Hi there - I plan on installing a DAS roll bar with Recaro Pole Position seats to go with it. I also plan to run harnesses when attending an occasional DE.

A couple questions regarding the mounting points and setup.

1. I understand how the roll bar is to be set up. Rears attach to the strut towers, and the fronts attach to the existing seat belt mounting point at the B-pillar.
2. For the lap belts, I'm assuming the outer belt clips into the bracket of the roll bar, but how about the tunnel side? Is there an existing adapter that can be bolted to the actual tunnel? If so, can you share a link? All I'm finding are adapters that attach to the seat.
3. For the sub belts, are you all going with eye bolts directly to the floor, or are you using a sub belt bar that is integrated to the bottom of the seat?
4. Shoulder harnesses will be wrapped around the horizontal bar.

If you wouldn't mind sharing pics of the attachment points that you're running, it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Rob

 

Thanks for the question. I have the same ones!

 

Are you planning to use sliders? And what side mounts? How do you plan to attach the lap and sub belts? Will you retain the 3-point betls?

Oftentimes, side mounts have a mounting boss for attachment of the inboard lap belt, mimicking the factory arrangement. I'd recommend this approach if using sliders. Brey Krause 9075 mounts work with your seats and 996 (or early Audi TT) sliders, but I'm not sure if they have the mounting boss. If not, you can drill the side mount (potential clearance issues here) or use something like the Brey Krause 9005 bracket that attaches under the slider. The Brey Krause stuff is typically set up to mount simultaneously both the factory 3 points and the racing harnesses .

Alternatively, you could drill the tunnel--there's no existing hole--and use a backing plate; you'll need to access the inside of the tunnel. Seems like I remember seeing somewhere factory info on location for this on cup cars.

Regardless of which way you go, there may not be sufficient clearance between the seat and tunnel for an eye bolt and a clip-in end, so you may have to use a bolt-in end.

You can bolt the main hoop of the DAS roll bar to the B-pillar base with an eye bolt, and clip-in the outboard lap belt. For me, the belt geometry here was bad as the belt attaches pretty far rearward, so I used the Brey Krause 9005 bracket on the outboard side.

Again, no existing holes for mounting the sub belts. You'll have either have to drill the floor and use a backing plate, or use a sub bar that's compatible with your mounts. If using sliders, you'll want to use a bar; this necessitates wrapping instead of clipping-in due to space constraints.

I found Schroth's installation guide invaluable regarding belt geometry, proper wrapping, etc.: https://www.schrothracing.com/docs/C...structions.pdf The guys at HMS Motorsport and Brey Krause were also very helpful.

OP--where in Virginia are you. If you're close to either Richmond or the Middle Peninsula, I'd be happy for you look over my set up-- DAS bar, Sparco Evo 2s on BK mounts on Audi sliders. Also, I have a bunch of extra hardware that you can have if it's useful. PM me.

 

I'm in richmond Va too!

Either of you by chance running the ApexFest st NCCAR this weekend?

Cw

 

Thank you for the feedback MFGJR - I guess I left out some important details. Yes, I do plan to use sliders, and retain the 3 point belts, as the car is still street driven.

 

Ha! All Virginians here. I'm a VIR guy, will be there at the end of this month.

Let me know if I can help with anything.

 

I'm a VIR / Summit Point guy myself.

 

Fantastic. I've run all these tracks on the bike, but this is the first season with the 911. So looking forward to tackling all of them. I recommend you get to NCCAR. Tons of grip. Not as expansive or as "nice" as the others, but a great home track. Moreover, you should try and get up to PittRace. It's the best track I've been too. In my opinion, much better than VIR.

Cw

 

For the outer lap belts, I replaced the seat belt bolt with an eye bolt. For the inner lap belts, I used eye bolts mounted through the tunnel.

Passenger side sub straps used eye bolts mounted through the floor. This was very easy to do. On the driver's side I used a sub bar mounted to the seats since there is a module in the way that I didn't want to mess with.

 

Below are some pics from my installation, and some of the issues that I ran into. My set up is Sparco Evo IIs on Brey Krause 9761/9762 side mounts on 1st generation Audi TT sliders. (The Audi sliders are identical to Porsche 996 manual sliders, and cost new less than for what I could find salvaged Porsche parts. Audi P/Ns 8N0881183 and 8N0881184.) Sub bars are Brek Krause 9044.

Ideally, the lap belt anchor points should be just forward of the seat bottom/back intersection. Th BK 9761/9762 provide a boss to mount the inboard (tunnel side) lap belt in this proper location.

Customarily, folks anchor the outboard lap belt at the bolt fixing the foot of the roll bar's main hoop to base of the B-pillar. I'm not tall--5'11" with a 30" inseam--and so the seat needs to be fairly far forward. With the outboard lap belt anchored at the B-pillar, the belt geometry was bad, with the belt having to "bend" at the point it passes through the seat; the anchor point was much too far aft.



Knowledgeable sources agreed this was bad, and suggested that I drill the outboard side mount to mirror the way in which the inboard lap belt attaches. This essentially mimics what Porsche does with the factory lightweight buckets, where both lap belts attach to the side mounts. Unfortunately, there's not enough space between my seat and the side mount to fit an appropriately sized both head and washer, much less a backing plate, in there.



This problem could be solved by (i) purchasing an additional pair of of the 9761/9762 side mounts, and flipping the inboard mounts with the bosses to outboard on the opposite side of the car, at a cost of about $350, or (ii) having a very competent welder attach a threaded boss to the existing outboard mounts. Instead, I purchased a pair of the Brey Krause 9005 tunnel side lap belt mounts, and used them outboard. These go under the slider, are held down by the bolt attaching the slider to the chassis, and provide a threaded tab that moves the lap belt anchor four inches farther forward and into the correct location for me.



The revised belt geometry is much better. I did need to elongate the hole in the BK part through which the slider's locating pin goes, to make everything align properly.




As this is still a street-driven car, it would be ideal to be able to clip in/out the lap belts. However, with the inboard belt anchored to the side mount, there's not enough clearance between the tunnel and the side mount for an eye bolt. Plus, it would be pretty difficult to manipulate a clip-in in and out in this limited space.



Further, unless your harnesses have sewn-in, clip-in ends, you'd have to use a 3-bar adjuster to attach a clip-in end; combined, all this hardware becomes too long and interferes with seat pass-through when the lap belt is anchored in the proper location. So, I ended up with a shorter, non-removable bolt-in end on the inboard side. This pic is the outboard side, but illustrates the critical dimension:



This is the view under the seat. I wanted to get more clearance between the adjusters and the seat bottom by using a 2-bar adjuster, but my G-Force belts were too thick to use those.



Note that these sub bars prevent me from fixing the seats in the most upright position.

Refer to https://www.schrothracing.com/docs/C...structions.pdf for proper wrapping technique and geometry. Remember to safety wire clip-in ends, and Locktite is your friend.

Here's my plain old C2, ready for VIR in a couple weeks. Hope this is helpful to someone...

 

MFGJR - Thank you for the detailed response with pictures. This is VERY helpful, and is the exact information I was searching for.

This is much appreciated.

 

cnr2003 - Would you happen to have a picture of the seat installed, showing the clearance between the tunnel and the eye bolt? Also, what seats are you running?

Thanks!

 

I have Sparco Evo seats. I don't have a picture of the tunnel clearance and the stock seats are currently installed for winter. I don't recall having any clearance issues with the eye bolt. The issue I had was the mounting bolt for the factory 3 point belt was pushed up against the tunnel. You can see the bolt in this picture.

 

[QUOTE=arob;15698702
3. For the sub belts, are you all going with eye bolts directly to the floor, or are you using a sub belt bar that is integrated to the bottom of the seat?
,
Rob[/QUOTE]
Think carefully before you drill holes in your floor pan.
There is no easy way to go back.
I use a sub bar in my 6 GT3 with Euro GT3 seats (recaro).

 

Yessir. Will go with a sub bar for this application. Thanks for the part number!