GT3RS clutch and flywheel
07-06-2005, 01:44 AM
#31
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So to answer a couple questions...
Most dealers will OK the flywheel and not void the warranty. It is afterall standard equipment on similar models. Most want to install the components, it's billable time. Additionally, dealer warranty work is a profit center when processed correctly by their service and parts departments.
Our kit includes everything you'll need to make the transfer occur as it should, new clutch disc, pressure plate, release bearing, pilot bearing, lever bearings, flywheel, hardware and new main seal if you need it. We even include the alignment tool for those DIY'ers.
There is no additional software/flashing needed. The software is indeed for the RS engine, not the flywheel.
As for bang for the buck, it's the most you can get for $1375+labor. A single mass flywheel GT3 will pull away on post apex acceleration from a stock dual mass flywheel GT3.
Austin
Most dealers will OK the flywheel and not void the warranty. It is afterall standard equipment on similar models. Most want to install the components, it's billable time. Additionally, dealer warranty work is a profit center when processed correctly by their service and parts departments.
Our kit includes everything you'll need to make the transfer occur as it should, new clutch disc, pressure plate, release bearing, pilot bearing, lever bearings, flywheel, hardware and new main seal if you need it. We even include the alignment tool for those DIY'ers.
There is no additional software/flashing needed. The software is indeed for the RS engine, not the flywheel.
As for bang for the buck, it's the most you can get for $1375+labor. A single mass flywheel GT3 will pull away on post apex acceleration from a stock dual mass flywheel GT3.
Austin
07-06-2005, 09:47 AM
#32
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Originally Posted by Austin
A single mass flywheel GT3 will pull away on post apex acceleration from a stock dual mass flywheel GT3.
Austin
Austin
and $3,500 including labor and shipping will get a 4.00:1 RSR ring and pinion gear and an steel stiffer LSD.
07-06-2005, 01:28 PM
#33
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Just my $ 02. for those of you GT3er's considering this mod... My competition here in So Cal is mainly just GT3's. I can tell by their acceleration who has the lighter flywheel and who doesn't. At Cal Speedway a few months ago, only one of the 4 GT3's could stay near me on the NASCAR oval.....(Hi Evan/Cosmos!)
07-15-2005, 02:58 AM
#34
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NJ is right.
To answer some questions I received via email this week...
btw, the stock GT3 is a 3.44:1 ring and pinion unit. The RSR/Cup is a 4.0:1, it will take off like a bat out of hell and is excellent for tighter tracks; and yes we carry them.
Austin
To answer some questions I received via email this week...
btw, the stock GT3 is a 3.44:1 ring and pinion unit. The RSR/Cup is a 4.0:1, it will take off like a bat out of hell and is excellent for tighter tracks; and yes we carry them.
Austin
07-15-2005, 12:18 PM
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Hey Austin, what do you think a ballpark figure would be of parts + labor of changing to the RSR/Cup R&P? Would it be beneficial (labor-wise) to do this in conjunction with a clutch/flywheel change? Thanks--
Geoff.
Geoff.
07-15-2005, 02:14 PM
#36
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Austin-your the ones who pushes us off the slope huh?Darn you got too much goodies I can't stand it. Can I work there and get employee discounts? I'm free Thurs-Sunday : ). Purchased one of those cup rotors from ya via my friend from Eric's Foreign Car Service. Thanks. Mike PS-how much for R&P plus flywheel including labor with employee discount: ).
07-15-2005, 03:12 PM
#37
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Geoff:
My car was probably one of the first ones in US to get the GT3RS lightweight flywheel installed. A great upgrade.
Recently I was in need of a new clutch. In order to install a new clutch or a lightweight flywheel, the engine and transmission have to be removed from the car.
I had a few complaints with the stock gears. The spacing between 3rd and 6th is perfect according to the dyno runs I did on my car (everything lands around 6400rpm or more when shifting at redline), but the final gear is so long that you will never get out of 4th on a fast racetrack, probably you'll use 5th for a very short time. The long spacing in 2nd and 3rd gear and the long final gear (3.44:1) kill the car on the medium speed sections at the track.
I had the option to re-gear the transmission and I was going on that path.
Few considerations about our tranny:
1) 1st and 2nd gear are fixed in the shaft, it is not possible to change 2nd gear as specified in the GT3 manual.
2) getting a 1st gear shaft with changeable 2nd is $3500 in parts alone.
3) the 5th pinion can be installed in 6th. The 4th pinion can't be installed in 5th.
4) ball park it's about $1k per every gear.
5) Most likely if the car has seen some action at the track and it has more than 10,000 miles, the LSD will be gone (practically no torque, very easy to verify). The LSD is made of brass.
I needed a shorter 2nd gear because I enjoy autocrossing, and using 335 taller tires with the stock gears simply doesn't help to put enough power down out of the turns on the parking lot.
Brian Copans from BMC&G in Ohio (Thanks George and Thanks Greg) did all the work. Brian recommended me to just change the ring and pinion gear with the one from the 2005 RSR (4.00:1) (stronger than the 2004 RSR which is stronger than the Cup car one). He also installed a steel LSD from the 04 Cup Car which is stronger in torque than the stock one (90ft/lbs vs. 40~ ft/lbs stock), and it's a real 40/80 instead of the stock 25/80.
Results:
- Autocross: the car is using between 40whp-50whp more at the typical autocross course. The lack of torque out of the turns is gone and now I have to control the gas pedal. Last week we won the SCCA National Tour in Mass, coming within tenths of a second from who is considered the best autocrosser in the entire country.
- Track: At Pocono Long course I'm using 2nd,3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th. LimeRock 3rd, 4th and 5th. Both tracks used to be 2 gears tracks for me. The X50 996TT used to walk away from my car on straight line, now it can't keep up. My car walks away from the stock GT3s really bad. Getting on the long back straight at Pocono, the car pulls way more than a well driven stock GT3, leaving the stock GT3 around 10 cars behind before getting on the infield. I can lift the gas on a curve and the car won't get nervous, you will notice the difference on the LSD.
- Street: First gear is short (40mph), the S2000 gets 39mph. The car pulls in 2nd gear faster than before, and the same applies to all the remaining gears. I used to drive on the highways in 4th-5th gear, now I do it in 5th-6th gear. The acceleration from 50mph-100mph is extremely impressive, to the point that I'm not used to that yet.
This transmission upgrade is a must in my opinion.
My car was probably one of the first ones in US to get the GT3RS lightweight flywheel installed. A great upgrade.
Recently I was in need of a new clutch. In order to install a new clutch or a lightweight flywheel, the engine and transmission have to be removed from the car.
I had a few complaints with the stock gears. The spacing between 3rd and 6th is perfect according to the dyno runs I did on my car (everything lands around 6400rpm or more when shifting at redline), but the final gear is so long that you will never get out of 4th on a fast racetrack, probably you'll use 5th for a very short time. The long spacing in 2nd and 3rd gear and the long final gear (3.44:1) kill the car on the medium speed sections at the track.
I had the option to re-gear the transmission and I was going on that path.
Few considerations about our tranny:
1) 1st and 2nd gear are fixed in the shaft, it is not possible to change 2nd gear as specified in the GT3 manual.
2) getting a 1st gear shaft with changeable 2nd is $3500 in parts alone.
3) the 5th pinion can be installed in 6th. The 4th pinion can't be installed in 5th.
4) ball park it's about $1k per every gear.
5) Most likely if the car has seen some action at the track and it has more than 10,000 miles, the LSD will be gone (practically no torque, very easy to verify). The LSD is made of brass.
I needed a shorter 2nd gear because I enjoy autocrossing, and using 335 taller tires with the stock gears simply doesn't help to put enough power down out of the turns on the parking lot.
Brian Copans from BMC&G in Ohio (Thanks George and Thanks Greg) did all the work. Brian recommended me to just change the ring and pinion gear with the one from the 2005 RSR (4.00:1) (stronger than the 2004 RSR which is stronger than the Cup car one). He also installed a steel LSD from the 04 Cup Car which is stronger in torque than the stock one (90ft/lbs vs. 40~ ft/lbs stock), and it's a real 40/80 instead of the stock 25/80.
Results:
- Autocross: the car is using between 40whp-50whp more at the typical autocross course. The lack of torque out of the turns is gone and now I have to control the gas pedal. Last week we won the SCCA National Tour in Mass, coming within tenths of a second from who is considered the best autocrosser in the entire country.
- Track: At Pocono Long course I'm using 2nd,3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th. LimeRock 3rd, 4th and 5th. Both tracks used to be 2 gears tracks for me. The X50 996TT used to walk away from my car on straight line, now it can't keep up. My car walks away from the stock GT3s really bad. Getting on the long back straight at Pocono, the car pulls way more than a well driven stock GT3, leaving the stock GT3 around 10 cars behind before getting on the infield. I can lift the gas on a curve and the car won't get nervous, you will notice the difference on the LSD.
- Street: First gear is short (40mph), the S2000 gets 39mph. The car pulls in 2nd gear faster than before, and the same applies to all the remaining gears. I used to drive on the highways in 4th-5th gear, now I do it in 5th-6th gear. The acceleration from 50mph-100mph is extremely impressive, to the point that I'm not used to that yet.
This transmission upgrade is a must in my opinion.
07-15-2005, 03:26 PM
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NJ-GT:
Oh, that sounds absolutely incredible! My local track (MSR) is a short 1.7mi course with hardly any room for the GT3 to stretch its legs. Towards the end of the 2 short straights, I'm in 4th, but only for a second. It would be really great to be able to get into 4th much earlier to make the shift "worth it" (as far as time it takes to shift, etc.). The other somewhat local track is TWS, which has a much longer front straight (part of the NASCAR oval). I get into 5th there, but only for about 3-5 seconds at the end of the straight. I think the GT3 has a lot of potential on both of these tracks with shorter gears, so it sounds like changing the R&P is the way to go. We'll see how much longer the dif lasts. I haven't noticed any real problems with it, but it is worth checking out. If you don't mind my asking, about how much did you pay for the work you had done? Do you expect more longevity out of it than the stock parts (from your post it sounds like it). Thanks a lot--
Geoff.
Oh, that sounds absolutely incredible! My local track (MSR) is a short 1.7mi course with hardly any room for the GT3 to stretch its legs. Towards the end of the 2 short straights, I'm in 4th, but only for a second. It would be really great to be able to get into 4th much earlier to make the shift "worth it" (as far as time it takes to shift, etc.). The other somewhat local track is TWS, which has a much longer front straight (part of the NASCAR oval). I get into 5th there, but only for about 3-5 seconds at the end of the straight. I think the GT3 has a lot of potential on both of these tracks with shorter gears, so it sounds like changing the R&P is the way to go. We'll see how much longer the dif lasts. I haven't noticed any real problems with it, but it is worth checking out. If you don't mind my asking, about how much did you pay for the work you had done? Do you expect more longevity out of it than the stock parts (from your post it sounds like it). Thanks a lot--
Geoff.
07-15-2005, 03:54 PM
#39
Three Wheelin'
I must admit with my regearing and flywheel change the car is a joy to drive.....always in the power band....with the regearing I now walk away from my old Z06 which makes 420rwhp corrected....it does not cost as much as you think for the gear change.....or ring & pinion as NJ-GT did...Brian Copans is that good.
Another thing i have noticed since i had it regeared is that i never miss the 2-3 shift as i did before.
NJ-GT,
How do you like your new suspension setup?
I need your help picking the Moton CS DA shocks and springs?
Another thing i have noticed since i had it regeared is that i never miss the 2-3 shift as i did before.
NJ-GT,
How do you like your new suspension setup?
I need your help picking the Moton CS DA shocks and springs?
07-15-2005, 05:07 PM
#40
Nordschleife Master
Originally Posted by NJ-GT
Recently I was in need of a new clutch. In order to install a new clutch or a lightweight flywheel, the engine and transmission have to be removed from the car.
07-15-2005, 06:27 PM
#41
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Originally Posted by rockitman
I don't think that is correct. Only the tranny needs to be dropped. The motor stays in and does not need to be removed, fyi
I think it's a PITA to get the upper bolts on the transmission loose, if not impossible.
07-15-2005, 06:30 PM
#42
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Originally Posted by Z06
NJ-GT,
How do you like your new suspension setup?
I need your help picking the Moton CS DA shocks and springs?
How do you like your new suspension setup?
I need your help picking the Moton CS DA shocks and springs?
07-15-2005, 06:34 PM
#43
Nordschleife Master
Originally Posted by NJ-GT
My Porsche shop removes complete engine for clutch work.
I think it's a PITA to get the upper bolts on the transmission loose, if not impossible.
I think it's a PITA to get the upper bolts on the transmission loose, if not impossible.
07-28-2005, 02:19 PM
#44
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Originally Posted by NJ-GT
Brian Copans from BMC&G in Ohio (Thanks George and Thanks Greg) did all the work. Brian recommended me to just change the ring and pinion gear with the one from the 2005 RSR (4.00:1) (stronger than the 2004 RSR which is stronger than the Cup car one). He also installed a steel LSD from the 04 Cup Car which is stronger in torque than the stock one (90ft/lbs vs. 40~ ft/lbs stock), and it's a real 40/80 instead of the stock 25/80.
You are welcome. Glad you used Brian, he is certainly one of the best, if not the best transmission guy in the country. He did my transmission over 5 years ago and it is still perfect.
