BruceP

Actually, I agree with you there.

Byprodriver

Sorry for the poor focus. this is a quarter surrounded by the IMS bearing race next to the bearing seal. Trying to show how undersize this bearing is for the job. When I tried to remove the seal with the pick tool to enhance lubrication & inspection I caught the race & everything including the ball bearings spilled out easily.

johonole

I have stayed off this forum for months due to the perpetual "newbies" that come out of nowhere and start an IMS thread that then goes on for up to 2 weeks.

Maybe the search feature no longer works, but it seems the same posters get baited into keeping this topic on this board constantly.

I came back on this board to find info on double din's to put it my Porsche and talked myself out of it after reading a few posts. Imagine the effects of someone shopping for a Boxter, 996, or 997.

Other boards do not keep this ball in the air constantly like we do here. I never plan on selling my car and I have a LN bearing in it, so it does not really effect me, but I think some may be hurting themselves.

The good news is I will go away again

Byprodriver

I guess it would help if I posted the picture again

ivangene

are you saying the part that holds the ball in place popped out?

So from what I have seen that is due to ball degradation causing too much slop in the mating parts and the ***** beating the retainer to death and eventually resulting in a failure of the ring where then the ***** fall out and you know the rest...

I assume you replaced the bearing?

IMO that was close to failing - if you try and remove the retainer on any new bearing for any application... it aint easy

Curious to hear your story as to how/why you were in there

Byprodriver

My opinion is that we were all "ill informed" thanks to Porsche & are now well informed thanks to Jake Raby & I consider his approach is a "I've got bad news but there is good news too"
I think the most common post on forums is "What is the best "mod" for my M96 engine" & people invariably discover very little satisfaction for lots of money spent yet not invested. I hearby nominate the LNengineering IMS bearing for most satisfying M96 upgrade! Porsche created this weakpoint & should have recalled the IMS bearing & provided a suitable fix. Considering all that Jake Raby has invested in Flat6innovations I would not be surprised if he has yet to make a net profit, but I hope he does have sufficent incentive to continue his "Risk & Developement". Knowledge is Power!

BruceP

Sorry that you feel that way.

If I'm one of those "baited" regular posters you're referring to, it's only because I keep trying to sell some kind of reasonable perspective on this, rather than buying into one of the equally stupid and emotional extremes of "it's a myth" and "tick tick boom." To coin a phrase, all that's required for hysteria to prevail is that sane men say nothing.

BruceP

I think most of the credit for this item goes to these guys, actually, and they are the actual manufacturers of the part.

http://www.lnengineering.com

Byprodriver

My post was in response to the critisism aimed at Jake Raby(it was not my intention to single out the OP of the quote I replied too) in order to acknowledge his invaluable contribution to all M96 owners & potential owners including but not limited to his part in the LNengineering IMS bearing upgrade development.

Byprodriver

Yes I used the pick to remove the seal & the race was so loose it came out with the seal. The bearings were degraded as a result of poor lubrication partly caused by a small crack in 1 head I was alerted to from a oil analysis reporting a high sodium level indicating coolant intrusion which explained my coolant level slowly droping & no leakage. I think the bearing was failing but since it was a dual row design still adequate.
And the GOOD news:

Eharrison

Just out of curiosity, why should Porsche recall the bearing? What is the factor that determines a recall and where is this failure at in terms of failures per X cars?

I think you are overlooking the fact (or assuming and therefore stating it's the best mod) that we do not know how many failures there are. Now I'm not saying that it's not something to do (like I always point out, I have done the retrofit). But if it's such a critical item why are people waiting to do it only during clutch replacement? If it was an imminent failure, why aren't people doing right away? Cost? Most likely. So people who replace the bearing are evaluating the risk of failure to the cost of labor of doing it right away. The gamble is that it won't fail in the mean time. Now why aren't people evaluating the cost to replace the bearing vs. not replacing at all? Because you have a vendor(Edit: A User) on here pumping a product that can save your engine.

Now I like the product, and have no issue with the companies but we need to find a comprimise here with what the IMS is really all about. Are we really going to say that these failures have only recently (last two years) been happening? My car is 11-12 years old, if this issue is as it's portrayed, there should be a huge percentage of 996's that have had engine replacements due to this. Personally, I don't think that that statement is true.

My biggest point is that we have a vendor acting as a member without any disclosure clearly stating their interest in the subject when they post.
It's deceptive.

Ray S

hopeforcash

Just to chime in, I hoped I didn't have to and researched the possibility was low that the IMS would leaked. I got a 2003 with the improved IMS from Porsche, service records showed RMS was recently replaced, But...

Winter oil change revealed oil leak, first thought was RMS was later discovered it was the IMS. Did the LN upgrade and currently in winter rest.

To the OP, I would drive it if no indication but as everybody says, do regular maintenance and be aware of signs of warning.

Jake Raby

First off, don't be afraid to drive the car unless it has some sort of mechanical noise that is unexplained. Any engine can fail at any time, be it a Ferrari, Porsche or Kia. Those who work with engines everyday experience this and understand it much better than anyone else.

If you have a mechanical noise or an unexplained release of nasty black oil (darker than whats on the dipstick of your engine) or the engine starts to consume coolant, then you have a reason to worry and your actions can save you thousands of dollars.

Now, someone brought up the fact that I post to these boards and thats a conflict of interest. The fact is that first I am a Porsche Enthusiast, I've owned a Porsche since the age of 12 and I currently own 3 of them and I've owned well over 50 of pretty much every era except the 924/44 series.

The assumptions that people have gained here about my reasoning for posting couldn't be more off base. I like to share information and know that the only way these engines will be understood is by some means of sharing what we learn. Doing this HELPS people AVOID issues before they happen. If issues have already occurred, it helps the owner understand what their choices are in terms of repair and avoiding reoccurrence.

That said, if my intent was different I'd not be hosting classes to teach others about these engines and what we know about them at a much more advanced level. I'd simply let them fail, ensure no one learned the tricks and gather up all the business. Thats simply not true.

Now, if anyone thinks that we benefit from the "fear factor" I'll share a little fact. I have cars on site currently from seven states. All of these cars arrived here with mode of engine failure with the exception of one which came for an IMSR as a preventive procedure.

Be glad that you have gathered the information that you have from these boards and the posts from me and others like me. The majority of those who have to seek out what we do have no idea that these issues exist, until they experience them and then they seem shocked that this could happen to a Porsche.

If everyone who owned one of these cars was on this forum and read what happened we'd see a lot less failures. If 30,60 and 90K mile services were more invasive we'd also see a lot less failures, but too many shops follow the Porsche directives that were written when the cars were new and those aren't reality.

Some people can't handle reality and feel they need to blame someone or something for it. I am the messenger and its the reader's choice whether or not they want to believe whats being said. Its also up to the owner to take whatever action they see fit, we don't pressure anyone into a preventive as most pressure themselves into an untimely repair because the preventive wasn't carried out.

So, some people would rather have issues noted and addressed while others would rather just drive the car and hope that nothing occurs. I am going to catch flack no matter what, I caught just as much when we were still in our R&D stages of this as I do now and at that time I didn't even have a product to sell or service to render (by choice!). Fact is 10% of people can't be pleased and another 10% will complain about everything, the remaining 80 are loyal, grateful and appreciate our efforts and appreciate the direct way that we state the issues.

The way I see it, at least the most problematic areas have been addressed and have a preventive for those who do believe in the problems and want to be proactive. Until 20 months ago there was no "IMS bearing Retrofit" that was commercially available. The tools, procedures and components did not exist. LN Engineering and I took on that challenge and have continued to perpetuate development on the procedures and tools to make this a mainstream DIY procedure. Until this summer no one really knew what was causing cracked heads, until we released the information about busted water pump impellers.

These are just a couple of things that I am proud to have been a part of and if you choose to criticize me for sharing the facts that I see directly without a sugar coating, thats up to you.

bkjwhipple

I would like to thank you for posting and sharing your knowledge on here Jake. When someone is having a real issue with there car, there are lots of guesses, but when people are stumped, more often than not, I see calls for you to post. I myself have learned lots from this forum, and your posts.