Strange 997S Handling Characteristics...
08-30-2005, 01:15 PM
#31
Banned
Yeah, I'd really like to go to PDE someday. I'd rather learn and experience the 997 limits on a rental before even considering doing so on my own car.
I wonder when would be the best time of the year to go to find climate conditions close to So. Cal's. Maybe in the spring. I guess it goes without saying that right now is not a good time to be there.
I wonder when would be the best time of the year to go to find climate conditions close to So. Cal's. Maybe in the spring. I guess it goes without saying that right now is not a good time to be there.
08-30-2005, 09:05 PM
#32
One more question -- Does a Carrera 4 exhibit the same understeer characteristics as a Carrera 2? In other words, since the C4 has power going to the front wheels, do the front wheels bite better than a C2 if one were to apply the throttle during a mid-corner understeer event?
08-30-2005, 09:58 PM
#33
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Originally Posted by eilig
One more question -- Does a Carrera 4 exhibit the same understeer characteristics as a Carrera 2? In other words, since the C4 has power going to the front wheels, do the front wheels bite better than a C2 if one were to apply the throttle during a mid-corner understeer event?
Are you overdriving the car?So far you are the only one to really express this problem.
That said nobody can really compare a 997S to a 997/4s since they are not out yet....but you can read this:
Carrera 4S Excellence Article
08-31-2005, 12:01 AM
#34
No "problem" per se... just doing my best to try and understand these P-cars. This is an entirely new driving experience for me, so apologies for the plethora of questions.
I know the 997 C4 isn't out yet -- I was asking relative to anyone who may have some driving experience with a 996 C4.
Thanks again for everyone's input -- greatly appreciated from a "newbie."
I know the 997 C4 isn't out yet -- I was asking relative to anyone who may have some driving experience with a 996 C4.
Thanks again for everyone's input -- greatly appreciated from a "newbie."
08-31-2005, 08:06 AM
#35
Rennlist Member
it was said above,..... i would like to say again....SLOW IN FAST OUT...the car has the torque to handle almost anygear ....brake smoothly but firmly....i dont like the term " brake hard" little trail brake through the corner letting the front wheels bite unwind steering wheel while applying gas...
very simple technique ... amount of throttle is relitive to the amount of steering imput...
the cars are fantasticly designed .....
get some instuction from an instuctor who is familar with 911's.... it is the best 350.00 you can invest in.... 75,000. 00 + for a car ...but people wont invest 350.00 in local PCA DE event .....i will never understand it???? people drive these cars every day and really dont take the time to learn to drive them properly...
the public road you will never nevr understand the car or its potential nor should you try to do on public road ...just my 2 cents
try it once you will never forget the excitement of the track... its was designed to be Driven
have fun and be safe
very simple technique ... amount of throttle is relitive to the amount of steering imput...
the cars are fantasticly designed .....
get some instuction from an instuctor who is familar with 911's.... it is the best 350.00 you can invest in.... 75,000. 00 + for a car ...but people wont invest 350.00 in local PCA DE event .....i will never understand it???? people drive these cars every day and really dont take the time to learn to drive them properly...
the public road you will never nevr understand the car or its potential nor should you try to do on public road ...just my 2 cents
try it once you will never forget the excitement of the track... its was designed to be Driven
have fun and be safe
08-31-2005, 09:25 AM
#36
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Alignment is important. Porsche will do it for you at 2,000 miles at no charge. At that time you can decide where you want to be. Check the price of the tires before you make large changes and see if you want to go there. I chose the "save the tires" setting and drive on the track on slicks. The car handles great and I am saving money. When the price of the tires come down I will align the car again.
10-24-2005, 01:56 PM
#37
As a POST-SCRIPT to this thread, I just wanted to provide this final update....
I have my car in for an oil-change today, and the service manager called me with a finding. They discovered the rear "toe" had been bent at some point, which most likely was causing the "squirrly" feeling I had experienced with the car. They are replacing the part for a cost of $300, and doing an alignment.
I'm not exactly sure what the "toe" is -- something in the rear suspension or rear end linkage. I will explore further when I pick the car up later today. But wanted to pass this along, as it's been sort of a "mystery" for the last couple of months since I made the original post.
When I replaced the factory rubber with Pirelli's a couple weeks ago, this problem was significantly reduced. More than likely, the new rubber was just gripping more, but the source of the problem was still there. Can't wait to pick her up tonight and see what she feels like with this finally fixed!
I have my car in for an oil-change today, and the service manager called me with a finding. They discovered the rear "toe" had been bent at some point, which most likely was causing the "squirrly" feeling I had experienced with the car. They are replacing the part for a cost of $300, and doing an alignment.
I'm not exactly sure what the "toe" is -- something in the rear suspension or rear end linkage. I will explore further when I pick the car up later today. But wanted to pass this along, as it's been sort of a "mystery" for the last couple of months since I made the original post.
When I replaced the factory rubber with Pirelli's a couple weeks ago, this problem was significantly reduced. More than likely, the new rubber was just gripping more, but the source of the problem was still there. Can't wait to pick her up tonight and see what she feels like with this finally fixed!
10-24-2005, 02:11 PM
#38
Banned
Originally Posted by eilig
They discovered the rear "toe" had been bent at some point, which most likely was causing the "squirrly" feeling I had experienced with the car. They are replacing the part for a cost of $300, and doing an alignment.
10-24-2005, 02:17 PM
#39
Mine is a launch car that I bought from a buddy. It had around 4k when I got it, so most likely he bent it somehow. Looking forward to talking with him and finding out whether he nailed a curb or something at some point...
10-24-2005, 02:30 PM
#40
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Originally Posted by eilig
As a POST-SCRIPT to this thread, I just wanted to provide this final update....
I have my car in for an oil-change today, and the service manager called me with a finding. They discovered the rear "toe" had been bent at some point, which most likely was causing the "squirrly" feeling I had experienced with the car. They are replacing the part for a cost of $300, and doing an alignment.
I'm not exactly sure what the "toe" is -- something in the rear suspension or rear end linkage. I will explore further when I pick the car up later today. But wanted to pass this along, as it's been sort of a "mystery" for the last couple of months since I made the original post.
When I replaced the factory rubber with Pirelli's a couple weeks ago, this problem was significantly reduced. More than likely, the new rubber was just gripping more, but the source of the problem was still there. Can't wait to pick her up tonight and see what she feels like with this finally fixed!
I have my car in for an oil-change today, and the service manager called me with a finding. They discovered the rear "toe" had been bent at some point, which most likely was causing the "squirrly" feeling I had experienced with the car. They are replacing the part for a cost of $300, and doing an alignment.
I'm not exactly sure what the "toe" is -- something in the rear suspension or rear end linkage. I will explore further when I pick the car up later today. But wanted to pass this along, as it's been sort of a "mystery" for the last couple of months since I made the original post.
When I replaced the factory rubber with Pirelli's a couple weeks ago, this problem was significantly reduced. More than likely, the new rubber was just gripping more, but the source of the problem was still there. Can't wait to pick her up tonight and see what she feels like with this finally fixed!
Please tell us how you like the car once this is fixed and the car is properly aligned.
10-24-2005, 08:20 PM
#42
Race Director
Originally Posted by 930man
it was said above,..... i would like to say again....SLOW IN FAST OUT...the car has the torque to handle almost anygear ....brake smoothly but firmly....i dont like the term " brake hard" little trail brake through the corner letting the front wheels bite unwind steering wheel while applying gas...
very simple technique ... amount of throttle is relitive to the amount of steering imput...
the cars are fantasticly designed .....
get some instuction from an instuctor who is familar with 911's.... it is the best 350.00 you can invest in.... 75,000. 00 + for a car ...but people wont invest 350.00 in local PCA DE event .....i will never understand it???? people drive these cars every day and really dont take the time to learn to drive them properly...
the public road you will never nevr understand the car or its potential nor should you try to do on public road ...just my 2 cents
try it once you will never forget the excitement of the track... its was designed to be Driven
have fun and be safe
very simple technique ... amount of throttle is relitive to the amount of steering imput...
the cars are fantasticly designed .....
get some instuction from an instuctor who is familar with 911's.... it is the best 350.00 you can invest in.... 75,000. 00 + for a car ...but people wont invest 350.00 in local PCA DE event .....i will never understand it???? people drive these cars every day and really dont take the time to learn to drive them properly...
the public road you will never nevr understand the car or its potential nor should you try to do on public road ...just my 2 cents
try it once you will never forget the excitement of the track... its was designed to be Driven
have fun and be safe
The car is phenomenally capable. More than you will ever hope to experience on the street.
10-24-2005, 08:46 PM
#43
Rennlist Member
First, Djantiv couldn't be more wrong. Adding throttle to an understeering car will make it understeer more, unless you have so much power you can break the rear tires loose- which a 997 can't do.
The real question about the apparant understeer you experienced is how fast you were cornering. If you were at 9/10 or above ( near racing speeds), you could experience major understeer coasting, but more typically the throttle-off position encourages oversteer, i.e. the nose tucks into the corne(due to weight shifter forward)r. If you were down to fast street speeds, which are characteristically 6/10 of maximum, this behavior suggests something slippery on the road (sand, oil, coolant), or something binding in the front suspension- the equivalent of the front spring rate approacing infinity.
You need a big open parking lot to drive the car in a circle with increasing speeds to find out if it is handling properly. Do the circle in both directions. It would be possible for your own fuel, leaking out of the filler neck to do this (tho more typically it effects rear wheel traction). Look at the pavement after your test to see if there are any clues. AS
The real question about the apparant understeer you experienced is how fast you were cornering. If you were at 9/10 or above ( near racing speeds), you could experience major understeer coasting, but more typically the throttle-off position encourages oversteer, i.e. the nose tucks into the corne(due to weight shifter forward)r. If you were down to fast street speeds, which are characteristically 6/10 of maximum, this behavior suggests something slippery on the road (sand, oil, coolant), or something binding in the front suspension- the equivalent of the front spring rate approacing infinity.
You need a big open parking lot to drive the car in a circle with increasing speeds to find out if it is handling properly. Do the circle in both directions. It would be possible for your own fuel, leaking out of the filler neck to do this (tho more typically it effects rear wheel traction). Look at the pavement after your test to see if there are any clues. AS
10-24-2005, 09:52 PM
#44
Got back from the dealership. They showed me the alignment numbers WITH the bent toe link -- they were WAY off. After replacing the toe link and having a 4 wheel alignment, the difference is night and day! I took the car through my favorite cloverleaf on the way home -- phenomenal!
They kept the bent piece to show me -- wow, it's amazing how light that thing is.
Glad to finally have this problem licked!
(Just in time for the winter weather!)
They kept the bent piece to show me -- wow, it's amazing how light that thing is.
Glad to finally have this problem licked!
(Just in time for the winter weather!)
