Cupcar

FWIW, the 1992 Porsche 964 Carrera RS (European) had cast magnesium wheels. The looked identical to the wheels supplied on the Turbo or RS America which were made of aluminum, same molds different material. The magnesium versions were around 25 pounds lighter per set than the aluminum. I have not heard of failures in the magnesium versions.

Mike Buck

Magnesium wheels were an option on the base C5's before that too.

I think the point "cupcar" is trying to make is that Porsche isn't offering forged wheels on their top model cars, which is a change from the past. I cannot think of a post-1989 Porsche with forged wheels standard. In 1989, every model in the lineup from 944 to 911 to 928 had forged aluminum wheels either standard or optional. Currently Porsche offers $10k PCCB brake upgrades, but no fancy special forged wheel upgrade at any price

Yargk

Sorry if this has already been mentioned. I've heard that one of Porsche's explanations about their heavy wheels has been that tire weight varies so dramatically from brand to brand so wheel weight isn't as important. I think this is silly because it's always good to have the least unsprung weight no matter what tire you choose and also it's kind of odd since the PCCB is advertised for having decreased weight.

curtsm

Might consider profit as a motive here.

Porsche went through dark days in the early 1990's and in looking at their cars recently, they seem quite focused on margins. I think I read somewhere that they're the most profitable car company (gross margin terms) today. For Porsche engineers tasked with making a business decision about wheels, how many more people would have bought GT3's if they had magnesium wheels? Cool, slightly better performance. On the other hand, how many more great car magazine reviews would we have read before buying? Can't imagine magnesium wheels making much difference to journalists.

Personally, I've noticed the difference in balance and high speed stability with heavier wheels (I've owned Ruf, Fikse, Kinesis, now these BBS wheels), and I can see that it would translate into lower costs passed back to the factory during warranty when you don't have people complaining -- "it vibrates a bit at 65 Mph".

- curt

Cupcar

Porsche introduced the forged aluminum wheel to the world for automobile use in 1967 on the 911S, cast magnesium wheels on the 1970 914/6. Porsche used magnesium from 1969 to 1977 for the crankcase and valve covers and the gearbox case. An alumium rear decklid on the 1970-71 911S, fiberglass bumpers and decklid on the 1972-73 911 RS, the doors, fenders and hood on the 928 were also aluminum. Essentially none of these materials or techniques are used today although Porsche has added an aluminum hood on the latest 997.

According to Forbes magazine Porsche makes it's lowest per unit profit on the Boxster S at 23%, the Turbo is at 45%, I suspect the GT2 is over 100%.

At these profit margins with Porsche's history of using light materials and if competitive market forces dictated, we should have a Porsche with aluminum body (Audi A8,Acura NSA, others do) or at least hood, front fenders and doors. Magnesium would be in the gearbox and/or engine (the new BMW 3 series has a magnesium crankcase), forged alloy wheels, etc. I figure the car would be at around 2700 pounds or less and not at the portly over 3100 it is today. The Corvette only weighs 30-40 pounds more than the 911!!! Times have changed the Corvette used to be over a thousand pounds more than a Porsche.

Phokaioglaukos

I wonder what the gross margin is on the GT3....

Cupcar#12

don't forget the 57-59' 356 Carrera GT
it used Aluminum for the bonnet, engine lid and doors, as well as a light weight interior (vinyl insteead of carpet) and light weight fixed seats plus other light weight componets (aluminum steering rack case, etc)
just think what 45 years of relentless pursuit of weight savings would accomplish.

GTGTGT

I believe that the 997 uses aluminum on a few of the body panels - I know the front hood.

Cupcar

Excellent point Cupcar 12 the history of light body materials goes back to the 356!!! I forgot about that, not to mention the fiberglass 904...for sure Porsche was at the vanguard of lightweight design in it's past.

I would guess Porsche's margin on a GT3 about that of the Turbo's 45%. Forbes was not clear if this 45% was Porsche AG's margin alone or the collective margin of Porsche AG + PCNA + dealer.

The 997 has an alloy front hood only.

BTW I have a Nissan 350Z which has forged aluminum suspension parts, aluminum hood, aluminum wheels, carbon fiber driveshaft, aluminum V6 engine and aluminum gearbox and it only cost $30K out the door.

Sun Ra

do these wheels fit a Gt3??? for $500, you could replace them every so often....

Larry Herman

That's what I was going to do, till I found out that 10" was the widest they made for the rear. Some guys are running them with spacers, and that would probably be fine for the street, but not on the track IMHO.

NJ-GT

The best bang for the buck available for the GT3 is CCW.

$1800 a set of custom made lightweight 3-pieces wheels with titanium bolts (19 lbs front and 20 lbs rear).

The front ones can be made on 9.5" at a minimum, because a narrower one won't fit our calipers.

http://www.ccwheel.com

DCLee

I'm sorry, but these wheels fail the OOOGLY test. Yes, they are cheap. But they look cheap.

I'll stick with BBS Motorsport and Fikse Profil... (FWIW, I think the Manthey wheels are not great looking and are ridiculously priced, but that's one man's opinion.).

Lee in D.C.

NJ-GT

Lee:

ugly wheels for an ugly car is ok.

If I want to drive a cute car, then I could get a Mini, a Beetle and a 997 for the price a paid for my ugly car. The three of them smile at you when you look at them.

Sun Ra

NJ-GT,

can you post a photo of the gt3 CCw?

and lee,

who has the best price on the bbs, and what do they weigh?