JG 996T

My '02 is approaching 45K miles. According to the maintenance manual, its a minor service, consisting of oil filter change, cabin filter change, and a detailed inspection of various other parts. I don't know whether the major maintenance was performed at 30K.

I called two local dealers, and asked what the service entailed and what it would cost. They both confirmed it was a minor/annual service. One quoted $1,100, the other $650 (not including tax + 7%).

First question, any reason why there is such a disparity in estimated cost?

Second, I'm going to Watkins Glen in August for PCA event, and was wondering whether I should have the fluid changed/flushed when I bring it in for service. Anything else I should have checked out?

Third, service advisor at first dealer said that they had no way of checking maintenance history, is this correct?

Michael-Dallas

When you asked each dealer for the price of the minor/annual service, did you ask them what it entailed?

If you have no record of previous brake flush, then absolutely get it flushed and bled. If your dealer is aware of PCA, then they should know how to perform a tech inspection and sign off on your tech sheet.

/m

Macster

There doesn't appear to be a linked database of services performed at any other dealers available to dealers. They are after all independent businesses.

I have found in searching for used Porsches that if one can learn where a car spent some time -- and this is not always difficult to learn -- he can call dealers in that area and often times learn what services the car might have had done.

The difference in service costs is probably attributable to the differences in what extras are sold, or done. That is sometimes I have found a dealer will have embellished the services included in a minor or major service. Fuel injector cleaning. Engine oil system flush. A detailed and expensive -- at the dealer's going hourly labor rate -- inspection and checkout of the car. And so on.

It is up to the individual to learn what exactly is invoved at a particular dealer and either accept the service as is or work out a custom service visit that suits one's needs and that of the car. Generally the latter course of action results in a considerable savings and yet doesn't compromise on the car's service.

If brake fluid has not been flushed and bled in 2 years by the time this PCA event rolls around you should have the brake fluid flushed and bled at least.

If it hasn't been done already, a transmisison and diff fluid change and even a coolant drain and refill with fresh anti-freeze and distilled water a very good idea.

Also, if they haven't been changed plugs could be due to be changed on time if not miles.

Before I set out on any major trip or excursion I like to leave home with the car's vital fluids fresh -- or at least not due to be changed before I leave home or get back which can mean not due to be changed in the next 5K miles or so.

All vital fluid levels want to be correct. Then I almost always treat the car to a road worthiness inspection before hand which has the tech and I under the car checking various areas: engine, drivetrain, brakes, steering, suspension, tires, hoses, piping, etc. for any leak sign or missing hardware, or just anything out of the ordinary.

I keep my cars serviced and I try to stay on top of things so almost always the road worthiness inspection finds nothing scary.

Sincerely,

Macster.

JG 996T

Thanks for the comments. I read Streather's manual detailing the service, and while it looks like I could manage the service DIY style (assuming i could find a 9 quart container), I've decided to have it done at a local indy - Powertech - (regularly assigned for PCA DE tech inspections), as follows;

1) 45,000 maintenance;
2) brake fluid flush; and
3) Watkins Glen Tech Inspection.

Not to kick off a debate, but I bought a case of 5W-50 Mobil 1. The service advisor said that they regularly use Mobil 1 0w-40. Porsche manual says either is approved.
Either one better for hot August track day?

Macster

I don't track my cars but I have switched to using Castrol Syntec 5w-50 in both of them. In the Turbo I used Mobil 1 5w-50 a time or two but decided to switch to Castrol since I can find and buy Castrol at the local autoparts store while to use Mobil 1 5w-50 requires I order the stuff.

But ignoring the extra effort required to obtain Mobil 1 5w-50 oil it will be fine for your track day. Of course the fresher the oil the better. Even the best oil if allowed to accumulate a big build up of water and unburned gasoline from short trips for some time before a track day compromises the oil's ability to protect the engine when track day rolls around.

You might consider tipping in a $10 bottle of Swepco 502 oil treatment. It contains 200ppm of molybdenum disulfide which is a very good high pressure high temperature lubricate.

http://www.swepcousa.com/lubesite/lubepdf/j03776.pdf

Regardless of what oil you use, or additive you use or don't chose to use, be sure to take the car around the track for a cool down lap or two to allow the engine and drivetrain to shed the considerable heat load hard and high speed track running generate.

Sincerely,

Macster.

BostonDuce

It's basically an "oil and filter" service. About $100 in parts/fluids. They check for fluid leaks, obvious damage, hopefully a code readout. Nothing invasive,involved, or by my definition, 'detailed'.

Biggest thing is spark plug change that should have happened by now-that alone could run $600. Normally I'd pull the easiest plug to get at and have a look, but you risk knocking out the glass-jawed ignition coils if you disturb them, especially by a ham-fisted 'tech' that doesn't give a....

Brake fluid flush, including cycling the ABS pump could be $200 at a dealer, although many just do a regular bleed.

Other things you may consider to get a service base line; transmission, differential(s) oil change, coolant change, air filter change, check for oil in IC hoses.

Anything done in the past as a DIY or through an independent service guy will not show up. You should be able to push the dealer for a service record, maybe they're just lazy.

Don't leave the decision on what services to be done with the SA. Make a list of what you want done (and what you don't), otherwise, let them call you if they find anything out of order.

BD

DesignerGenes

If you don't know that it was done before (and can't find out), by all means drain, refill, and bleed the brake fluid. Plugs should have been done at 30,000 (I did mine at 25,000 because the car was already five years on the road). Plugs alone will cost you at least $500, and advice on here seems to be replace the coil packs while you're there.

My dealer stands by the "coolant is forever" thing (I'm getting antsy on that). If this is really just an oil change (with filter), it shouldn't run more than about $300. I had the cabin filters changed at 25,000 (part of the 30,000 maintenance) and they were about $55 for the parts, if I recall correctly. SO, with oil and filter and cabin filters, I guess I can see $375 to $425.

One of your estimates sounds pretty high and the other one is through the roof. You need to know what's included at those prices.

Macster

The dealer will parrot the company coolant is forever line for whatever reasons only it knows. Funny but my experience is a dealer will stick to the script on some services but deviate at other times, usually when it means it can charge more money for a service.

I decide when and what is done to my car. If I want the coolant changed every year the dealer shouldn't care. I'm paying for the service. When I get push back on a service request I listen and then thank the person for the input but insist on having the service done.

As I said above, it is my car, my money and I'll have the car serviced as I see fit.

The coolant must protect against corrosion. While the engine block will not corrode through the cooling system is compromised of considerable surface area made up of very thin walled tubing that keeps the coolant in system and out of the cabin or off the ground and out of the engine oil.

It only takes a corroded oil/water heat exchanger to make the money saved by skipping anti-freeze renewals seem insignificant.

Every 4 to 6 years is about right. Even after 6 years there may be some life left in the coolant but it is with coolant as with oil: One doesn't want to run the fluid right up until it can no longer do its job but replace it before its ability to do its job is sufficiently compromised that wear or corrosion takes place.

Sincerely,

Macster.

JG 996T

Dropped the car off this morning at Powertech for the 45K maintenance, brake fluid flush, and free Watkins Glen DE Tech Inspection. Decided to go with Mobil 1 5w-50, Ate Blue, and a bottle of SWEPCO 502.

Macster

Looks good. My 03 is going in -- this AM if I can get off my butt and take it in -- at 40K miles for an oil/filter service (Castrol Syntech 5w-50) and a bottle of Swepco 502. I'm going to check into having the fuel filter replaced.

Brake fluid done a year ago so no need to do this for another year.

Sincerely,

Macster.

BostonDuce

Not to be a killjoy, but does anyone know if MDS kills the cats like ZDDP?
BD

Macster

MDS?

jcb-memphis

If you track and don't flush the fluid on a regular basis...invest in Castrol SRF. Just for safety.....less costly after a few flushes IMHO.

Good luck. I love myh 5w050. Less noise and oil usage to date.


Jeff

JG 996T

Got the car back last night, everything checked out.

Only comment concerned the turbo drain plugs. When I dropped it off, I asked the tech to also drain the turbos. Well apparently, they had never been drained as the plugs were apparently stuck, and were stripped when he tried to remove them. So they were replaced with new ones, which should function properly when unscrewed regularly.

All set for the Glen.

Macster

Not necessary to drain the turbo reserviors. These are downstream of the turbos and are constantly flushed with oil on its way back to the oil scavage pump and the oil tank.

However, someone told me -- and I forget who -- that what is of value is ensuring oil drains out and and the amounts are the same between the two sides.

I guess the concern is debris (?), sludge (?) or something (?) could build up and possibly restrict the flow of oil through the turbos.

The draining either allows this whatever to drain out so it doesn't build up or if the amount of oil that drains is too little that this at least provides a warning that something is obstructing oil flow through the turbo.

Sincerely,

Macster.