Savetheclutch

I've put 50 miles today, turn off for a while then back on etc for a few times and the car is fine.. I am guessing something is going to give up eventually but at least I know where the problem is coming from

dantzig

Hope for your sake that you're right. I kind of agree with Macster though. There's no obvious reason why what you did should have made the motor start cranking.

Good luck!!

Jon

Savetheclutch

I made a video I just have not gotten to upload it..

basically I got home, tried to start the car and nothing.
jacked it up, played with the wires to the solenoid, tried to start nothing.
took fuel pump cover off, unplugged wires, plugged them back in and the car started right away. Did not have to jump it or anything.

talking to my friend we agreed that the fuel smell was coming from that area so it could have been an unpluged wire that got a little bit of gas in it ? maybe the rattle of the car unplugged it?

who knows.. for good measures I just went to my parking lot to start the car and it did right away, it had been sitting for a bit over 2 hours.

I am going to give it a few days to see what happens.

Macster

Unlikely any fuel contamination could have interfered with the electrical connection.

But for now I'm willing to let the electrical connector wet with gasoline thing slide.

I am not so willing to let the smell of gasoline slide. These cars should not smell of gasoline if the fuel system and fuel vapor recovery system are intact and working properly.

Specifically, there should be no fuel/gas in that area to get the connectors wet with gasoline.

So, there is a fuel line, fuel line fitting or connector leaking, or there is a fuel tank/vent vapor line leak.

I know of one car (not one of mine) that had a strong smell of gasoline -- reported by the owner -- and the owner finally traced the problem to leak around the fuel pump cover/access panel.

This was leaking and allowing fuel to make its way out of the tank into that area and the fuel fumes from this leak were being routed right into the cabin.

IIRC when he got serious about the smell he found that area was wet with gasoline, but the engine started/ran just fine.

In another car (again not one of mine), in this case a Cayman, there was a gasoline smell and the source was traced to a hole in the vapor line from the tank to the engine compartment, the line that runs down the center tunnel of the car.

In hole was the result of mice in/at the car. The car ran ok but the CEL was on and the error codes (at least one) pointed to the fuel vapor recovery/ventilation system.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Savetheclutch

well i just ran durametrics again and I got code 9122 fuel leve status not present

any ideas?

Macster

Yes, but you're going to have to get your hands dirty.

9122 - tank-fill level.

Possible causes: sensor for fuel level faulty; short circuit to voltage/ground or open circuit in the wiring between the sensor for fuel level and the instrument cluster.

1) Check sensor for fuel level. Switch off ignition. Pull plug off sensor for fuel level. Measure resistance on sensor for fuel level (pin side) between pins 2 and 3. Depending upon amount of fuel in tank, measure between 10 and 310 ohms. If ok go to step 3. If not ok go to step 6.

2) Check output voltage of the instrument cluster. Switch *on* ignition. Measure voltage on plug of sensor for fuel level between pins 2 and 3. Measure approx. 5V. If approx. 5V step 6. If not approx. 5V step 3..

3) Check wiring between sensor for fuel level and instrument cluster for short to ground. Switch off ignition. Pull plug B off the instrument cluster. measure resistance on plug B of the instrument cluster between pin 4 and ground. Measure resistance on plug B of the instrument cluster between pin 20 and ground. Unfortunately my reference doesn't give a resistance reading range but just directs one go to the next (4) step if ok. If not ok, repair the wiring harness.

4) Check wiring between sensor for fuel level and instrument cluster for short to B+. Switch on ignition. Measure voltage between plug B on instrument cluster pin 4 and ground. Measure voltage between plug B on instrument cluster pin 20 and ground. Measure 0V. If ok step 5. If not ok repair the wiring harness.

5) Check wiring between sensor for fuel level and instrument cluster for open circuit. Switch off ignition. Measure resistance between plug B on the instrument cluster pin 4 and plug on the sensor for fuel level, pin 2. Measure resistance between the plug B on the instrument cluster pion 20 and plug on the sensor for fuel level pin 3. Measure less than 5 [ohm]. If ok step 7. If not ok repair the wiring harness.

6) Push plug on sensor for fuel level again. Delete fault memory and check if fault appears again. If it does, replace the fuel sensor.

7) Replace the instrument cluster.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Savetheclutch

Is the plug you are talking about the onecthat goes on top of the fuel pump?

do i have tp remove the cluster for step 3?

man i need tp find pics of all this haha

btw thank you!!!!!!

SSST

If I were you, the first thing I would do I'd run down that gas smell. You either have a fuel leak or fuel vapor leak. Both can be extremely dangerous.

Macster

Agree. I'm amazed at how unconcerned some owners are about gasoline smells which almost always (unless one was sloppy filling up the tank and sloshed some out) is a good sign of a gasoline or gasoline vapor leak.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Savetheclutch

Well I have been trying to find the issue, I am not just going to keep driving the car. I refuse to take it to a shop unless I actually know what the problem is, had I taken it to a shop I am pretty sure they would have replaced from the starter to who knows what else already...

Actually i was able to find the smell and what seems to be the whole problem.. it looks like a short circuit and it melted the pannel hence why the gas smell coming up



what do you guys think?

Tytus

Now the question is really, why the short circuit happened to begin with...?

Tytus

Savetheclutch

yeah I am going to a friend's shop tonight, he says it is probably a bad ground so we are going to peak around and see what we find.

Macster

Bad connection results in increased resistance which turns the connector into an electrical heater. This increased heat causes a break down of the connectors, wiring, insulation, even the connector housing, to the point it appears to have compromised the fluid/vapor seal integrity of that plastic panel and well, you smell gasoline.

In short, I like that it in that it explains the smell.

As I have said before: With cars, there's always two problems, unless there is just one problem or 3 or more problems. Whether it is a bad ground or just a bad connector to begin with and over time this caught up with it...The mechanic will have to examine the wiring harness/etc to satisfy himself there's nothing else wrong.

Be sure the water drains are clear and no water can back up/accumulate to the point water could get on/around that connector. If it does and can the connector sees more moisture and the moisture can result in an increase in surface corrosion which leads to more resistance, etc.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Savetheclutch

thank you! macster you definetely know your stuff.

my friend and mechanic is an electrical engineer and explained the same thing to me.. my response was "huh??" we are going to try and pull the wire harness out to see what went wrong, I am going to try and find a replacement for the cover, for the time being we are going to seal it with industrial silicone.

the car is going to sit for a bit until I change the clutch master cylinder etc.

Kevin

When Looking at your previous pictures, you have a different fuel filter and different side intake plenum. You could have non stock fuel pump or even two pumps inside your fuel cell. The wiring could also be shorting from getting hot. You might want to Google the PAN AM 747 fuel pump failure. Low fuel level, high vapor, a vapor that you are smelling equal a very bad day.

If you fuel pump is failing the amperage goes thru the roof. You might want to "pay" a shop to sort this out for you.