Opininons On This 2002 Turbo Tiptronic
01-24-2013, 11:58 PM
#46
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FWIW,
I have a tip that has a tiny continuous seep. 65K miles. Both local dealers, and my very reputable and knowing prep shop that build these say that finding a tip that doesn't have some moisture is rare.
Mine never leaks, never marks it's spot
, but I don't sweat (no pun) my weepege.
That said, it sounds like this car may not be your prime candidate!
I have a tip that has a tiny continuous seep. 65K miles. Both local dealers, and my very reputable and knowing prep shop that build these say that finding a tip that doesn't have some moisture is rare.
Mine never leaks, never marks it's spot
, but I don't sweat (no pun) my weepege.That said, it sounds like this car may not be your prime candidate!
01-26-2013, 09:26 AM
#48
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RUN FROM THAT CAR ! !
OK, so I registered on here just to throw this out there - I was going to buy that car from Tony @ Lamborghini Chicago. If you haven't seen it in person, save yourself the trip.
The windshield is basically sand blasted, had two stone chips in it. Both of the nuccios said I was being dramatic, and that it was a "solid 9 out of 10"
I have literally NO good words to say about the dealership, been around cars/dealerships my entire life, and this was one for the books IMO. I'm not going to waste any more time out of my life on these guys, but I'd be happy to help tell you all of the things wrong with THAT car.
I drove 7 hours to see a car that was, with all due respect, beat to **** & run into the ground. If they were even remotely honest about the condition of the car, I'd have no hard feelings, but there is not a single clean panel on the entire car. The right rear fender turbo duct also has a few dents they tried to have pulled and buffed out (looks like somebody turned into a light post or something...) the passenger side window has a big scratch in it, the rear window has a couple scratches in it too. The rear bumper has been hit at least 3 times from what I could see, there are little scratches all over the car, the clear bra is coming up in a number of places (so if that's something you're counting on, consider that it needs to be redone).
I was the one that pointed out the transmission leak to them in the first place, there was a lot of fluid under that car. The transmission also made a grind noise at low speed, and the car had more rattles than I've heard in either of the others I've driven. OH and they told me that it was a $300 repair. I just had that done on the tiptronic 03 I bought, and I can check my service bill to see what it cost - but that's just business as usual IMO, completely lying to you because they think you're dumb. Don't split any price with them, not your fault they have a POS on their lot. Like I said, RUN away, don't just walk away.
I drove out to Chicago specifically to buy that car, and I couldn't be more disappointed. I owned a car that was an 03, and "that's normal for a 10 year old car" just doesn't fly unless there was some serious odometer tampering on it.
Message me if you want any more info, I'm on 6 speed if I'm too new of a member to get PMs on here. Same user name.
OK, so I registered on here just to throw this out there - I was going to buy that car from Tony @ Lamborghini Chicago. If you haven't seen it in person, save yourself the trip.
The windshield is basically sand blasted, had two stone chips in it. Both of the nuccios said I was being dramatic, and that it was a "solid 9 out of 10"
I have literally NO good words to say about the dealership, been around cars/dealerships my entire life, and this was one for the books IMO. I'm not going to waste any more time out of my life on these guys, but I'd be happy to help tell you all of the things wrong with THAT car.
I drove 7 hours to see a car that was, with all due respect, beat to **** & run into the ground. If they were even remotely honest about the condition of the car, I'd have no hard feelings, but there is not a single clean panel on the entire car. The right rear fender turbo duct also has a few dents they tried to have pulled and buffed out (looks like somebody turned into a light post or something...) the passenger side window has a big scratch in it, the rear window has a couple scratches in it too. The rear bumper has been hit at least 3 times from what I could see, there are little scratches all over the car, the clear bra is coming up in a number of places (so if that's something you're counting on, consider that it needs to be redone).
I was the one that pointed out the transmission leak to them in the first place, there was a lot of fluid under that car. The transmission also made a grind noise at low speed, and the car had more rattles than I've heard in either of the others I've driven. OH and they told me that it was a $300 repair. I just had that done on the tiptronic 03 I bought, and I can check my service bill to see what it cost - but that's just business as usual IMO, completely lying to you because they think you're dumb. Don't split any price with them, not your fault they have a POS on their lot. Like I said, RUN away, don't just walk away.
I drove out to Chicago specifically to buy that car, and I couldn't be more disappointed. I owned a car that was an 03, and "that's normal for a 10 year old car" just doesn't fly unless there was some serious odometer tampering on it.
Message me if you want any more info, I'm on 6 speed if I'm too new of a member to get PMs on here. Same user name.
01-28-2013, 11:00 PM
#49
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Why would you pay half of the cost of their problem? Truth is, if you buy that car at any price you are taking a big problem off their hands.
Let's see, a Tip (that leaks); wood grained interior (which 90% of buyers hate); inventory on lot for 5 months (see items 1 and 2 plus what else is wrong with it?)
Run Forest Run!
Let's see, a Tip (that leaks); wood grained interior (which 90% of buyers hate); inventory on lot for 5 months (see items 1 and 2 plus what else is wrong with it?)
Run Forest Run!
The pictures really don't tell the tale at all. Looks good in the online listing in my opinion. The reality is that this car isn't worth looking at if its more than 5 miles from you, and even then you'd have to be mad to actually buy it once you see it in person
01-30-2013, 01:12 AM
#50
You and I must have looked at two different cars! While I agree that a trans leak is a pretty big deal, I don't think the car is anywhere near the condition you feel it is. It's possible the dealer did a good job of detailing it up once it was moved indoors, but I sure didn't see much of the damage that you saw. I've owned quite a few cars in my days, and a fair amount of Porsches, and am pretty good at picking apart a car; I must say that it isn't nearly as bad as you state.
Please understand that I have no dog in this fight, and have no interest in the car selling or not. When did you look at the car?
Please understand that I have no dog in this fight, and have no interest in the car selling or not. When did you look at the car?
RUN FROM THAT CAR ! !
OK, so I registered on here just to throw this out there - I was going to buy that car from Tony @ Lamborghini Chicago. If you haven't seen it in person, save yourself the trip.
The windshield is basically sand blasted, had two stone chips in it. Both of the nuccios said I was being dramatic, and that it was a "solid 9 out of 10"
I have literally NO good words to say about the dealership, been around cars/dealerships my entire life, and this was one for the books IMO. I'm not going to waste any more time out of my life on these guys, but I'd be happy to help tell you all of the things wrong with THAT car.
I drove 7 hours to see a car that was, with all due respect, beat to **** & run into the ground. If they were even remotely honest about the condition of the car, I'd have no hard feelings, but there is not a single clean panel on the entire car. The right rear fender turbo duct also has a few dents they tried to have pulled and buffed out (looks like somebody turned into a light post or something...) the passenger side window has a big scratch in it, the rear window has a couple scratches in it too. The rear bumper has been hit at least 3 times from what I could see, there are little scratches all over the car, the clear bra is coming up in a number of places (so if that's something you're counting on, consider that it needs to be redone).
I was the one that pointed out the transmission leak to them in the first place, there was a lot of fluid under that car. The transmission also made a grind noise at low speed, and the car had more rattles than I've heard in either of the others I've driven. OH and they told me that it was a $300 repair. I just had that done on the tiptronic 03 I bought, and I can check my service bill to see what it cost - but that's just business as usual IMO, completely lying to you because they think you're dumb. Don't split any price with them, not your fault they have a POS on their lot. Like I said, RUN away, don't just walk away.
I drove out to Chicago specifically to buy that car, and I couldn't be more disappointed. I owned a car that was an 03, and "that's normal for a 10 year old car" just doesn't fly unless there was some serious odometer tampering on it.
Message me if you want any more info, I'm on 6 speed if I'm too new of a member to get PMs on here. Same user name.
OK, so I registered on here just to throw this out there - I was going to buy that car from Tony @ Lamborghini Chicago. If you haven't seen it in person, save yourself the trip.
The windshield is basically sand blasted, had two stone chips in it. Both of the nuccios said I was being dramatic, and that it was a "solid 9 out of 10"
I have literally NO good words to say about the dealership, been around cars/dealerships my entire life, and this was one for the books IMO. I'm not going to waste any more time out of my life on these guys, but I'd be happy to help tell you all of the things wrong with THAT car.
I drove 7 hours to see a car that was, with all due respect, beat to **** & run into the ground. If they were even remotely honest about the condition of the car, I'd have no hard feelings, but there is not a single clean panel on the entire car. The right rear fender turbo duct also has a few dents they tried to have pulled and buffed out (looks like somebody turned into a light post or something...) the passenger side window has a big scratch in it, the rear window has a couple scratches in it too. The rear bumper has been hit at least 3 times from what I could see, there are little scratches all over the car, the clear bra is coming up in a number of places (so if that's something you're counting on, consider that it needs to be redone).
I was the one that pointed out the transmission leak to them in the first place, there was a lot of fluid under that car. The transmission also made a grind noise at low speed, and the car had more rattles than I've heard in either of the others I've driven. OH and they told me that it was a $300 repair. I just had that done on the tiptronic 03 I bought, and I can check my service bill to see what it cost - but that's just business as usual IMO, completely lying to you because they think you're dumb. Don't split any price with them, not your fault they have a POS on their lot. Like I said, RUN away, don't just walk away.
I drove out to Chicago specifically to buy that car, and I couldn't be more disappointed. I owned a car that was an 03, and "that's normal for a 10 year old car" just doesn't fly unless there was some serious odometer tampering on it.
Message me if you want any more info, I'm on 6 speed if I'm too new of a member to get PMs on here. Same user name.
01-30-2013, 08:56 AM
#51
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The things I saw were 100% there, If you didn't have the car in direct sunlight, there is a very good chance you'd miss a lot of them. They keep the lighting on the cars fairly dark up there for a reason IMO. That was Tony's fall back on why he didn't see any of the paint issues or describe them to me on the phone, but he definitely saw them when the car was in the sunlight (aside from the front windshield, they insisted that was normal). I was fairly specific in order to try to prevent this sort of sleazy bull**** from happening to me in the first place and wasting my time.
There is also the chance that you unintentionally didn't look as hard because it wasn't for you or you aren't quite as obsessive as I am over the details, but I asked explicitly the things I was looking for and was lied to on quite literally all accounts. I saw the car on January 2nd, and the car didn't even look like it had been prepped for a sale. After seeing the car, I went searched locally and bought an 03 that afternoon. I looked over 5 or 6 other 996s that day (not all turbos), and the car at Lamborghini Chicago was undoubtedly in the worst condition.
I really wanted an arctic silver or seal gray over black 996tt and a tiptronic with lower miles and the right options, but there were just SO many small problems on the car that I backed out. Looking back on it, even if they said they had to keep my $500 deposit and I had to drive home 7 hours empty handed, I'd have still backed out. I sold my 03 cobra about 1.5 years ago, which for being just a mustang was at least an 18/10 on their scale if that car was a "solid 9/10" as they described it, and the car I was trading in (Jaguar XF) was probably a 15/10. I looked at the car on January 2nd, FWIW. Maybe they really spent some time cleaning it up after I pointed all the problems on the car out if you saw it after that, because they had previously denied that there were any leaks on the transmission until I asked them to put it on a lift and pointed it out.
Did you notice the dents in front of the passenger side intercooler scoop in the rear fender? the three parts in the rear where it looked like it backed into something, front lip was chewed up (easy fix, but shows how it was cared for, especially if THAT was the replacement lip..), passenger door window looked like it got keyed, rear window had a very minor scratch too. no less than 10 small scratches in the paint on the car (not rock chips, scratches - shopping cart carnage?). The rock chips in the windshield could be fixed, but the entire surface of the windshield lit up with abrasion marks in direct sunlight too. There is also a fairly big tolerance on what Porsche says is acceptable on the clatter on idle that our cars make, and that one was on the higher end of that spectrum. Probably in need of some oil, and all the sitting it's done has tricked the oil level sensor with condensation into reading it at a good level (was 2 bars above the midpoint when I drove it).
I really know how to detail cars, and I wouldn't split hairs over these things if I didn't know that they were unrepairable from anything short of paint work and a bit of filler on that passenger rear fender. Full disclosure on that, I'm not well versed in the chips-away stuff. The car has a laundry list of problems, and IMO is worth more along the lines of 36-38k (at least in MY eyes, that's what the price would need to be for me to buy it), all things considered. It's just TOO much of a liability with the picture that the poor conditions throughout the car and how the dealership is trying to pass the problem off: trying to split $2600 of repair costs on a car that hasn't even been sold?? What else is wrong with it? They called the Porsche dealer next door and said it would be $300 to fix the transmission. I had the gasket replaced on mine, and it was $300 to fix. Where are they even getting the $2600 repair estimate? Walk away...
There is also the chance that you unintentionally didn't look as hard because it wasn't for you or you aren't quite as obsessive as I am over the details, but I asked explicitly the things I was looking for and was lied to on quite literally all accounts. I saw the car on January 2nd, and the car didn't even look like it had been prepped for a sale. After seeing the car, I went searched locally and bought an 03 that afternoon. I looked over 5 or 6 other 996s that day (not all turbos), and the car at Lamborghini Chicago was undoubtedly in the worst condition.
I really wanted an arctic silver or seal gray over black 996tt and a tiptronic with lower miles and the right options, but there were just SO many small problems on the car that I backed out. Looking back on it, even if they said they had to keep my $500 deposit and I had to drive home 7 hours empty handed, I'd have still backed out. I sold my 03 cobra about 1.5 years ago, which for being just a mustang was at least an 18/10 on their scale if that car was a "solid 9/10" as they described it, and the car I was trading in (Jaguar XF) was probably a 15/10. I looked at the car on January 2nd, FWIW. Maybe they really spent some time cleaning it up after I pointed all the problems on the car out if you saw it after that, because they had previously denied that there were any leaks on the transmission until I asked them to put it on a lift and pointed it out.
Did you notice the dents in front of the passenger side intercooler scoop in the rear fender? the three parts in the rear where it looked like it backed into something, front lip was chewed up (easy fix, but shows how it was cared for, especially if THAT was the replacement lip..), passenger door window looked like it got keyed, rear window had a very minor scratch too. no less than 10 small scratches in the paint on the car (not rock chips, scratches - shopping cart carnage?). The rock chips in the windshield could be fixed, but the entire surface of the windshield lit up with abrasion marks in direct sunlight too. There is also a fairly big tolerance on what Porsche says is acceptable on the clatter on idle that our cars make, and that one was on the higher end of that spectrum. Probably in need of some oil, and all the sitting it's done has tricked the oil level sensor with condensation into reading it at a good level (was 2 bars above the midpoint when I drove it).
I really know how to detail cars, and I wouldn't split hairs over these things if I didn't know that they were unrepairable from anything short of paint work and a bit of filler on that passenger rear fender. Full disclosure on that, I'm not well versed in the chips-away stuff. The car has a laundry list of problems, and IMO is worth more along the lines of 36-38k (at least in MY eyes, that's what the price would need to be for me to buy it), all things considered. It's just TOO much of a liability with the picture that the poor conditions throughout the car and how the dealership is trying to pass the problem off: trying to split $2600 of repair costs on a car that hasn't even been sold?? What else is wrong with it? They called the Porsche dealer next door and said it would be $300 to fix the transmission. I had the gasket replaced on mine, and it was $300 to fix. Where are they even getting the $2600 repair estimate? Walk away...
01-30-2013, 12:21 PM
#52
I did not drive it or start it up; my look was to rule out an absolute junker, and performed indoors in their upstairs showroom. I did see the scratch in the back near the window, a small gouge in the rear bumper and the scraped up air dam in front. They had cleaned up the interior nicely and I saw no damage there. The car was very clean and I did not see any scratches in the glass or dents near the intercooler intake - possibly they got them out with a paintless dent guy. Those guys can perform miracles. A good paint guy can get rid of most minor paint scratches if they are just in the clear coat. I would have an issue with splitting the cost of a repair that should be done prior to even trying to sell the car.
01-30-2013, 05:19 PM
#53
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When did you see it? Maybe they cleaned it up a bit after they actually realized the condition it was in.
The dent in the rear already looks like it was attempted to be fixed - it was just a bunch of small waves that you had to have the light hit right to see. It'll be one of those things somebody notices when they wash the car for the first time and says "son of a b...."
The rear bumper had a blue paint scuff still on it, and the side skirts were completely dried out when I saw the car. Absolutely nothing about the car said "ready to sell" or even "trying to sell" when I saw it. Like I said before, too many things just makes for a car that's going to be cheaper up front but cost you more down the road. Why spend more time and money just to fix it?
The interior is in very good condition though, dash squeaked like a SOB though. Sunroof had it's normal rattles. The only noise from my drive that really put me off was what sounded like a whole lot of heat shield reverberation right around where the transmission was. Couldn't reproduce it, but that alone put me off on that car. I didn't even really notice ALL the other defects until after my test drive when I started to look it over a lot closer (i.e. would this car still be worth it if I needed to get the transmission rebuilt in a year's time?). Couldn't find very many redeeming qualities, other than my wife liked the wood interior and I wanted a silver/black tiptronic 996tt. Felt the dealers were very condescending and dismissive of not insubstantial flaws that were visible in plain daylight, and would have preferred them to have answered my questions honestly BEFORE I took two days vacation to drive out and see the car. I'd hate for somebody to wind up in the same position as I did.
The dent in the rear already looks like it was attempted to be fixed - it was just a bunch of small waves that you had to have the light hit right to see. It'll be one of those things somebody notices when they wash the car for the first time and says "son of a b...."
The rear bumper had a blue paint scuff still on it, and the side skirts were completely dried out when I saw the car. Absolutely nothing about the car said "ready to sell" or even "trying to sell" when I saw it. Like I said before, too many things just makes for a car that's going to be cheaper up front but cost you more down the road. Why spend more time and money just to fix it?
The interior is in very good condition though, dash squeaked like a SOB though. Sunroof had it's normal rattles. The only noise from my drive that really put me off was what sounded like a whole lot of heat shield reverberation right around where the transmission was. Couldn't reproduce it, but that alone put me off on that car. I didn't even really notice ALL the other defects until after my test drive when I started to look it over a lot closer (i.e. would this car still be worth it if I needed to get the transmission rebuilt in a year's time?). Couldn't find very many redeeming qualities, other than my wife liked the wood interior and I wanted a silver/black tiptronic 996tt. Felt the dealers were very condescending and dismissive of not insubstantial flaws that were visible in plain daylight, and would have preferred them to have answered my questions honestly BEFORE I took two days vacation to drive out and see the car. I'd hate for somebody to wind up in the same position as I did.
