Greg Fishman

No. You can't just assume anything taking results from one test to another. Conditions, driving technique, etc can be very different.

HP rules acceleration tests and the 996TT has 450 vs the 380 of the GT3. Add to that the grip off the line with an abusive launch and the thing will run like a scalded ape. Same for the 993TT (I think it was a tuner car= big hp).

brh986

I have yet to see any test where a turbo betters a GT3's times at all (it could exist) let alone by a significant amount. It has been well documented that the 380 hp is grossly understated. Dynos have arged from 347 to 363 rwhp (if I remember correctly). I really dont' think a 9% drive train loss is realistic, it has to be underrated.

Steve in FL

I don't know if Porsche underrates the 996TT HP to the same extent they do for the GT3 but the factory rating for the 996TT is 415HP, not 450HP. The X50 powerkit version is rated at 444HP.

brh986

I don't know about the X50 package but the dynos I've seen for a "regular" 996TT would seem to suggest that it is rated just about on the money.

Greg Fishman

The car had the X50 package. I am sure they just rounded up for the test.

Again you have to test on the same day, under the same conditions for any results to be meaningful.

Viken

FWIW:

996 Turbo: 420 HP DIN / 414.12 BHP SAE
996 Turbo X50: 450 HP DIN / 443.7 BHP SAE

1 HP DIN = 0.986 BHP SAE

NJ-GT

Turbo 996s are heavy.

Take a GT3, add wide body, add two turbochargers and two intecoolers, add AWD, add sunroof, add sound system with amplifier and 10 speakers, add cruise control, add motorized spoiler, add rear seats, etc..

They are around 400lbs heavier than a GT3.

In the same test day, a GT3 will stop faster than a Turbo: bigger brakes, lighter weight, wider tires.

Steve in FL

NJ-GT: Cruise control adds no weight to a car with EGas as there's no additional mechanical linkages as with pre-EGas cars. Actually it does add the weight of the cruise control stalk on the steering column and the wires to it but I'm thinking that's well under 1lb.

brh986

The rest of his point was valid though. I would be willing to place a substantial bet on a GT3 vs a Turbo 0-100-0. Add XD50 to the turbo and maybe it would be a less substantial bet but I still think the GT3 could match it at least.

Where is the GT2 in all this? Shouldn't it have been in that test? Anyone got a 0-100-0 number for a GT3 or GT2?

Greg Fishman

If this were a rolling start it would be a closer battle. But if the driver is willing to abuse the car, a AWD 996TT will LAUNCH off the line. Do you ever watch the Speed World Challenge? The Audi RS6 literally gets two car lengths at the start due to the AWD.
Weight plays a smaller role once the cars are under way. HP is king. The X50's close to 70hp difference and AWD launch will come out ahead, IMO. Wouldn't surprise me if the TT were dead even with the GT2 due to the launch. Remember this is only up to 100mph and back down.
It would be a fun excercise but I know that if I owned the TT I wouldn't want it to be driven that hard as it would be very hard on the drivetrain.

Also remember the GT3 is geared taller than a TT is.

brh986

Why would they gear the GT3 taller than the TT when they both have the same top speed (actually i think the TT's top speed is 2 mph faster)?

Dynos have shown the TT X50 does NOT have close 70 horsepower on the GT3. I believe the regular TT rated at 415 horsepower dynos about the same or a little less.

Greg Fishman

Look at the gearing charts for each. The GT3 is taller in the lower gears. Remember, this is only up to 100mph.

Even if the hp were the same, the launch would be the deciding factor.

brh986

Ok I admit loss on this debate now

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...he/index1.html

I still think it will beat the non x50 and for numbers like that I think the x50 is good for more than 450 hp

rockitman

Here's my stock dyno chart compared(overlayed) to a 996TT done in 4th gear on a Mustang dyno. Maybe you can draw some conclusions from it...

macfly

From looking at the charts I imagine that the 993TT has an explosive delivery with all the umph coming in at much lower rpms. The GT3 looks to have a really even spread of torque into power over the range, and it describes visually what I feel the motor delivers.

How can you compare the feel of the two motors on the road?
Did the TT feel like it was much stronger?
Does the free spinning and wide powerband of the GT engine give more of a visceral and 'connected' feel?