Range 4 Alert
07-08-2020, 11:53 AM
#16
Rennlist Member
Seems improbable that the oil sensor is working fine now but didn't alert you for 600 miles and multiple starts before and during your track day.
Is there some way the missed shift caused the oil problem? The sequence of events you describe suggests that's what happened. If so, where could 3+ quarts of oil go between the missed shift and the restart -- into the coolant ? dumped onto the track ? out the tailpipes during the 3 track sessions?
Is there some way the missed shift caused the oil problem? The sequence of events you describe suggests that's what happened. If so, where could 3+ quarts of oil go between the missed shift and the restart -- into the coolant ? dumped onto the track ? out the tailpipes during the 3 track sessions?
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Doug H (07-08-2020)
07-08-2020, 12:08 PM
#17
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The range 4 by itself probably wasn't the cause of the motor failure. The range 4 combined with only half the oil capacity in the engine and doing multiple track sessions in that circumstance certainly was. At a minimum, you should drop the sump plate and see what kind of debris is in there.
It's surprising to me that you could go 600 miles over that period of time without ever once checking the oil level when you first get into the car, which is when it should be done on a 997.1. I do that as a matter of course each morning I get into my 997 before starting it.
Though the dealer may help you out to some extent because of your loyalty to them and them significantly underfilling the car with oil during the last service, the failure is really a result of you not checking the oil over the course of 600 miles of driving the car. Personally, had I had an oil change service done, I would have checked it when I first picked up the car to at least make sure they got it close even if not perfect before even driving it home.
Sorry to say, but I think you're out of luck on this one and that the motor has a major failure from the noises you're hearing.
If the engine still has the same oil in it, send a sample to Blackstone and let's see how much copper, iron, and aluminum is in it. That will likely tell us whether the failure is bearings or scored cylinders.
It's surprising to me that you could go 600 miles over that period of time without ever once checking the oil level when you first get into the car, which is when it should be done on a 997.1. I do that as a matter of course each morning I get into my 997 before starting it.
Though the dealer may help you out to some extent because of your loyalty to them and them significantly underfilling the car with oil during the last service, the failure is really a result of you not checking the oil over the course of 600 miles of driving the car. Personally, had I had an oil change service done, I would have checked it when I first picked up the car to at least make sure they got it close even if not perfect before even driving it home.
Sorry to say, but I think you're out of luck on this one and that the motor has a major failure from the noises you're hearing.
If the engine still has the same oil in it, send a sample to Blackstone and let's see how much copper, iron, and aluminum is in it. That will likely tell us whether the failure is bearings or scored cylinders.
You (unfortunately) have to assume that there's a very good chance that a mistake has been made somewhere in the process. Humans screw up. With a Porsche there of course can be big consequences.
07-08-2020, 12:25 PM
#18
RL Community Team
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Seems improbable that the oil sensor is working fine now but didn't alert you for 600 miles and multiple starts before and during your track day.
Is there some way the missed shift caused the oil problem? The sequence of events you describe suggests that's what happened. If so, where could 3+ quarts of oil go between the missed shift and the restart -- into the coolant ? dumped onto the track ? out the tailpipes during the 3 track sessions?
Is there some way the missed shift caused the oil problem? The sequence of events you describe suggests that's what happened. If so, where could 3+ quarts of oil go between the missed shift and the restart -- into the coolant ? dumped onto the track ? out the tailpipes during the 3 track sessions?
Dealership screwed it up by not filling it properly and OP messed up by not checking it for 600 miles and 3 track sessions. Likely there was already engine damage done before the track day from running the motor for 600 miles 3 or more quarts low.
07-08-2020, 04:59 PM
#19
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Can't see this as a possibility - 3-4 quarts of oil in either of these scenarios is technically a "****-ton". If it was being burned it would look like James Bond's car when he turns on the smoke screen toggle. If it was coming out the tailpipe, the car would have been black-flagged by the track officials when the cars behind him complained of oil all over their windshields and not being able to see anything. If it had migrated over to the coolant side, that milkshake would have come out the coolant reservoir overflow hose and then had the same effect as the previous possibility - black flagged.
Dealership screwed it up by not filling it properly and OP messed up by not checking it for 600 miles and 3 track sessions. Likely there was already engine damage done before the track day from running the motor for 600 miles 3 or more quarts low.
Dealership screwed it up by not filling it properly and OP messed up by not checking it for 600 miles and 3 track sessions. Likely there was already engine damage done before the track day from running the motor for 600 miles 3 or more quarts low.
Would seem equally impossible to drive 600 miles and then run 3 30 minute track sessions 4.5 quarts low. Then again, I have never tried it so perhaps it would be a non-issue . . . until its not.
I also think it equally impossible that a dealer would leave it 4.5 quarts short. Don't they have it electronically measured or are they actually opening a quart and pouring in? I thought it measured so as not to over fill, but that is based purely on hearsay or reading it on here as I never cared enough to ask.
Last edited by Doug H; 07-08-2020 at 06:00 PM.
07-08-2020, 05:50 PM
#20
RL Community Team
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Is there not a low oil light on the NA .1? Should it not light up at 1.5 quarts low?
Would seem equally impossible to drive 600 miles and then run 3 30 minute track sessions 4.5 quarts low. Then again, I have never tried it so perhaps it would be a non-issue . . . until its not.
I also think it equally impossible that a dealer would leave it 4.5 quarts short. Don't they have it electronically measured or are they actually opening a quart and pouring in? I thought it measured so as not to over fill, but that is based purely on hearsay or reading it it one here as I never cared enough to ask.
Would seem equally impossible to drive 600 miles and then run 3 30 minute track sessions 4.5 quarts low. Then again, I have never tried it so perhaps it would be a non-issue . . . until its not.
I also think it equally impossible that a dealer would leave it 4.5 quarts short. Don't they have it electronically measured or are they actually opening a quart and pouring in? I thought it measured so as not to over fill, but that is based purely on hearsay or reading it it one here as I never cared enough to ask.
I agree - this seems really weird. It's possible the oil level sensor tube is not working correctly so either the car was properly filled and that's why no error light and then when the OP went to check it at the track it was malfunctioning and wasn't actually that many quarts low and is now super over-filled. Actually having 4 quarts too much in it could cause a whole bunch of odd noises with the crankshaft lobes hitting the oil in the pan.
OP, before you go any further, I'd have the shop drain and measure the amount of oil they remove. If it's 8 quarts or so, that's about right. If they end up pulling 11 or 12 you'll know it was about right to start with and got way overfilled at the track.
The oil level sensor is not a great thing - the one in my wife's car tends to give odd readings. I'll cycle the key 3, 4, or 5 times until I get a few that show a consistent level. I'd replace it but you have to pull the intake manifold on that side to have enough room to get it out due to the length.
11-04-2020, 12:31 PM
#21
RL Community Team
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Any chance you had a GoPro mounted in the interior during the track sessions that would have had a view of the dash and the track during your sessions? Would be great to be able to see what the oil temp and oil pressure gauges were doing as you lapped the track.
