911 Rod

Think about getting this done.
What is everyone paying for this?

Freddie Two Bs

Weld rather than pin. $3k.

Turbodan

I think Autowerks is doing it for approx 2k. Might be worth checking the dealership in Oakville as they have discounted hourly rate for 996s now (I think about $80/hr).
I think pinning with jb weld is a good way to go.

bpu699

What does pinning or welding coolant tubes mean? Long time Porsche owner, but I don't get it. How does one Weld or Pin a coolant tube? Why not just a higher quality clamp?

Puzzled....

Macster

What is being referred to is the coolant hoses at the engine connect to pipes that are not not an integral part of the engine but are separate pieces that are glued (epoxied) into the block.

In some cases -- tracking seems to be the most common case -- one or more of these can loosen and leak, sometimes quite catastrophically.

To repair the engine has to come out. The repair can be just a re-epoxing of the tubes to the block without or with pinning. The pinning is intended to keep the tube from coming completely free of the block which of course results in the catastrophic coolant loss event I mentioned above.

Some favor a more permanent solution and welding is the solution of choice.

Personally as an owner of a 2003 Turbo -- currently with just over 150K miles --- that sees no track time I don't worry about these coming loose. One or more may eventually come loose though and when (if) that happens then I don't know which solution I'll opt for.

Frankly I'm a bit leery of welding as if this is not done correctly the fitting can crack at where it was welded. This could (could) compromise the block maybe to the point the block is ruined. However, those that track may be willing to run this (probably small) risk rather than face having to re-epoxy these fittings every so often.

Spyerx

Cost will depend highly on your labor rate in your area. Figure basic pin or weld is going to be between 2500-3500.

Thing is, these cars are 10 years old. You will want to address other things while the motor is out. Starting with all the rubber hoses, gaskets, o-rings, etc.

My 997RS has been welded of 3 years, no issues, no seepage, no cracking. Key is a welder that is an expert with this sort of welding. Materials are thin. Also needs to be tank/pressure tested before and after assembly to verify. Perfect welds can have pinholes.

Also, if you are tracking the car, it is NOT a small risk. These hoses pop off mezger engines several times a track season in our area. It is a matter of time and there is a good chance it will cause your and other cars to spin off track.

IIRC none of the fittings are in the block. They are in various components that bolt to the block.

Macster

Right you are and wrong was I. Thanks for the correction.

Here is a link to a thread that has some good pics of the components which hold the fittings.

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=1409058

Carlo_Carrera

Do you track your TT?

PD Autowerks

We just saw a non pinned/welded setup fail the other weekend on a 996 GT3 at VIR instructing with Audi Club. He was really lucky as it happened close to pits and was able to coast in. The owner had been racing his GT3 for years and hadn't even had the pinning or welding job done. Lucky I guess, but for sure a must if the car is tracked or raced. I'd even say a good recommendation for good measure even on a street driven car.

bpu699

Thanks for the explanation...

So, now, in addition to being fearful when following 944's on the track (as they blow coolant hoses often I am told), now I need to worry about 996, 996 turbos, and GT3's.

Great. Good to know...

Since this seems to be a know issue, doesn't that place some liability concern for drivers that have chosen not to do it and track their cars? And Porsche???

PD Autowerks

Guess it all depends on variables but I'd say if one plans on tracking heavily or racing could be a liability, yes. Like most problem areas, usually it's not if it happens; it's when

911 Rod

I track my 86 quite regularly (when the engine is in it lol) but I would like to able to have the Turbo as a back up. I missed a year of track because my lines weren't pinned and the 86 was out of commission.

Our local PCA does not allow 996TT with coolant in them or not being pinned on the track.

No exemptions for instructor or charity days either.

T10Chris

I don't think the standard 996 falls in this category.. Just the turbos and GT cars.

And the issue is also present in the 997 turbos and GTs, except the 997.2 turbo.

T10Chris

I ran water and water wetter last year just as a precaution even though not required in my area. Antifreeze is slippery no matter where the leak comes from.. I didn't find it to be a difficult process to drain and refill, and I ran the water wetter until earlier this month when it began getting cold and drained some out and added antifreeze.. will do a full drain/flush again next year before tracking.

If you are mechanically inclined and have the correct tools and a lot of patience, the lines can be pinned with the engine in the car... I helped a friend do this.. also have re-epoxied fittings that have came out back in without dropping engine, including once doing a roadside repair for someone.

911 Rod

From what I've heard, you don't get much of the antifreeze out just draining and refilling. I'd feel really bad if someone spun on my coolant.

I'd more than likely drop the engine and pin myself, but was wondering the cost if I chose not to. Not that I don't have enough projects on the go.