCA Region may also have its own requirements.
Jerry (Hurricane Region, PCA, President)
Jerry (Hurricane Region, PCA, President)
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Instructor
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: East Bay, CA
Thanks for the inputs. So if I understand correctly, stock cab meets the “factory roll over protection” under PCA rule, but it may not be enough to meet the “open top/ protection” rule of the track.
So, if PCA has a DE event on that track, PCA rules apply but if you go to the same track with a different club, it may not be allowed?
Is the rule subject to individual PCA regional interpretation? If the technical director changes, does the rule change also. Shouldn’t Porsche definitively say that their cab is designed to protect the driver in the case of a roll over so it meets all roll over protection requirements?
Sorry, but I am still confussed.
So, if PCA has a DE event on that track, PCA rules apply but if you go to the same track with a different club, it may not be allowed?
Is the rule subject to individual PCA regional interpretation? If the technical director changes, does the rule change also. Shouldn’t Porsche definitively say that their cab is designed to protect the driver in the case of a roll over so it meets all roll over protection requirements?
Sorry, but I am still confussed.
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From: Raleigh, NC
The track rules take precidence over PCA rules. Hence, if PCA has an event at a track which requires a roll bar/cage, all cabriolet attendees must meet the track requirement. The PCA rules are a minimum requirement for the Regions. A given Region's DE chair or board has the discretion of more stringent requirements. The PCA requirements are for purposes of PCA provided event insurance. My best advice is to check with the organizers of each event for their policy in this regard. Also, consider that when rollbars or cages are required, the "broomstick test" is often applied; i.e. the occupants heads with helmet on, must be below a line running from the top of the windshield to the top of the rollbar or cage (the "broomstick" is the line). Having never seen the emergency roll bars deployed on the newer cabriolets ( and I hope I never do), my concern would be for tall individuals who's helmet may be the high point in a rollover.
Jerry
Jerry
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So,--is the hardtop a suitable substitute?
Many years ago when Porsche first cabriolet'ed the 911 they automatically included pickup point for factory roll bars. I'm guessing those days are long gone, with the inclusion of the automated deployable protective bars.
dan
Many years ago when Porsche first cabriolet'ed the 911 they automatically included pickup point for factory roll bars. I'm guessing those days are long gone, with the inclusion of the automated deployable protective bars.
dan
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From: Tobacco Road, NC
I couldn't answer that definitively. My local PCA Chapter (las vegas region) has the rule of CAB's can run only on models that have the popup protection (nothing before 996). I just put on the hartop for added safety. I don't trust the popups as far as I can throw them! We have several people though that run without hartops and run with the tops down!!! That I will never understand.
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SCCA PDX
Level 1 (PDX) - At Level 1 events, any car that is street legal will be waived
from the roll bar/roll cage requirement, except for Convertibles and Targa top automobiles. These cars must have either a roll bar meeting Section 18 of the TTR or a factory hard top using the factory mounting hardware and mounting points. No exceptions to this rule allowed. For the purposes of this determination only, street legal will be defined as a car which
meets local requirements for inspection (if applicable) and the car in question must possess CURRENT, VALID registration.
So it seems that you cab owners who want to play with SCCA..need to get a removable hard top for your cab.
Level 1 (PDX) - At Level 1 events, any car that is street legal will be waived
from the roll bar/roll cage requirement, except for Convertibles and Targa top automobiles. These cars must have either a roll bar meeting Section 18 of the TTR or a factory hard top using the factory mounting hardware and mounting points. No exceptions to this rule allowed. For the purposes of this determination only, street legal will be defined as a car which
meets local requirements for inspection (if applicable) and the car in question must possess CURRENT, VALID registration.
So it seems that you cab owners who want to play with SCCA..need to get a removable hard top for your cab.
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From: Raleigh, NC
Please note that at the tracks with which I am familiar, that require a rollbar or cage, the factory hardtop is NOT an acceptable solution. Again, check with the event organizers before sending in your money.
Jerry
Jerry
