OCBen

I’ve always been a fan of automatic transmissions ever since I was impressed as a kid by the mean patch of rubber laid down by a posi-traction MoPar automatic – a Dodge Charger, I believe it was, an orange one – the fastest, baddest car around our neck of the woods. As kids on our bikes we used to fantasize about someday having a stick-shift Chevy or Mustang. Manual trannies with Hurst shifters ruled! That is, until that day our jaws dropped and our illusions were shattered by the awesome power of that MoPar automatic.

I realized later, of course, that it was due to the tremendous power of that hemi engine that made the automatic appear superior to a manual. And as a mechanical engineering student I learned to appreciate the labor saving work that machines can do for us, even though it aways comes at a price. So it really wasn’t a difficult decision for me to choose an automatic as my first sports car as a college graduate – my current daily driver, my ‘85 300ZX. Having an automatic as a daily driver sure makes the hassle of stop-and-go, bumper-to-bumper driving a lot easier to live with. And when I would get on it for an occasional street race the automatic would shift crisply (sometimes breaking the tires loose) at optimum shift points without the worry of ever missing a shift (obviously). Three transmissions later (I gave up street racing after the last one died on me) I became convinced that Nissan didn’t build their slush boxes as robust as those, say, on a Corvette. It seemed that since the overwhelming majority of their Z cars would be sold as manuals, that little R&D was spent on developing a truly robust automatic. Which leads me to wonder about the robustness of the Tiptronic that Porsche designed for the 911. Did the 911 Tiptronic, like the Z car automatic, get short shrift attention from their engineers, since the 911 would be overwhelming produced as a 6 speed version? Or was adequate R&D performed on the Tiptronic to be worthy of the name Porsche?

I know there have been articles written on the Tiptronic and how well it performs. But I’d like to hear from you guys who have a Tip on your 997 and who also had a Tip on a 996 – all three of you, if that many. If my fortunes were to change for the better (lotto winner hopeful) I would buy myself a Tip 997 as a daily driver and keep my 6 speed as the weekend car that it currently is.

Tip owners, how does your automatic shift compared to other automatics that you’ve owned or own? When you punch it, do the gears seem to shift at optimum power points on the power curve? Is it a pure joy to drive as it seems it would be? That’s what I would like to know.

Alan Smithee

I responded to a post the other day regarding my loathing of the 997's Tiptronic. I haven't driven a 996 Tip, so I can't compare them...but from what I've read the 997's is better. However, it is, in my opinion, poor.

In daily driving it starts in 2nd gear, which effectively makes it a 4-speed automatic. Manually selecting 1st at anything more than a dead stop results in a 'thunk'. Keeping it in 2nd (at least in our base 997) leaves a huge flat spot between 2k and 3k RPM. Without a heavy foot on the throttle, it will upshift at the very earliest opportunity, dropping down to lugging-range under 2k RPM after a very long, slurring shift. It annoys me that there is no way to shift the gears manually with the stick, and that the transmission is very slow to react to the steering wheel switches.

When driven aggressively (beyond what other drivers and the authorities will find acceptable), the shifts firm up and the Tiptronic switches respond more immediately. But with both hands on the wheel, diving for apexes, the switches aren't conveniently located, requiring an awkward contortion to reach with the thumbs. Paddles behind the wheel would work better.

As for 'robustness', ours failed at 6k miles, requiring a 10-day stay at the dealership for a new one to arrive from Germany.

To sum it up for me, around town, which is when an automatic is handy, the Tiptronic is awful. When driven hard, when I'd rather have a manual, the Tiptronic is OK. I'd say keep your 997S with sport shift, and buy a version of Chrysler's SRT-8 for your auto-tranny tire-burning fun.

boolala

Just how complicated is this anyway? Just put the transmission in manual mode (gear shift lever toward the driver). It will not upshift unless you hit the rev limiter. It will, however, downshift if you fail to do so when slowing down. If you want the car to start in 1st gear just put it in first gear when idling. Until you shift it will stay in 1st gear to 7200 rpm.

Even in fully automatic mode the transmission is very responsive and will routinely rev to 6000 - 7000 rpm under hard acceleration. If yours doesn't do this then it's broken. I can't compare it to the 996 but compared to other automatics I've driven this one begs to be driven hard and will delay upshifts to a much greater extent even in fully automatic mode.

The tip is an adaptive transmission so that if you do not drive the car agressively upshifts will occur sooner than if you do. Maybe you are babying the car. Like I said just put the car in manual mode and the problem is solved.

fast1

I have always been a die hard manual tranny guy, but the automatics have improved so much that I definately would buy one if I encountered stop and go traffic on a regular basis. Many high end manufacturers are offering six and even seven speed auto trannies. Although I never drove an automatic in a 997, I did drive a 996 auto which I thought was acceptable but that could have been because I had such low expectations.

About three weeks ago I drove a friend's Miata with an auto, and I had a blast. I don't know why but IMO MIata builds the best transmissions out there, at least compared to the ones I've driven. BTW the Miata is a blast to drive on the streets. If the Miata had around 225 HP instead of the 170, I'd buy one in a heart beat.

baboou

PDE uses the Boxster Tip for their autocross sessions. I found it very responsive under those conditions. As I recall we used it in manual mode but stayed in 2nd gear. That said, I agree with Alan. I had an early '97 Boxster Tip for a short period and really did not like the tranny. To me it was very sluggish. Now, if PAG ever gets around to using a DSG type trans, I'm in.

OCBen

Gee Alan, sorry to hear about your bad luck with your tranny. I hope the new one will last much longer. It's not clear from your post if you're waiting to get your car back with the new tranny installed. I'm hoping the new one will work better for you.

For around town here in the LA area with stop-and-go traffic everywhere you turn, an automatic makes the daily commute at least tolerable. Clutch-in, clutch-out, clutch-in, clutch-out gets old real fast, as well as tiring.

Larry Harris

Alan makes some valid points in his discussion of the TIP. Can't easily reach the steering wheel shifter during a hard 90 degree corner. My wife has a 06 Boxster S with the TIP. I hate how it starts out in 2nd... reminds me of an old Chevy powerglide. Once onderway the tranny is fine and she wanted an automatic.
I had an 01 TT with a TIP and the horsepower of the car more than compensated for any perceived deficencies with the trans.

equ

No experience with porsche tips but I have liked the bmw automatic in sports mode on the z4 drive. Can't remember if it actually kept in 1st, but it did keep revs nicely but not ridiculously high. Sort of how I would drive within the bounds of reason with people around me - acceptable fun. It even downshifted slowing/coasting towards a light, allowing for quick getaways when traffic cleared up. I didn't like the manual override due to the delay, just leave it in sports and forget. I guess most auto bmws must have it this good. (I have so little experience with slushies that I may have been easily impressed).

OCBen

I think BMW might have spent more time and money on developing a decent automatic. From what I've been hearing here so far, the Porsche Tip is nothing to write home about, which is really a disappointment to hear. Guess the 6 speed is the only way to go with a 911, unless you have the Turbo which will more than compensate for any deficiencies, according to Larry. That's too bad.

Anybody here have or have owned a 'Vette with an automatic? I hear those slush boxes are pretty good torque converters.

boolala

Sometimes on these boards I get the funny feeling I'm talking to a brick wall.

Listen up: If you put it in manual mode it won't upshift until it hits the rev limiter.

So what's the problem again??

OCBen

You're talking about when you floor it, right? ... That under hard acceleration - pedal to the metal - that it won't shift until 2nd until the revs hit close to 7000 rpms, right? But I think these guys are complaining about when they take off under normal acceleration that the tranny either starts out in 2nd or shifts too prematurely on all the upshifts, thus making the tranny sluggish in performance.

boolala

No. That's not what I'm talking about. What I am saying is that the tip can be placed into "manual" mode. This is done by pushing the shift lever to the manual position closest to the driver. (The gear choices look like this:
----P
----N
----R
M--D

When in (M)anual mode the transmission will not upshift unless you 1) hit the rev limiter or 2) choose to do so by using the steering wheel controls. If you want to start out in 1st gear then keep it in M and downshift to 1st. That's it.

When in manual mode kickdown is not operative. All of this is explained in the owners's manual p 144 - 145 (2005 version).

Now it is also true that upshifts will be delayed while in fully automatic mode (D) when driving agressively. In fact during the 2000 mi breakin period I had trouble keeping the revs below 4200. Even mild passing maneuvers would rev the engine beyond this point and I had to be careful.

Ray G

Trivia: the auto tranny in the 996/997 is actually made by Mercedes.

I don't remember driving a 911 with tip, but I drive my Cayenne Turbo, and it is one of the least responsive auto trannies I've ever driven. And the steering wheel buttons are stupid. They should be paddles or buttons on the back of the wheel, where you don't accidentally hit them.

AS

hv any of you tried 'tip' on a multifunction s/wheel?? that thing's got so many little buttons, it's like playing sony playstation!!

peddles &/or buttons behind s/wheel would be so much more ergonomic.
or very least porsche should hv done is to allow for manual shifting at gear lever.

rdstemler

I had the Tip on my O2C2 and while I never missed a downshift at the track I twas replaced and sent back to Mercedes at about 12,000 miles. I'd rate it a neutral as a must have option. Make it your personal preference, or not!!

It is really a 4 speed automatic. It seems to be missing a gear in the mid ranges.