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On every turbocharger system that I sell, the customer will breakin there turbochargers on the stock original tuning map.
I will flash the ECU back to stock. You MUST have boost control. The factory K16, K24, X50, GT2 stock file must be able to control the hybrid turbochargers.
The N75 with my billet wastegate kit installed on hybrid turbochargers WILL manage boost. The stock program "will" manage the turbochargers.
If you can manage the boost, you can manage the torque.
And this is why my engine is getting rods and pistons before the 980s go on....
Quit beating around the bush and get those things installed! LOL. There is virtually zero issues from a torque standpoint with the 980s on a stock engine. You have nothing to worry about. Here is a friend's stock block 3.6 with the 980s at 1.3 bar with 91pump on our local dynojet. 645whp/535wtq. The only mod is a Kline catted 2.5" exhaust. IDC1300 injectors and a Walbro 450 fuel pump. Look where the peak torque is. Look at the torque down low. Look at the hp and how it rises all the way to redline in a linear fashion, very GT3esque. This is a ripping yet 100% safe set up for a stock block engine.
What i don't understand is many of the popular tuners recommend 1 bar waste gates and if they are 14 lb springs..how can the n75 valve control the boost @ low rpm to modulate torque? I suppose you could pull timing but..
It just seems counter intuitive to put in stiffer wastegate springs and light weight compressor wheels that spool faster knowing these rods are soft.
I think the Motronic 7.8 ECU is pretty good and capable but how much control can these ecus provide with boost mapping compared to a standalone?
Or does it even matter and its more dependent on the boost control solenoid that is being used?
The UMW 1 bar wastegate kit I installed actually has springs that start to crack at around ~8.5psi. The Markski ones are 14lb springs...
On every turbocharger system that I sell, the customer will breakin there turbochargers on the stock original tuning map.
I will flash the ECU back to stock. You MUST have boost control. The factory K16, K24, X50, GT2 stock file must be able to control the hybrid turbochargers.
The N75 with my billet wastegate kit installed on hybrid turbochargers WILL manage boost. The stock program "will" manage the turbochargers.
If you can manage the boost, you can manage the torque.
When using a stock file, the n75 can control boost properly even with all different wastegate cracking pressures? How is that possible if the cracking pressure is over the requested boost pressure? With the N75 completely open ( 0 duty cycle, charge pressure from the compressor housing going straight to the WGs), isn't the lowest boost achievable equal to the WG cracking pressure? Unless all your WG options don't have stiff springs in them, then I can see the stock file being able to control boost.
What i don't understand is many of the popular tuners recommend 1 bar waste gates and if they are 14 lb springs..how can the n75 valve control the boost @ low rpm to modulate torque? I suppose you could pull timing but..
It just seems counter intuitive to put in stiffer wastegate springs and light weight compressor wheels that spool faster knowing these rods are soft.
I think the Motronic 7.8 ECU is pretty good and capable but how much control can these ecus provide with boost mapping compared to a standalone?
Or does it even matter and its more dependent on the boost control solenoid that is being used?
If the waste gates dont' crack below 14psi, the N75 can not physically control boost below that level. It's that simple. Throttle ends up being a bit of an ON/OFF switch with very stiff WG springs. A restrictive exhaust may compound the issue as it creates additional pressure on the backside of the wastegate flapper pushing to keep it closed.
We use very soft waste gates on my turbos. They have 6 psi springs with preload lowered via longer WG rods. They begin to crack at 4.5 psi and are fully open by 14.5. We have the ability to run 1.5 bar with that set up although our default standard map runs 1.1bar. Although we may leave a bit of low end spool on the table with such soft springs, we are gaining a lot of throttle modulation and resolution in return. Different philosophies I guess.
By comparison, my RUF K24/26 waste gates as set up my RUF would crack at 8 psi and were fully open at 11.
Quit beating around the bush and get those things installed! LOL. There is virtually zero issues from a torque standpoint with the 980s on a stock engine. You have nothing to worry about. Here is a friend's stock block 3.6 with the 980s at 1.3 bar with 91pump on our local dynojet. 645whp/535wtq. The only mod is a Kline catted 2.5" exhaust. IDC1300 injectors and a Walbro 450 fuel pump. Look where the peak torque is. Look at the torque down low. Look at the hp and how it rises all the way to redline in a linear fashion, very GT3esque. This is a ripping yet 100% safe set up for a stock block engine.
If the waste gates dont' crack below 14psi, the N75 can not physically control boost below that level. It's that simple. Throttle ends up being a bit of an ON/OFF switch with very stiff WG springs. A restrictive exhaust may compound the issue as it creates additional pressure on the backside of the wastegate flapper pushing to keep it closed.
We use very soft waste gates on my turbos. They have 6 psi springs with preload lowered via longer WG rods. They begin to crack at 4.5 psi and are fully open by 14.5. We have the ability to run 1.5 bar with that set up although our default standard map runs 1.1bar. Although we may leave a bit of low end spool on the table with such soft springs, we are gaining a lot of throttle modulation and resolution in return. Different philosophies I guess.
By comparison, my RUF K24/26 waste gates as set up my RUF would crack at 8 psi and were fully open at 11.
Can this elongated wastegate strategy be used on a stock frame turbo and stock ecu?
I believe the turbosmart wastegates for the stock K16 & K24 turbos have the ability to use softer springs but the problem is they cannot hit 1 bar of boost
Can this elongated wastegate strategy be used on a stock frame turbo and stock ecu?
I believe the turbosmart wastegates for the stock K16 & K24 turbos have the ability to use softer springs but the problem is they cannot hit 1 bar of boost
When I ran the RUF K24s the WG all cracked around 8psi. On my K16 hybrids it was similar if I recall. Stock turbos probably a little less. Lot of factors are at play. I know on the Xonas 6psi cracking and 14psi full open works great on the stock ECU. That's what I used on the 980s with the stock ECU when running 1.3 bar. That's what my friend used on the 980s posted above. I use less boost now on the Motec ECU as we can make a lot more power on less boost. Again, lot of variables at play.
I did believe that at the beginning of this exercise, but now, not so much.
You are in supporting mod scope creep land. Could just throw them on to fix your oil leak and keep things turned down until you can do the other stuff, if you decide you even want to push them further.
08-14-2024, 09:28 PM
