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HOW STRONG IS THE C4 DRIVETRAIN??

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Old 03-04-2007, 11:51 PM
  #16  
newport996
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Originally Posted by nick49
If you are serious, start with a GT2, or if you can do without AWD a GT3. Hey, maybe you could find a retired GT2 racer and make it street legal.
GT2's are RWD, not AWD.
Old 03-04-2007, 11:55 PM
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nitrorocket
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If the front end can handle abuse, I would like the AWD. My twin turbo Audi A6 is too much fun bringing the boost up off the line and launching like a bat out of hell, so far that has held up fine, but the car does not have much power either.
Old 03-05-2007, 12:03 AM
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newport996
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Originally Posted by nitrorocket
I actually already have a set of twin turbos for the car. I just need a car now!!

I want the porsche for something different. I have spent alot of time to make the Chevelle handle like a good track car, I figure if I started with a porsche I would be able to take the handling even farther. Realistically, if I do not get what I want from my chevelle money wise I will just keep it. It is pretty fun spinning tires at 140+ mph if I want to!!

Plan is to find most likely an early model C2 or C4, bring it home and yank the motor. From there I am going to swap out the rods and pistons and mount some turbos on it, For 5-6 grand or so I will have a bullet proof twin turbo setup. I realize I will never have the performance and power of my Chevelle, but I would still be happy with 500+ RWHP on the Porsche.

To be honest my biggest fear with the Porsche is I will be dissapointed. I have not driven one yet, But from what I hear, they handle better then anything. Are there any cars in the league that handle better??

I am just getting bored...

We'll see, I am still researching.
You gotta do more research...you CANNOT just yank the motor on a 996 normally aspirated car and throw some Turbos on it and have a "bulletproof" 500hp setup for 5 grand....thats absolutely ridiculous. First of all the 996 motor and the TT motor are COMPLETELY different motors. The 996 motor is NOT designed for forced induction. Its got too high a compression ratio....also internal parts are not readily available because Porsche does not sell them....some companies are just now starting to sell them, but again, upgrades are not readily available, and when they are they are quite expensive. There is a reason people are selling 3.8L upgrades for $23k....putting out 380 HP....its not that easy to get high HP out of a normally aspirated 996. Get a TT if you want that....a chip and turbo upgrades can get you 5-600HP.
Old 03-05-2007, 12:06 AM
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newport996
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Originally Posted by nitrorocket
If the front end can handle abuse, I would like the AWD. My twin turbo Audi A6 is too much fun bringing the boost up off the line and launching like a bat out of hell, so far that has held up fine, but the car does not have much power either.
The Porsche AWD system and the Audi do not work in the same way....you will be very dissapointed if you expect it to jump off the line like a rocket.
Old 03-05-2007, 01:01 AM
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JasonAndreas
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Originally Posted by newport996
internal parts are not readily available because Porsche does not sell them
Porsche has been selling replacement parts for all M96 engines since almost the beginning of production. Only the transmission parts have been scarce up until about last summer.
Old 03-05-2007, 06:47 AM
  #21  
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I don't think I agree with the assessment that 911's aren't good drag cars, esp when compared to an M3, The rear weight bias and wider rear tires give the car increased grip, which results in more power to the road. The 911 is also lighter.
Old 03-05-2007, 08:44 AM
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rountreed
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Huh?????? A Porsche as a drag car? Have to agree it is a drivers car not a drag car. Take your very nice Chevy up on the Autobahn maybe a curvy one like A62 and you will kill yourself at 160MPH, but not in the Porsche. If you want a drag car save your money and stick with what you have and enjoy the 16 year old kids at Sonic.
Old 03-05-2007, 09:42 AM
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Why not go with a Corvette? It's got good handling (different from a Porsche but still good), room for a zoomin' V8, rear wheel drive, and good looks.
Old 03-05-2007, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by nitrorocket
I actually already have a set of twin turbos for the car. I just need a car now!!

I don't want a drag car, My Chevelle is not a drag car, but anything I own better be DAMN fast or why drive it. Those who have put the pedal to the medal with 1000 hp know what I am talking about. It is over the top, unusable crazy, insane, adrenaline pumping craziness!! But I LOVE it.

I want the porsche for something different. I have spent alot of time to make the Chevelle handle like a good track car, I figure if I started with a porsche I would be able to take the handling even farther. Realistically, if I do not get what I want from my chevelle money wise, I will just keep it. It is pretty fun having the capability to spin the 12" GSCS racing tires at 140+ mph if I want to!!

Plan is to find most likely an early model C2 or C4, bring it home and yank the motor. From there I am going to swap out the rods and pistons and mount some turbos on it, For 5-6 grand or so I will have a bullet proof twin turbo setup. I realize I will never have the performance and power of my Chevelle, but I would still be happy with 500+ RWHP on the Porsche.

To be honest my biggest fear with the Porsche is I will be dissapointed. I have not driven one yet, But from what I hear, they handle better then anything. Are there any cars in the league that handle better??

I am just getting bored...

We'll see, I am still researching.
Tons.

Get a Lotus Elise if you want handling.

But realistically, what everyone is trying to tell you is that you belong in a Vette.
Old 03-05-2007, 10:21 AM
  #25  
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The base engine of a 996 NA is a completely different platform or design from the TT, GT2, or GT3. It was designed to be built at a lower cost than the air cooled motors that preceded it. The way in which is holds the crank, the wet sump, and other too numerous to mention items are totally different from the other 3 models. Their engines are based upon the racing GT1 architecture. If it's higher power or performance you want, get a TT. They can be had for $50-60K. Add $10K of mods, and you'll have plenty of power.

In summary, there isn't much margin left in the 996 NA engine. The TT has lots of upward potential.

Good luck with what ever you buy, but buy smart.

Cheers,
Old 03-05-2007, 11:12 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by JasonAndreas
Porsche has been selling replacement parts for all M96 engines since almost the beginning of production. Only the transmission parts have been scarce up until about last summer.
Newport means stronger parts like rods and pistons that handle big power, not the facory ones. The TT has just about anything you need for beefing up the low end.
Old 03-05-2007, 11:31 AM
  #27  
newport996
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M3 is geared differently and designed to be quicker off the line. The 911 is by design to have a weak clutch at takeoffs, which is why you can burn one out in a weekend if doing burnouts. The reason is to not damage the engine or transmission, they would rather you damage the clutch and replace it. The 911 is geared for top end performance, not low end. Just the facts on the car, now after 30 mph, the 911 is faster than most other cars with the same HP...which is why they are deceptive.
Old 03-05-2007, 01:20 PM
  #28  
Ray S
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I just don't get it. The guy is looking for advice an many are knocking his ideas at every turn. He seems to know his way around an engine and enjoy modding cars so why not? I agree that the TT motor would be a better starting point, but M96's have been made to work with boost by others so it can certainly be done. There are many ways he could effectively lower the compression ratio and the internals while not up to TT specs are far from weak.

As far as the "if you want handling, buy an Elise" comment........what are you thinking??? The 996 has fantastic handling. It will run circles around 99.9% of the cars on the road and it will clean the Elise's clock on all but the tightest race tracks.
Old 03-05-2007, 02:18 PM
  #29  
newport996
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Originally Posted by Ray S
I just don't get it. The guy is looking for advice an many are knocking his ideas at every turn. He seems to know his way around an engine and enjoy modding cars so why not? I agree that the TT motor would be a better starting point, but M96's have been made to work with boost by others so it can certainly be done. There are many ways he could effectively lower the compression ratio and the internals while not up to TT specs are far from weak.

As far as the "if you want handling, buy an Elise" comment........what are you thinking??? The 996 has fantastic handling. It will run circles around 99.9% of the cars on the road and it will clean the Elise's clock on all but the tightest race tracks.
Lets be realistic....if you want to perform surgery, dont use a steak knife. Use the right tool for the job. He said he wants a "bulletproof" 500WHP motor, and a car to beat people at stoplights. NEITHER is a NA 996. How many NA 996's have EVER gone to 500HP? NONE....so why not inform him that:

A: He WILL NOT get 500HP out of that motor at the crank and definitely not at the wheels.

B: The car is not designed to have breakneck speeds from a dead stop. He mentioned the Audi AWD system which is probably the BEST dead stop car out there as you can launch that car and not burn clutches and or break other components.

C: The 996 is a drivers car with great HP and great handling and appreciate it for that.

D: If he wants 500+ HP, he needs a TT as the platform.

I dont care how much he knows his way around a motor, you cant get the 500HP from a M96 engine....

I guess what we are telling him is that as Porsche owners, we usually are not racing EVO's and WRX's from stoplight to stoplight. Bottom line is he wants the prestige of owning a Porsche, but wants to street race it. Its not a street racer....He could save alot of money and get a 944 turbo and then he can get hos 500HP, and still have a Porsche and save about 20K....But a 996 is not a drag car and not a street racer, it was designed to go fast, turn fast, and stop fast...not just go VERY fast in a straight line. I think all the responses have been actually very nice and I personally think he's a troll, or a 12 year kid with nothing better to do....but no one yet has called him that.....I say that everyone is being quite civil.
Old 03-05-2007, 04:30 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by newport996
Lets be realistic....if you want to perform surgery, dont use a steak knife. Use the right tool for the job. He said he wants a "bulletproof" 500WHP motor, and a car to beat people at stoplights. NEITHER is a NA 996. How many NA 996's have EVER gone to 500HP? NONE....so why not inform him that:

A: He WILL NOT get 500HP out of that motor at the crank and definitely not at the wheels.

B: The car is not designed to have breakneck speeds from a dead stop. He mentioned the Audi AWD system which is probably the BEST dead stop car out there as you can launch that car and not burn clutches and or break other components.

C: The 996 is a drivers car with great HP and great handling and appreciate it for that.

D: If he wants 500+ HP, he needs a TT as the platform.

I dont care how much he knows his way around a motor, you cant get the 500HP from a M96 engine....
I love it when people say something "can't" be done......especially when those people have never even tried to do that "something". Consider for a moment how you react when people say you "can't" put 19's on a car, or you "can't" make a TT rear bumper fit.

Trust me Newport if tuners can get over 1000 hp out of the 996 TT motor they can get 500 hp out of the M96 if they really wanted to.

Here are some M96's making close to 500hp already.

The TPC supercharged 3.4 makes 434hp. The Evo/VF SC kit for the 3.6 makes 475 hp

http://www.ndimports.com/01_por/00_shop/shop.asp

Here's 450 hp from a 3.2 Boxster M96 (not the GT1 block)

http://auto-specs.zercustoms.com/g/g...fications.html

http://www.supercars.net/cars/1631.html

My point is as follows;

Stock clutches can be replaced with higher performance varients. Stock internals can be upgraded. With enough time, money, and perserverance I really don't see why it could not be done (especially considering that Gemballa has already made 450hp out of a twin turbo 986 3.2 with the same block).

I'd agree (and I already stated) that the M96/76 (GT1 block) is a better starting point and as a result that is where most tuners turn to make the huge power

However, I think it's pretty silly to make a blanket statement that there is "no way" to get 500hp from an M96/01, 02, or 03.


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