997.2 GTS PDK or 6MT?
12-25-2020 | 02:38 AM
#46
Nordschleife Master
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,513
Likes: 1,069
From: Florida
Porsche is notorious for refusing to share any kind of statistics. Regardless of subject matter. Maybe the best example is how it seems impossible to find out when they scrapped the small fail prone IMS bearing once and for all on the 2005 cars and started installing the larger improved bearing with no exceptions. Should be easy enough to make an announcement along the lines of...."starting with VIN # xxxxxx or production date going forward, all 2005 or later 997's with the IMS bearing will have the larger improved bearing". I may have missed it but I've never seen such an announcement. Instead I've read countless posts from frustrated 2005 owners who's only option to find out which bearing they have is to find a lift and start taking things apart.
Whether accurate or not I recall reading more than one post here where a 2005 997 had the smaller fail prone bearing with a later production date than other 2005 997's which had the larger improved bearing.
As for manual vs. PDK ratio of cars produced, same thing. May have missed that too but I haven't seen an official number from Porsche but based on dealership's sales figures, most of what's being reported seem to suggest somewhere around 80% PDK vs. 20% manuals.
12-26-2020 | 12:27 AM
#47
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 1,878
Likes: 1,413
From: Kailua Beach, Oahu
Really quite informative and well articulated point-of-view! Really appreciate you taking the time to lay out your thoughts!
WRT to the turbo, you are spot on regarding the altitude’s effect on the power. I owned a Jeep Grand Cherokee w/ a Hemi V8 in it during the late 2000’s and decided to trade it in for a CRD when those launched. I could really notice the difference between the Turbo Diesel model and the naturally aspirated one. I then subsequently owned several TD SUVs (the Jeep GC CRD, Touareg TDI and Cayenne Sport Diesel) before options for the Cayenne ehybrid earlier this year and those have been my go to ski vehicles. Absolutely loved the Turbo Diesels on the uphills and never got passed by a huge Chevy, Dodge or Ford w/ normally aspirated V8s on the way up the hill when I didn’t want to get passed. The turbo, especially in the SUVs was a must for me at altitude. The ehybrid is functionally similar as the boost from the electric motor is agnostic to the altitude, so similar experience for me so far between the Turbo Diesels and the ehybrid. The ehybrid is obviously way quicker off the line than the Turbo Diesels though. That really sold me on making the move (especially after the emissions mods were completed on my Cayenne Diesel Sport).
I just drove a 2018 Cayenne e-hybrid in September. Impressive machine, but not nearly as engaging as my 2018 Macan GTS. I drove the Mcan extensively in the Alps after a Euro Delivery (ED) in 2017- bought an extra 3 months of insurance and put 4000miles on it. Took delivery in Atlanta (an alternative option when doing ED) and drove through 13 states, 9 National Parks...passing through the Appalachian Range, NM/CO/AZ Rocky Mountains and the Sierra Nevada (both the east and west slope between Lake Tahoe and Tehachapi Pass). Lots of high altitude passes, including Independence @ 12K' MSL that you mentioned. No power degradation issues with the Macan 3.6 turbo, whatsoever. Not so with my NA 997 GTS. There is a reason piston aircraft are turbo/supercharged- thin air robs power.
I test drove a few 911 turbos (996 and a 991)earlier this year and while the 991 was way more powerful than the 996, I found a similarity between both of the models I test drove: the unpredictability of when the turbo kicked in and the sheer impact of it kind of scared me a bit. Those cars were both scary fast. I like going fast and feeling the Gs when I accelerate, but those turbos seemed a bit over the top for me. Maybe in a more capable driver’s hands the impression might be different. I consider myself a pretty good driver, but realize that I am not in the same class as some of you who have more experience w/ 911s and have also spent time honing your driving skills on the track. When deciding between a 996 Turbo and the 997.1 C4S that predictability of the power delivery was kind of attractive to me. Plus, even at 8K’ above sea level, I felt like the car still has plenty of power and accelerates like no other car I’ve owned before. So I was happy w/ spending about $10k less to get into a more modern version of the 911, even considering some of the potential pitfalls w/ the .1 versions.
I totally agree with your preference for linear power delivery. I have flown several aircraft types with bizarre throttle/thrust lever- torque/thrust curves. As the operator, I want accurate, predictable power delivery- no more and no less than required. In a motor vehicle, mid-corner, at the edge of the lateral handling envelope, upsetting the chassis with a weight distribution change (and resulting change in traction coefficient) is not optimal.
Since I do live at altitude, I rarely have the same experience you described of feeling the loss of power at altitude. More likely that my experience might be the opposite of the one you described - I’d probably be positively surprised by the power output at sea level! I drove my C4S earlier this summer up to Summit county (going over Loveland pass) and then over Independence pass and back to Summit County and I really couldn’t feel much difference between driving around my hood (between 7k’ and 8k’ above sea level) and those passes that are all around 12k’ above sea level. Plus those roads typically have a 35mph or lower speed limit and even if I can push that envelope a bit when the roads are not busy (kind of rare on weekends) I probably wouldn’t be able to get much more out of the Turbo than a C4S or a GTS because of the constraints.
As far as "plenty of power" despite high altitude loss...I really only notice the loss when climbing. Not so much when accelerating on level or shallow grades. I relish having more power than I need in a given situation. Full throttle is rarely optimal, in my experience. Aircraft are seldom operated at maximum power- reduced power takeoffs are the norm. "Metal has a memory" is the mantra when describing turbine service life. Same concept applies to car engines. Launch control, drag races and stop light burn-outs are not the raison d'être of the 911. Precise power delivery is required to fully exploit the rear-engine, rear wheel-drive advantages of the 911. Race cars, with engine rebuilds between competitions, are the exception.
I do plan on driving my 997.1 C4S from Denver to Lake Tahoe and SF in the spring and taking I-70 to I-15 and then to Route 50 through northern Nevada. I just made that trip for the first time in my Cayenne this fall (have gone I-80 through SLC many times) and was just blown away by Route 50 through western Utah and Northern Nevada. It is just amazing with some twistees and incredible scenery. The Salt Flats west of SLC are cool, but once you’ve driven through them once it can get a bit boring. It’s a long way from SLC to the Nevada border when things get interesting again. Route 50 just kept me as a driver engaged the whole time. Can’t wait to do that drive w/ the top down and in nice weather later next year. I am also looking forward to taking my C4S up and down the PCH while in SF. I might finally get a chance to experience what you described on the way back home.
I agree that driving the entire length of US Highway 50 from Salina, Utah to Sacramento, California has some extended patches of pure desolation, but also scads of crazy amazing scenery- especially as you head further west. I drove my 997 GTS from Boston to Los Angeles after buying it. My wife and I took 3 months, avoiding interstates the entire way. It is a capable Gran Tourismo machine, covering huge distances in style and comfort. But it's also a true Sports car in mountain/canyon twisties. The model name is an accurate description of its attributes.
Anyway, that’s kind of how I got my sights set on the GTS. I want to get more experience driving my C4S and then eventually move up into the GTS if I can find one that fits my budget. I figure it might take a year or two to find what I will be eventually looking for (likely a 6 MT). Your argument for going w/ a 6MT given my context is really compelling. I am eventually going to have to drive some RWD cars to get a feel for the difference between those and my AWD before I commit to moving up to the GTS. I realize that taking my time may mean I pay a bigger premium down the road as it’s not clear that there is a lot of depreciation left in the 997.2 GTSs over the next couple of years.
Your plan makes sense. Ultimately, each of us has a unique set of vehicle capability requirements. The 997 GTS happens to fill most of my own squares. A Macan GTS fills the others (Off road capabiity, snow performance and cargo space amongst them.) Different strokes for different blokes, but it seems that enough 997 aficionados appreciate the GTS to prop up the resale valuations- at least over the past few years. If you want a well optioned 6MT 2WD Coupé with lower miles, be prepared to act quickly and pay the seller what he wants- a strategy that applies to most purchases of high demand/low supply items. Good luck with your search and enjoy your C4S.
WRT to the turbo, you are spot on regarding the altitude’s effect on the power. I owned a Jeep Grand Cherokee w/ a Hemi V8 in it during the late 2000’s and decided to trade it in for a CRD when those launched. I could really notice the difference between the Turbo Diesel model and the naturally aspirated one. I then subsequently owned several TD SUVs (the Jeep GC CRD, Touareg TDI and Cayenne Sport Diesel) before options for the Cayenne ehybrid earlier this year and those have been my go to ski vehicles. Absolutely loved the Turbo Diesels on the uphills and never got passed by a huge Chevy, Dodge or Ford w/ normally aspirated V8s on the way up the hill when I didn’t want to get passed. The turbo, especially in the SUVs was a must for me at altitude. The ehybrid is functionally similar as the boost from the electric motor is agnostic to the altitude, so similar experience for me so far between the Turbo Diesels and the ehybrid. The ehybrid is obviously way quicker off the line than the Turbo Diesels though. That really sold me on making the move (especially after the emissions mods were completed on my Cayenne Diesel Sport).
I just drove a 2018 Cayenne e-hybrid in September. Impressive machine, but not nearly as engaging as my 2018 Macan GTS. I drove the Mcan extensively in the Alps after a Euro Delivery (ED) in 2017- bought an extra 3 months of insurance and put 4000miles on it. Took delivery in Atlanta (an alternative option when doing ED) and drove through 13 states, 9 National Parks...passing through the Appalachian Range, NM/CO/AZ Rocky Mountains and the Sierra Nevada (both the east and west slope between Lake Tahoe and Tehachapi Pass). Lots of high altitude passes, including Independence @ 12K' MSL that you mentioned. No power degradation issues with the Macan 3.6 turbo, whatsoever. Not so with my NA 997 GTS. There is a reason piston aircraft are turbo/supercharged- thin air robs power.
I test drove a few 911 turbos (996 and a 991)earlier this year and while the 991 was way more powerful than the 996, I found a similarity between both of the models I test drove: the unpredictability of when the turbo kicked in and the sheer impact of it kind of scared me a bit. Those cars were both scary fast. I like going fast and feeling the Gs when I accelerate, but those turbos seemed a bit over the top for me. Maybe in a more capable driver’s hands the impression might be different. I consider myself a pretty good driver, but realize that I am not in the same class as some of you who have more experience w/ 911s and have also spent time honing your driving skills on the track. When deciding between a 996 Turbo and the 997.1 C4S that predictability of the power delivery was kind of attractive to me. Plus, even at 8K’ above sea level, I felt like the car still has plenty of power and accelerates like no other car I’ve owned before. So I was happy w/ spending about $10k less to get into a more modern version of the 911, even considering some of the potential pitfalls w/ the .1 versions.
I totally agree with your preference for linear power delivery. I have flown several aircraft types with bizarre throttle/thrust lever- torque/thrust curves. As the operator, I want accurate, predictable power delivery- no more and no less than required. In a motor vehicle, mid-corner, at the edge of the lateral handling envelope, upsetting the chassis with a weight distribution change (and resulting change in traction coefficient) is not optimal.
Since I do live at altitude, I rarely have the same experience you described of feeling the loss of power at altitude. More likely that my experience might be the opposite of the one you described - I’d probably be positively surprised by the power output at sea level! I drove my C4S earlier this summer up to Summit county (going over Loveland pass) and then over Independence pass and back to Summit County and I really couldn’t feel much difference between driving around my hood (between 7k’ and 8k’ above sea level) and those passes that are all around 12k’ above sea level. Plus those roads typically have a 35mph or lower speed limit and even if I can push that envelope a bit when the roads are not busy (kind of rare on weekends) I probably wouldn’t be able to get much more out of the Turbo than a C4S or a GTS because of the constraints.
As far as "plenty of power" despite high altitude loss...I really only notice the loss when climbing. Not so much when accelerating on level or shallow grades. I relish having more power than I need in a given situation. Full throttle is rarely optimal, in my experience. Aircraft are seldom operated at maximum power- reduced power takeoffs are the norm. "Metal has a memory" is the mantra when describing turbine service life. Same concept applies to car engines. Launch control, drag races and stop light burn-outs are not the raison d'être of the 911. Precise power delivery is required to fully exploit the rear-engine, rear wheel-drive advantages of the 911. Race cars, with engine rebuilds between competitions, are the exception.
I do plan on driving my 997.1 C4S from Denver to Lake Tahoe and SF in the spring and taking I-70 to I-15 and then to Route 50 through northern Nevada. I just made that trip for the first time in my Cayenne this fall (have gone I-80 through SLC many times) and was just blown away by Route 50 through western Utah and Northern Nevada. It is just amazing with some twistees and incredible scenery. The Salt Flats west of SLC are cool, but once you’ve driven through them once it can get a bit boring. It’s a long way from SLC to the Nevada border when things get interesting again. Route 50 just kept me as a driver engaged the whole time. Can’t wait to do that drive w/ the top down and in nice weather later next year. I am also looking forward to taking my C4S up and down the PCH while in SF. I might finally get a chance to experience what you described on the way back home.
I agree that driving the entire length of US Highway 50 from Salina, Utah to Sacramento, California has some extended patches of pure desolation, but also scads of crazy amazing scenery- especially as you head further west. I drove my 997 GTS from Boston to Los Angeles after buying it. My wife and I took 3 months, avoiding interstates the entire way. It is a capable Gran Tourismo machine, covering huge distances in style and comfort. But it's also a true Sports car in mountain/canyon twisties. The model name is an accurate description of its attributes.
Anyway, that’s kind of how I got my sights set on the GTS. I want to get more experience driving my C4S and then eventually move up into the GTS if I can find one that fits my budget. I figure it might take a year or two to find what I will be eventually looking for (likely a 6 MT). Your argument for going w/ a 6MT given my context is really compelling. I am eventually going to have to drive some RWD cars to get a feel for the difference between those and my AWD before I commit to moving up to the GTS. I realize that taking my time may mean I pay a bigger premium down the road as it’s not clear that there is a lot of depreciation left in the 997.2 GTSs over the next couple of years.
Your plan makes sense. Ultimately, each of us has a unique set of vehicle capability requirements. The 997 GTS happens to fill most of my own squares. A Macan GTS fills the others (Off road capabiity, snow performance and cargo space amongst them.) Different strokes for different blokes, but it seems that enough 997 aficionados appreciate the GTS to prop up the resale valuations- at least over the past few years. If you want a well optioned 6MT 2WD Coupé with lower miles, be prepared to act quickly and pay the seller what he wants- a strategy that applies to most purchases of high demand/low supply items. Good luck with your search and enjoy your C4S.
Last edited by Liste-Renn; 12-26-2020 at 04:57 PM.
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8KaboveMSL (12-27-2020)
12-26-2020 | 09:28 AM
#48
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Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 240
Likes: 95
From: ATL
Great thread! As an avid fan of the GTS spec, it's fun to read the insights. Wanted to share my thoughts on 8K's original two questions...
1) PDK or manual? I've driven both. I prefer manual. Many say it's about the feeling or connection to the car... which I agree with... to put a finer point on it, I think it's control. The manual gives me the ability to put the car in the part of the power band that I want, exactly when I want it there. In fairness, it's also bias for me. I learned to drive on a manual. In the 30+ years I've been driving since, my primary cars have all been manuals. Both of my kids had their first legal driving experience behind the wheel of my MT 997 GTS.
2) Is the GTS the right car for 8Ks profile? I say yes. 8K... I think we have very similar profiles. I've been on the track... in 911s even... but I much prefer a spirited drive through the Blue Ridge Mountains. There are also times when I want to road trip to a car event (e.g. Amelia Island Concours). The GTS straddles both use cases with ease. Porsche said it best... "The Performance Of A GT With The Streetability Of A Carrera". I'm such a fan of the GTS spec that I recently added a 991.1 GTS to my garage, and started blogging about the experiences as a passion project... GTSence.com... this thread has given me a few topic ideas!
The second part of your second question was C4S vs. GTS. Others have commented here, so I'll simply reiterate. I think the two biggest factors are steering feel between AWD vs. 2WD and power delivery since the X51 brings peak power 200 revs earlier... though your C4S may be an X51 car? Everything else is design related... alcantara, fascia, centerlocks. One factor that I don't think has been covered is AWD vs. 2WD in your climate. Though I like the simplicity and feel of 2WD, if I were driving the 911 in snow/ice, then I might prefer AWD...
1) PDK or manual? I've driven both. I prefer manual. Many say it's about the feeling or connection to the car... which I agree with... to put a finer point on it, I think it's control. The manual gives me the ability to put the car in the part of the power band that I want, exactly when I want it there. In fairness, it's also bias for me. I learned to drive on a manual. In the 30+ years I've been driving since, my primary cars have all been manuals. Both of my kids had their first legal driving experience behind the wheel of my MT 997 GTS.
2) Is the GTS the right car for 8Ks profile? I say yes. 8K... I think we have very similar profiles. I've been on the track... in 911s even... but I much prefer a spirited drive through the Blue Ridge Mountains. There are also times when I want to road trip to a car event (e.g. Amelia Island Concours). The GTS straddles both use cases with ease. Porsche said it best... "The Performance Of A GT With The Streetability Of A Carrera". I'm such a fan of the GTS spec that I recently added a 991.1 GTS to my garage, and started blogging about the experiences as a passion project... GTSence.com... this thread has given me a few topic ideas!
The second part of your second question was C4S vs. GTS. Others have commented here, so I'll simply reiterate. I think the two biggest factors are steering feel between AWD vs. 2WD and power delivery since the X51 brings peak power 200 revs earlier... though your C4S may be an X51 car? Everything else is design related... alcantara, fascia, centerlocks. One factor that I don't think has been covered is AWD vs. 2WD in your climate. Though I like the simplicity and feel of 2WD, if I were driving the 911 in snow/ice, then I might prefer AWD...
12-26-2020 | 12:15 PM
#49
Banned
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 2,467
Likes: 1,098
From: Southern California
I have a 2007 C4S cab manual and loved it. I bought it in Utah and drove it home to So Cal and that was a blast. I didn't think I would like AWD but now I'm a big fan. I saw a 2015 GTS PDK cab for sale that was amazing at a great price and they offered me a trade-in that was almost what I bought my 2007 for,so I jumped on it. The 991.1 is so beautiful to drive, quieter, amazing engine sound...I mean really amazing but larger and not as visceral.
So I bought a 2012 GTS coupe 6spd. I missed the small form factor. While it does have a broader power band and is wonderful the 997.1 C4S had more induction noise and was no slouch. And it was fun to wring the power out of it. I think the 997 form is so in-tune with a manual, but if I had to daily drive my car in Los Angeles there's no way I'd do it. I'd want a PDK.
So I bought a 2012 GTS coupe 6spd. I missed the small form factor. While it does have a broader power band and is wonderful the 997.1 C4S had more induction noise and was no slouch. And it was fun to wring the power out of it. I think the 997 form is so in-tune with a manual, but if I had to daily drive my car in Los Angeles there's no way I'd do it. I'd want a PDK.
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8KaboveMSL (12-27-2020)
12-27-2020 | 03:06 AM
#50
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,513
Likes: 1,069
From: Florida
Great thread! As an avid fan of the GTS spec, it's fun to read the insights. Wanted to share my thoughts on 8K's original two questions...
1) PDK or manual? I've driven both. I prefer manual. Many say it's about the feeling or connection to the car... which I agree with... to put a finer point on it, I think it's control. The manual gives me the ability to put the car in the part of the power band that I want, exactly when I want it there. In fairness, it's also bias for me. I learned to drive on a manual. In the 30+ years I've been driving since, my primary cars have all been manuals. Both of my kids had their first legal driving experience behind the wheel of my MT 997 GTS..
1) PDK or manual? I've driven both. I prefer manual. Many say it's about the feeling or connection to the car... which I agree with... to put a finer point on it, I think it's control. The manual gives me the ability to put the car in the part of the power band that I want, exactly when I want it there. In fairness, it's also bias for me. I learned to drive on a manual. In the 30+ years I've been driving since, my primary cars have all been manuals. Both of my kids had their first legal driving experience behind the wheel of my MT 997 GTS..
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12-27-2020 | 05:06 AM
#51
Racer
Joined: May 2020
Posts: 463
Likes: 109
In my opinion there is no real difference..
The PDK feels and sounds like a traditional manual, even while downshifting the PDK gives you much more option to concentrate on the driving lines (as in all GT car/gt3rs/gt2rs/Cup and F1 that drive today with pedals in the steering wheel / SEQUENTIAL GEARBOX).
I personally really like the Manual transmission, but I definitely think the PDK provides the driver with pleasure and not boring (instead of the left leg there are cool pedals) and higher performance.
Any choice will be great.
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12-27-2020 | 12:11 PM
#52
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Joined: Jul 2016
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From: Kailua Beach, Oahu
I agree with the last two posts, but repeat that we are diving, not racing- so the milliseconds and concentration on the "line" are irrelevant.
I suppose it is an unquantifiable pleasure of interacting more directly with the machine.
Maybe why the 911R and 991 Speedster were not offered with a PDK?
I suppose it is an unquantifiable pleasure of interacting more directly with the machine.
Maybe why the 911R and 991 Speedster were not offered with a PDK?
Last edited by Liste-Renn; 12-27-2020 at 12:13 PM.
12-27-2020 | 12:18 PM
#53
Instructor
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 102
Likes: 26
I have nothing new to add to the PDK/Manual debate (I do have a manual GTS). On either version, I would strongly recommend the best bang for the buck modification which is the DSC Controller. Search this site for reviews.
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Darkhorse (08-05-2021)
12-27-2020 | 12:32 PM
#54
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From: Washington, DC
01-08-2021 | 05:02 PM
#55
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From: Washington, DC
Well, this is a 6MT GTS w/ 55k miles that just went for $66k on Pcarmarket. . .
https://www.pcarmarket.com/auction/2...gts-cabriolet/
So it is possible to get a 6MT below $70k. . . I may still be in the game. . . Although, @Darkhorse ‘s idea of just getting a really nicely appointed 6MT 997.2 is probably also a viable option in this price range and there are more 6MT 997.2s than there are 6MT 997.2 GTSs. . .
https://www.pcarmarket.com/auction/2...gts-cabriolet/
So it is possible to get a 6MT below $70k. . . I may still be in the game. . . Although, @Darkhorse ‘s idea of just getting a really nicely appointed 6MT 997.2 is probably also a viable option in this price range and there are more 6MT 997.2s than there are 6MT 997.2 GTSs. . .
01-08-2021 | 05:24 PM
#56
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Joined: Oct 2020
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From: Florida / North Carolina
Well, this is a 6MT GTS w/ 55k miles that just went for $66k on Pcarmarket. . .
https://www.pcarmarket.com/auction/2...gts-cabriolet/
So it is possible to get a 6MT below $70k. . . I may still be in the game. . . Although, @Darkhorse ‘s idea of just getting a really nicely appointed 6MT 997.2 is probably also a viable option in this price range and there are more 6MT 997.2s than there are 6MT 997.2 GTSs. . .
https://www.pcarmarket.com/auction/2...gts-cabriolet/
So it is possible to get a 6MT below $70k. . . I may still be in the game. . . Although, @Darkhorse ‘s idea of just getting a really nicely appointed 6MT 997.2 is probably also a viable option in this price range and there are more 6MT 997.2s than there are 6MT 997.2 GTSs. . .
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8KaboveMSL (01-10-2021)
01-08-2021 | 05:44 PM
#57
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Posts: 521
Likes: 166
From: LA
During my search for a GTS manual cabrio I too ended up buying one via CarMax - a 2012 RWD (odd but that's how the VIN decodes) manual with 2,000 miles (immaculate car in and out) in Guards Red for $74K. It was suddenly listed as I was browsing and I reserved it immediately. PPI showed that it was as-seen - immaculate with zero issues. I recommend that if you DO buy a CarMax car, take the warranty - for $3K it covers the majority of mechanical, with only a $50 deductible if you visit a Porsche dealer (you choose the dealer) for 75,000 miles or 5 years, whichever comes sooner. CarMax also worked with me on the tires, which were all 10 years old and shod me 4 new P-zero shoes for $270.
With 2000 miles in red 6MT, I think I found my OWN unicorn! And the prior owner optioned like I would - no power seats, auto-dimming mirrors or other fancy stuff, light as possible. Only the BOSE stereo, which thankfully has a 'bypass' option to get rid of that over-bassed, zero-mid sound - first BOSE stereo I have had that actually sounds reasonable and relatively neutral. Oh, and belts plus instrument surround in red, quite classy and sporty.
Great thread, BTW. The sound of PSE in second gear with top down, pulling out of a corner foot hard on the gas is exhilarating, to say the least (Trabuco Canyon for my fellow SOCAL folk). I had this cheesy grin the whole time. I'm grinning now at my desk thinking about it! Wow.
I agree with the poster who mentioned the more 'mechanical' sound of the GTS, it barks and growls, and steered me into one for my first Porsche. I came from the 'restorer' C3 Corvette world, and wrenching got a little dangerous on big block cars as I get older.
They are so well made compared to all the junk out there, aside from boutique stuff. I'm excited to be a Porsche owner.
With 2000 miles in red 6MT, I think I found my OWN unicorn! And the prior owner optioned like I would - no power seats, auto-dimming mirrors or other fancy stuff, light as possible. Only the BOSE stereo, which thankfully has a 'bypass' option to get rid of that over-bassed, zero-mid sound - first BOSE stereo I have had that actually sounds reasonable and relatively neutral. Oh, and belts plus instrument surround in red, quite classy and sporty.
Great thread, BTW. The sound of PSE in second gear with top down, pulling out of a corner foot hard on the gas is exhilarating, to say the least (Trabuco Canyon for my fellow SOCAL folk). I had this cheesy grin the whole time. I'm grinning now at my desk thinking about it! Wow.
I agree with the poster who mentioned the more 'mechanical' sound of the GTS, it barks and growls, and steered me into one for my first Porsche. I came from the 'restorer' C3 Corvette world, and wrenching got a little dangerous on big block cars as I get older.
They are so well made compared to all the junk out there, aside from boutique stuff. I'm excited to be a Porsche owner.
Last edited by 997.2GTS; 01-08-2021 at 05:47 PM.
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8KaboveMSL (01-10-2021)
01-08-2021 | 05:51 PM
#58
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Posts: 308
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From: Florida / North Carolina
I agree with the CarMax warranty 100%. I also like the 7 day return policy and the fact that they will reserve a car for you with no deposit and ship it to your nearest store for a very reasonable price. It was the best car buying experience I have had.
Maybe we should start a "GTS deals around the internet" thread.
Maybe we should start a "GTS deals around the internet" thread.
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01-08-2021 | 05:58 PM
#59
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Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 521
Likes: 166
From: LA
Right on. My buying experience was excellent, frankly - aside from waiting 28 days for the car. That 7 day return allowed me to drive it, check it out and get a PPI. There was some resistance on the tires (as the tread was 95% but cracks in the sipes) but they worked with me nicely, and even managed the centerlocks through dialogue, bought the right grease and all.
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8KaboveMSL (01-10-2021)
01-08-2021 | 07:28 PM
#60
Rennlist Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 547
Likes: 32
From: Manhattan Beach
Lol, I have a 6MT GTS cab and I daily mine in LA (pre COVID had a 1hr commute each way). Must be a glutton for punishment but when I work late and traffic is light, no better way to decompress than to drop the top and row the gears. It’s like surfing, can be having a total crap session but then that one great wave makes up for it...
So I bought a 2012 GTS coupe 6spd. I missed the small form factor. While it does have a broader power band and is wonderful the 997.1 C4S had more induction noise and was no slouch. And it was fun to wring the power out of it. I think the 997 form is so in-tune with a manual, but if I had to daily drive my car in Los Angeles there's no way I'd do it. I'd want a PDK.