Has any engines failed that had a Tiptronic?
07-20-2009, 11:01 AM
#1
Race Car
Thread Starter
Has any engines failed that had a Tiptronic?
Now I think about this, I havent heard of any.
If this is the case, supporting the engine case structure could help alleviate stresses to the block/case that cause it to fail.
RMS leaks seemed to persist less with tippies.
Just a thought.
Mr. Raby, your thoughts.
If this is the case, supporting the engine case structure could help alleviate stresses to the block/case that cause it to fail.
RMS leaks seemed to persist less with tippies.
Just a thought.
Mr. Raby, your thoughts.
07-20-2009, 11:32 AM
#2
Drifting
3 years ago, when i was looking for a tip, out of about 50 cars, the only one had eng. replacement was a 02 tip.
there were a few had RMS, including mine, but mine is fine since the dealer replaced the org. RMS about 8 years ago.
there were a few had RMS, including mine, but mine is fine since the dealer replaced the org. RMS about 8 years ago.
07-20-2009, 11:56 AM
#4
Three Wheelin'
I've come to believe that the three things about a tip which seem to bear out the lower incidence of stress related internal issues are
a) they can't be over-revved without some serious work
b) they shift instead of bouncing off a limiter at redline, and
c) the torque converter keeps you from really lugging it at low rpm
It's also possible that the torque converter has a dampening effect on the drive line in general
For example IMS, given the nature of the IMS failure and the proximity of the securing M8 stud to the clutch and pressure plate at the front of the motor, who knows, maybe the clutch / pressure plate cycling creates some sort of odd nth order vibration or shock that slowly over time exacerbates an already precarious design.
That having been said, I've done trans and motor mounts in the past 18 months (on an 02)
The old porous blocks had to be a straight manufacturing defect IMHO, I don't think it would have mattered if you had a CVT on one of those
I'm very curious to hear what Jake has to say here
a) they can't be over-revved without some serious work
b) they shift instead of bouncing off a limiter at redline, and
c) the torque converter keeps you from really lugging it at low rpm
It's also possible that the torque converter has a dampening effect on the drive line in general
For example IMS, given the nature of the IMS failure and the proximity of the securing M8 stud to the clutch and pressure plate at the front of the motor, who knows, maybe the clutch / pressure plate cycling creates some sort of odd nth order vibration or shock that slowly over time exacerbates an already precarious design.
That having been said, I've done trans and motor mounts in the past 18 months (on an 02)
The old porous blocks had to be a straight manufacturing defect IMHO, I don't think it would have mattered if you had a CVT on one of those
I'm very curious to hear what Jake has to say here
07-20-2009, 12:34 PM
#5
Race Car
Thread Starter
I've come to believe that the three things about a tip which seem to bear out the lower incidence of stress related internal issues are
a) they can't be over-revved without some serious work
b) they shift instead of bouncing off a limiter at redline, and
c) the torque converter keeps you from really lugging it at low rpm
It's also possible that the torque converter has a dampening effect on the drive line in general
For example IMS, given the nature of the IMS failure and the proximity of the securing M8 stud to the clutch and pressure plate at the front of the motor, who knows, maybe the clutch / pressure plate cycling creates some sort of odd nth order vibration or shock that slowly over time exacerbates an already precarious design.
That having been said, I've done trans and motor mounts in the past 18 months (on an 02)
The old porous blocks had to be a straight manufacturing defect IMHO, I don't think it would have mattered if you had a CVT on one of those
I'm very curious to hear what Jake has to say here
a) they can't be over-revved without some serious work
b) they shift instead of bouncing off a limiter at redline, and
c) the torque converter keeps you from really lugging it at low rpm
It's also possible that the torque converter has a dampening effect on the drive line in general
For example IMS, given the nature of the IMS failure and the proximity of the securing M8 stud to the clutch and pressure plate at the front of the motor, who knows, maybe the clutch / pressure plate cycling creates some sort of odd nth order vibration or shock that slowly over time exacerbates an already precarious design.
That having been said, I've done trans and motor mounts in the past 18 months (on an 02)
The old porous blocks had to be a straight manufacturing defect IMHO, I don't think it would have mattered if you had a CVT on one of those
I'm very curious to hear what Jake has to say here
07-20-2009, 12:37 PM
#6
Race Car
Thread Starter
I sold my 996 to another person (not a Renny member) with 102k miles.
He was told by a respected, and I mean very respected Porsche builder here in San Anto that the motor will blow up after 100k miles.
I told him it is the opposite, it is in the low miles when the engine hasnt proven itself is when it could break.
Now I have heard some high-milers break, Im a little worried about it - I dont want the new owner to think I lied.
I went off the knowledge I gained from Rennlist.
He was told by a respected, and I mean very respected Porsche builder here in San Anto that the motor will blow up after 100k miles.
I told him it is the opposite, it is in the low miles when the engine hasnt proven itself is when it could break.
Now I have heard some high-milers break, Im a little worried about it - I dont want the new owner to think I lied.
I went off the knowledge I gained from Rennlist.
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07-20-2009, 04:38 PM
#9
Intermediate
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I've read that the relevance of a tip vs. manual causing IMS failures isn't as much as the stress it places on the motor, but rather that a leaking oil seal captures the dust from the clutch as it wears. The clutch dust is extremely abrasive and once it mixes into the oil around a seal it speeds up the wear on the shaft and then you have a real problem.
07-20-2009, 04:55 PM
#10
I've read that the relevance of a tip vs. manual causing IMS failures isn't as much as the stress it places on the motor, but rather that a leaking oil seal captures the dust from the clutch as it wears. The clutch dust is extremely abrasive and once it mixes into the oil around a seal it speeds up the wear on the shaft and then you have a real problem.
07-20-2009, 05:34 PM
#11
Rennlist Member
99 C2 6sp 46k miles. I have been on this board a year and read all the inputs. To date, I have not had any RMS or IMS failures. However, I am planning to pre-empt a catastrophic failure of either by just going ahead and having it done, including the clutch, t/o bearing, and pressure plate, and water pump while they are in there.
Last month, I was in for my annual, and went ahead and had them change out the coolant resevoir, just because after 11 years it seemed prudent. I also replaced the A/C compressor because that had failed the week before, so they were going to be messing around up there anyway. A few years ago I did the valve cover seals just because the car was 6 years old. Again, seemed prudent. Still no visual problems with the RMS or valve covers. Nice and dry.
The car has been driven to work, road trips, and a dozen DE track events over the years since I acquired it in 2004 with 7,500 miles and original tires.
I have gone ahead and done many preventative items on this car over the years that are the common problems with 996's even though I have never experienced these failures. Since this is my 4th 996, I know what to expect. I prefer not to wait until they fail in some remote location. None of my previous 996's ever had an RMS or IMS failure. All four were/are 6-speeds. I drove each of the previous 3 for over 40,000 miles each before changing cars so I never had a high mileage one. Each car got plenty of track time. I never had to get a free engine from the factory while I was under warrenty, or later on.
And, if it makes any difference, all four 996's were dealer serviced, every time, by Brumos Porsche in Jacksonville. There were 12 Porsches over 35 years that preceded these four 996's, and I learned way back that it is cheaper to have a certified dealer do the work and provide their coverage for parts and labor, than to go it alone or with an indy here.
I mention this because there are are tens of thousands of 996 engines out there that haven't failed or leaked and probably won't ever. But it gets scary here on this board because we only really hear the results of the 5% that did fail. I'm scared because of what I read about that 5% (and 5% is a VERY high number - although that is not a confirmed percentage, but an estimate by other posters here). Since I hope to make this specific car my keeper, I am acting largely on fear, and also on some fact that the probability is there for failure at any time or mileage. It is cheaper to fix something that isn't broken, than to deal with a blown engine later. I'm not a gambler. I have rolled the dice four times in a row, and I know that one can crap out at any time.
What about the D-chunk? I'm still gonna roll the dice on that one a while longer and see what Raby comes up with.
Last month, I was in for my annual, and went ahead and had them change out the coolant resevoir, just because after 11 years it seemed prudent. I also replaced the A/C compressor because that had failed the week before, so they were going to be messing around up there anyway. A few years ago I did the valve cover seals just because the car was 6 years old. Again, seemed prudent. Still no visual problems with the RMS or valve covers. Nice and dry.
The car has been driven to work, road trips, and a dozen DE track events over the years since I acquired it in 2004 with 7,500 miles and original tires.
I have gone ahead and done many preventative items on this car over the years that are the common problems with 996's even though I have never experienced these failures. Since this is my 4th 996, I know what to expect. I prefer not to wait until they fail in some remote location. None of my previous 996's ever had an RMS or IMS failure. All four were/are 6-speeds. I drove each of the previous 3 for over 40,000 miles each before changing cars so I never had a high mileage one. Each car got plenty of track time. I never had to get a free engine from the factory while I was under warrenty, or later on.
And, if it makes any difference, all four 996's were dealer serviced, every time, by Brumos Porsche in Jacksonville. There were 12 Porsches over 35 years that preceded these four 996's, and I learned way back that it is cheaper to have a certified dealer do the work and provide their coverage for parts and labor, than to go it alone or with an indy here.
I mention this because there are are tens of thousands of 996 engines out there that haven't failed or leaked and probably won't ever. But it gets scary here on this board because we only really hear the results of the 5% that did fail. I'm scared because of what I read about that 5% (and 5% is a VERY high number - although that is not a confirmed percentage, but an estimate by other posters here). Since I hope to make this specific car my keeper, I am acting largely on fear, and also on some fact that the probability is there for failure at any time or mileage. It is cheaper to fix something that isn't broken, than to deal with a blown engine later. I'm not a gambler. I have rolled the dice four times in a row, and I know that one can crap out at any time.
What about the D-chunk? I'm still gonna roll the dice on that one a while longer and see what Raby comes up with.
Last edited by Thundertub; 07-20-2009 at 10:44 PM.
07-20-2009, 06:24 PM
#13
Drifting
my 99' tip engine was replaced at 52K miles due to an engine 'ticking sound', later confirmed to be a engine failure waiting to happen. 56K miles now on reman engine
Last edited by Marlon; 07-20-2009 at 11:16 PM. Reason: accuracy
07-20-2009, 10:38 PM
#14
Rennlist Member
07-20-2009, 11:15 PM
#15
Racer
Join Date: Jun 2009
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Mark,
I agree with you, I have been driving for 40+ years, high perf cars and mom and dad mobiles, always did the oil changes on time or earlier than recommended and I have not had a engine failure. Now that I have said that, mebbe I SHOULD get a warranty!
I agree with you, I have been driving for 40+ years, high perf cars and mom and dad mobiles, always did the oil changes on time or earlier than recommended and I have not had a engine failure. Now that I have said that, mebbe I SHOULD get a warranty!