Barn996

Say it isn't so...

himself

I agree with this to a certain degree, especially in the context of first time 996 buyers. Most folks coming from non-Porsches don't appreciate the need for a PPI. It's more out of extrapolating prior car buying experience to the 996 that doesn't usually entail a PPI or serious internet investigation. I dind't get a PPI for my first Porsche. I looked at the Carfax and the warranty and drove away.

In my mind, saying they are a different "sort" only implies those buyers were not aware of that they could have done a little more investigation up front. I don't think this makes anyone elitist or having more money than brains.

-td

ivangene

well I admit it, the OP described me when I bought the 996

right down to NO PPI and no Carfax check...just "bought the car cuz it was pretty and a Porsche"

figured in my mind the biggest expense "could be" a motor blow up and might cost me $5-7k what else could go wrong...BUY IT! didnt sleep well that first year at all

Dennis C

Maybe all those 996 buyers who buy their car on a whim and never know about IMS issues are better off than we think. They buy the car, enjoy it and never worry about their engine expolding because they never know it's a potential issue. Does that sound so bad? Maybe ignorance is bliss...

What about 997 buyers? The IMS issue wasn't resolved until the 997.2. 997 buyers must be a different sort also. Cayennes have the potential for major issues, so their buyers must be a different sort too.

I think this whole discussion is silly.

Marc Gelefsky

Is it too early to start drinking?

Divot

I look forward to the new thread in the P!g Pen. But in fairness, that is a different sort.

ivangene

way ahead of you Marc.....have not stopped since yesterday morning

Marc Gelefsky

Well than cheers my friend

Let us drown out our regrets and frustrations.

Flat6 Innovations

Ivangene made an interesting point..
New factory engines used to be 5-7K, today that START at 13K and now core charges can be 18K!! This is something that we knew would happen, and eventually crate engines will go away from the factory.. The new engine cost was send up like a rocket in 2009 due to the value of the dollar..

A lot of potential 996 owners call us first, BUT a majority call us AFTER they have had the car for 3 weeks or so and start looking to google for info on performance upgrades, only to be seriously disappointed.

I recently sold my Wife's 996, the purchaser had never owned a Porsche, but he had carried out all the research and was an informed buyer. Because of that he was smart and bought a car that already had the IMS Retrofit bearing installed and that was proven with the door jamb decal with our serial number.

Honestly, many more purchasers of Boxsters seem to do their homework up front rather than 996 purchasers.. Try that one on for size-

nick49

I was/ am the other extreme.

I started looking at Boxsters in '97. It had a new refreshing look and the new watercooled flat 6 that all the motomedia was highly praising. It was also affordable, in relative Porsche terms.

I was reading everything I could, and had membership on every Porsche internet forum trying to learn everything Porsche. In '97, '98 and '99 there were virtually no cars available for sale in any model Boxster and 911s were virtually non existant as well. Production was up from previous years but demand was skyrocketing. This was due to the great economy, the internet going mainstream, the technology and dot com boom.

Any Porsche would require a special order to get one and time varied from a few months to almost a year for delivery. Used Boxsters were almost as much or in some cases more than new ones, and the 993 were very expensive as well.

In '98 I became a "waiter", a term for those who had ordered a car and were waiting for the build, ocean transport and dealer delivery. I was going to share the car with my wife so I ordered a tip. It was Arctic Silver with Boxster Red full leather interior, cruise, trip computer, CD, 17" wheels and a few other bits. The cost was a whopping $61k.

After a couple of months, I got cold feet and gave up my order. This was due to what I considered too many potential issues that I didn't want to deal with on an early model production run. I'd wait until things got better sorted. The internet was a new tool for alerting people in various circles around the world anything and everything regarding what there is to like and dislike about anything.

I quickly learned of cracked and slipped sleeves and heads causing intermix issues, intermediate shafts breaking and the all too common leaking rear seals. There were also a host of other issues that were not engine related but would be considered a pita to have to deal with. Fortunately at this time, everythig was covered under warranty, but the inconvience of the failure and unknown future regarding valuations was more than I wanted to deal with at this time.

Fast forward to spring '02. My wife sold her mint Corvette and bought a '99 Boxster with under 8k miles still under warranty. We still have it and it has been off warranty for 9 years. It's like mint and a hoot to drive. It has less than 30k miles.

In '03 I bought a 996 Cab, looked for 15 months to find the perfect car. Had a PPI, flew half way across the country, drove it back. Very nice! My years of research and months of looking paid off. Took nearly a year to find my Turbo. It paid big dividends as well. I saw several pics of the car, spoke with the person handling the sale for the owner, one of his employees that helps with personal matters. Had a copy of the PPI from a Porsche dealer that uses a CPO checklist. Asked lots of questions, got favorable answers.

Nice to know exactly you have before you even see or take delivery of the car. In the case of the Turbo, I was totally blown away when I saw it. It looked better than a new car sitting on the dealer showroom. I paid for the car before I even heard it run or drove it, it looked that good!

Dennis C

I did quite a bit of research on mine too. I read about the 996 and looked at many potential cars until I bought mine roughly 6 months later.

Down South

I do sometimes miss him, though!

j beede

Agreed. None of the 996 owners I have met knew about rennlist or RennTech. This is consistent with the observations in the OP and your comments above.

To the uninitiated, a 996 looks to be a startingly cheap way to drive a lovely exotic car. The "true truth" is too often another matter altogether. I believe 996 owners on rennlist need to be more forward in educating newcomers who drop by to confirm the 996 "bargains" that they find. As I have noted before... MY99 through MY01 996s often look nearly new and are a blast to drive. The educated buyer knows that under that exterior could be lurking cylinder head issues, RMS, IMS, AOS, etc. It is my impression that many rennlisters think a MY99 through MY901 996 with a reman engine represnts a "great find". The truth is that many reman engines have the revised IMSB with 22mm center nut and aren't a canddiate for the LN Eng retrofit. I don't think SHATTACK's IMSB "sticky" addresses this important topic.

Reborn996

J beede, where are you getting the info that 99-2001 Carrera's that have had engine replacements have a 22mm IMS that cannot benefit from the L&N upgrade??? I HIGHLY doubt they redesigned the 3.4 just for replacement motors, that would have required a complete retool and new block design to my knowledge. From what I know, all 3.4 engines have an IMS that can be removed and replaced by the L&N bearing kit. Please share with us where it is stated otherwise?

David

Shark Attack

wait, what? Maybe becasue they are only 20 grand we dont feel like we have to do all that?

mine is 100% 20K toy. no PPI when I bought mine. But I knew a lot about the IMS issue