So here is what the dealer told me...
09-24-2010, 08:11 PM
#16
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1) in the OLD days, we call it "sweating" not seepage or leakage. but it's all the same. flat engine tend to sweat. without seeing how much sweating you got, hard to tell if it's an issue.
2) spring rotation. sounds like binding coils? not a problem
3) crack is normal, but you can TRY to have them warranty it. a CPO'd car shoudn't have more than 1-2mm crack, and i am talking about a few cracks. if you have cracks all over, regardless of how short each crack is, i think it can be warrantied. when i sold my car to dealer, they insisted i replace rotors b/c i had a lot of cracks but each only 1mm.
4) cording inside, need new alignment, you have too much toe in and too much camber perhaps.
2) spring rotation. sounds like binding coils? not a problem
3) crack is normal, but you can TRY to have them warranty it. a CPO'd car shoudn't have more than 1-2mm crack, and i am talking about a few cracks. if you have cracks all over, regardless of how short each crack is, i think it can be warrantied. when i sold my car to dealer, they insisted i replace rotors b/c i had a lot of cracks but each only 1mm.
4) cording inside, need new alignment, you have too much toe in and too much camber perhaps.
09-24-2010, 09:11 PM
#18
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Toe links:
http://www.tarett.com/items/996-997-...lnk-detail.htm
Upper links:
http://www.tarett.com/items/996-997-...-ea-detail.htm
Cheers,
09-24-2010, 09:54 PM
#19
Nordschleife Master
1: The only oil I even had come out was RMS or FMS.
2: springs make noise in GT3 front no rubber
3: Rotors fine
4: Those tire did not see enough track use. To me it sounds like you have a nice setting for the rear, just need to put outside load on the next set.
2: springs make noise in GT3 front no rubber
3: Rotors fine
4: Those tire did not see enough track use. To me it sounds like you have a nice setting for the rear, just need to put outside load on the next set.
09-24-2010, 11:40 PM
#20
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My Boxster leaks, my 996C2 leaks, my GT3 leaks...
There is a difference between "seepage", which is a few drops a week, and a failed RMS, which will be a "puddle" daily. Mine all "seep", & I don't worry about it.
There is another possible issue causing the spring noise. There is a lock ring on the front strut that holds the sway bar attachment collar on the strut. (The lower of 3 lockrings in the pic) Mine has come loose several times. It will cause a "clunk" going in & out of driveways, & other slow speed turns. The race shop that did my alignment says it's virtually impossible to get these tight with the spanner wrench, you have to use a drift punch and hammer. Yes, they are aluminum, and yes hitting them with a punch & hammer seems immoral, but, that's the only way I got mine to quit coming loose. If I were to take the struts out, I would disassemble them and use two lock rings like are used to hold the springs in position. But, till then....
The rotors are fine-- mine developed the same cracks after a few thousand miles of street driving. The stock rotors just aren't that beefy, I guess.
The tires? All Porsches grind up the insides of the rear tires. The alignment is critical to tire life. But, it only affects how soon you'll need to replace the rear tires, not why. Disappearing inside edges are always the reason you'll be buying new rear tires, it's just a matter of how often. The tire pic is a rear from my 996C2.... they all do it, normal..... (unfortunately)
Hope this helps too.
There is a difference between "seepage", which is a few drops a week, and a failed RMS, which will be a "puddle" daily. Mine all "seep", & I don't worry about it.
There is another possible issue causing the spring noise. There is a lock ring on the front strut that holds the sway bar attachment collar on the strut. (The lower of 3 lockrings in the pic) Mine has come loose several times. It will cause a "clunk" going in & out of driveways, & other slow speed turns. The race shop that did my alignment says it's virtually impossible to get these tight with the spanner wrench, you have to use a drift punch and hammer. Yes, they are aluminum, and yes hitting them with a punch & hammer seems immoral, but, that's the only way I got mine to quit coming loose. If I were to take the struts out, I would disassemble them and use two lock rings like are used to hold the springs in position. But, till then....
The rotors are fine-- mine developed the same cracks after a few thousand miles of street driving. The stock rotors just aren't that beefy, I guess.
The tires? All Porsches grind up the insides of the rear tires. The alignment is critical to tire life. But, it only affects how soon you'll need to replace the rear tires, not why. Disappearing inside edges are always the reason you'll be buying new rear tires, it's just a matter of how often. The tire pic is a rear from my 996C2.... they all do it, normal..... (unfortunately)
Hope this helps too.
09-24-2010, 11:57 PM
#21
09-25-2010, 12:03 AM
#22
Regarding the suspension noise, check the front sway bar bold that connects to the bottom of the strut. If it gets even a little loose, you'll hear a noise every time you go over a bump.
Since you're in SoCal, get your alignment done at GMG instead. They can also tell you about a few minor upgrades you can make to the suspension to really get the most out of it...even if you don't track the car. I have the European alignment on my GT3 with a few GMG goodies. I get about 5K miles out of PS2 with regular highway and street driving. More if I'm lucky. Get used to that and congrats on the GT3. You'll have to bring it to Cars and Coffee in Irvine some time.
Since you're in SoCal, get your alignment done at GMG instead. They can also tell you about a few minor upgrades you can make to the suspension to really get the most out of it...even if you don't track the car. I have the European alignment on my GT3 with a few GMG goodies. I get about 5K miles out of PS2 with regular highway and street driving. More if I'm lucky. Get used to that and congrats on the GT3. You'll have to bring it to Cars and Coffee in Irvine some time.
09-25-2010, 12:41 AM
#23
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steve, i think you have way too much toe or camber if your have inside wear like that.
when i had 996c2 it had -2 deg of camber (RA1), i never have such severe wear.
btw, GT3 alignment drifts quite a bit. if you dont align it every 6 months or so, you are kidding yourself. my is alignment chked every 4 weeks. trust me, they move.
when i had 996c2 it had -2 deg of camber (RA1), i never have such severe wear.
btw, GT3 alignment drifts quite a bit. if you dont align it every 6 months or so, you are kidding yourself. my is alignment chked every 4 weeks. trust me, they move.
09-27-2010, 01:54 AM
#24
So I take my nice, new to me, GT3 to the dealership for some issues I noticed and this is what happened.
Issues:
1) I am seeing some seepage from under the engine.
2) There is a noise coming from the front end suspension when I turn or the spring changes load at very low speeds. It soulds like a spring adjusting positions. I imagine I don't hear it at higher speeds due to engine noise.
3) I am seeing small cracks on the front rotors that are about 2-3 mm from some of the holes in the rotors.
4) inside of the rear tires are cording. Is there something wrong with the rear end? Camber? The car is bone stock on original OEM tires.
Reply:
1) They did not that there is confirmed seepage between the block and the transmission, but seepage is ok....a leak is not. The factory allows for some of this to take place. They want to put a die in the oil and have me drive it around a bit so they can tell if there is a problem with the RMS.
2) The noise is normal and expected in these cars after 3-4 years.
3) The rotors are fine. They tend to do this in these cars but it is difficult to diagnose since these cars are tracked all the time and heavy heat and loads will do this to the rotors. They can replace them, but at my expense. And by the way, there is a new part number for an "upgraded/improved" OEM rotor that we would use.
4) The tires need to be replaced and an alignment done. Visual inspection shows nothing looks bent or broken. Total estimate $1,536 for parts and labor.
My opinions:
1) I have never heard of a MFG saying any oil leaving the engine is a good thing. They acknowledge that it looks like a RMS, but they want to see where it is coming from, for sure.
2) I have no idea, but is sounds like BS to me.
3) I have read on the forum about the front rotors and my question is this, if the original rotor is not defective, why come out with a revised/upgraded/improved rotor? Would that not mean that they should perform a warranty replacement?
4) It is not normal for the rear tires to cord after 6k miles. They won't do anything more than a visual inspection to diagnose the problem. They will charge $259.99 for the alignment if they don't find a problem other than the car being out of alignment. If they do, they will warranty the alignment. I suspect they will say the camber is off and adjust the toe of the car claiming it is just out of alignment.
The kicker:
This car was purchased and given a CPO status. I have all the paperwork to prove it and the dealership confirms that it should have had a CPO warranty as it was paid for. The dealership, mysteriously, didn't get this turned in and somehow , "the CPO paperwork never got punched." So the dealership is saying they will warranty the car themselves just like the CPO warranty does...which runs out in November. The dealership that is looking at the car now is the original dealership that sold the car and was suppose to do the CPO.
Looking forward the your input.
Issues:
1) I am seeing some seepage from under the engine.
2) There is a noise coming from the front end suspension when I turn or the spring changes load at very low speeds. It soulds like a spring adjusting positions. I imagine I don't hear it at higher speeds due to engine noise.
3) I am seeing small cracks on the front rotors that are about 2-3 mm from some of the holes in the rotors.
4) inside of the rear tires are cording. Is there something wrong with the rear end? Camber? The car is bone stock on original OEM tires.
Reply:
1) They did not that there is confirmed seepage between the block and the transmission, but seepage is ok....a leak is not. The factory allows for some of this to take place. They want to put a die in the oil and have me drive it around a bit so they can tell if there is a problem with the RMS.
2) The noise is normal and expected in these cars after 3-4 years.
3) The rotors are fine. They tend to do this in these cars but it is difficult to diagnose since these cars are tracked all the time and heavy heat and loads will do this to the rotors. They can replace them, but at my expense. And by the way, there is a new part number for an "upgraded/improved" OEM rotor that we would use.
4) The tires need to be replaced and an alignment done. Visual inspection shows nothing looks bent or broken. Total estimate $1,536 for parts and labor.
My opinions:
1) I have never heard of a MFG saying any oil leaving the engine is a good thing. They acknowledge that it looks like a RMS, but they want to see where it is coming from, for sure.
2) I have no idea, but is sounds like BS to me.
3) I have read on the forum about the front rotors and my question is this, if the original rotor is not defective, why come out with a revised/upgraded/improved rotor? Would that not mean that they should perform a warranty replacement?
4) It is not normal for the rear tires to cord after 6k miles. They won't do anything more than a visual inspection to diagnose the problem. They will charge $259.99 for the alignment if they don't find a problem other than the car being out of alignment. If they do, they will warranty the alignment. I suspect they will say the camber is off and adjust the toe of the car claiming it is just out of alignment.
The kicker:
This car was purchased and given a CPO status. I have all the paperwork to prove it and the dealership confirms that it should have had a CPO warranty as it was paid for. The dealership, mysteriously, didn't get this turned in and somehow , "the CPO paperwork never got punched." So the dealership is saying they will warranty the car themselves just like the CPO warranty does...which runs out in November. The dealership that is looking at the car now is the original dealership that sold the car and was suppose to do the CPO.
Looking forward the your input.
Be calm, it will all be alright...
Most don't gauge their tire life by the "thousands of miles". It is almost futile. Buy stock in tire companies. Yes, inside tire wear is normal too.
But I agree, your car should never have passed a CPO. Sorry to say, but you were done wrong by the stealer dealer.
09-27-2010, 07:06 PM
#25
Rennlist Member
Regarding the suspension noise, check the front sway bar bold that connects to the bottom of the strut. If it gets even a little loose, you'll hear a noise every time you go over a bump.
Since you're in SoCal, get your alignment done at GMG instead. They can also tell you about a few minor upgrades you can make to the suspension to really get the most out of it...even if you don't track the car. I have the European alignment on my GT3 with a few GMG goodies. I get about 5K miles out of PS2 with regular highway and street driving. More if I'm lucky. Get used to that and congrats on the GT3. You'll have to bring it to Cars and Coffee in Irvine some time.
Since you're in SoCal, get your alignment done at GMG instead. They can also tell you about a few minor upgrades you can make to the suspension to really get the most out of it...even if you don't track the car. I have the European alignment on my GT3 with a few GMG goodies. I get about 5K miles out of PS2 with regular highway and street driving. More if I'm lucky. Get used to that and congrats on the GT3. You'll have to bring it to Cars and Coffee in Irvine some time.
a nice OEM CF RS rear wing is also called for!
09-29-2010, 12:26 PM
#27
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That's what I also think happened.
An alignment good for track use is not good for long tire life on the road. Negative camber chews up the insides when driving straight or not fast enough in the corners.
And as mooty said, check the alignment regularly. And do it at a specialist place that sees a lot of GT3s. Every car/driver combination needs a different alignment. The dealer is usually good to give you the factory spec alignment which may not necessary suit your needs.
I don't know how buying of CPO'd cars works but I think if you accepted delivery of a car with corded tires you get to keep the corded tires. I could be wrong about that, though.
09-29-2010, 12:31 PM
#28
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GMG might also have a wing too
09-29-2010, 12:32 PM
#29
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That's what I also think happened.
An alignment good for track use is not good for long tire life on the road. Negative camber chews up the insides when driving straight or not fast enough in the corners.
And as mooty said, check the alignment regularly. And do it at a specialist place that sees a lot of GT3s. Every car/driver combination needs a different alignment. The dealer is usually good to give you the factory spec alignment which may not necessary suit your needs.
I don't know how buying of CPO'd cars works but I think if you accepted delivery of a car with corded tires you get to keep the corded tires. I could be wrong about that, though.
An alignment good for track use is not good for long tire life on the road. Negative camber chews up the insides when driving straight or not fast enough in the corners.
And as mooty said, check the alignment regularly. And do it at a specialist place that sees a lot of GT3s. Every car/driver combination needs a different alignment. The dealer is usually good to give you the factory spec alignment which may not necessary suit your needs.
I don't know how buying of CPO'd cars works but I think if you accepted delivery of a car with corded tires you get to keep the corded tires. I could be wrong about that, though.
09-29-2010, 05:51 PM
#30
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