986Jim

The funny thing about Tech's and Mechanics with 25+ years experience is all they do is fix cars (vs. performance racing which is totally different and not work a general mechainc can even do, contrary to their popular belief) with problems.

When a car comes in with a bad maf and it has a K&N on it, then it must be the K&N that caused the problem. But the 10,000 other cars out there with no problems they don't see, somehow don't exist. It was definately the K&N that caused the problem because they see it on the car and the maf is bad. I couldn't ever possibly be the stock MAF thats causing the problem, nooo wayyyy..

In case you don't know already, I'm a Performance Mechanic on many types of cars. I build 1000whp Supra's 700hp honda's and DSM's Rotarys etc etc.. Not much porsche work but thats besides the point. The work we do is totally different than general mechanics. When a new guys starts who was a general mechanic at a repair shop before, they are generally totally lost and are as only slightly less useless than an average home mechanic with limited experience.

General mechanics always think that aftermarket equipment is the cause of the problems that cars seems to have. Sometimes it is true, however many times it's not really. K&N's can screw up your maf if you WAY over oil the filter after cleaning then yeah, it's gonna get on the sensor and screw it up. Is that the filters fault or yours for being over zealous with the spray oil? There are lots of things like that which cause problems, then guys blame it on the aftermarket part. There are a lot of instances when you do a performance mod and you get a CE light days afterwards, so it's that mod that caused the problem. Not the fact that your driving around like a total bananna because you want to hear your new intake or blow off valve that caused the light etc etc...

teflon_jones

The simple fact is that the intake side of the 996 engine isn't a limiting factor on performance. These kits don't add any performance under 99% of driving conditions (the 1% being some spirited highway driving at high speed), and a lot of the time actually take away performance due to sucking in hot engine compartment air.

The only time this would really help you is if you have a dedicated track car, you've changed your exhaust, and also had your ECU remapped. Otherwise, it's just sucking in hot air most of the time.

As for these causing MAF issues, it's a very well known problem. It's not only these kits, but putting any oiled filter in the 996 has a long history of causing MAF problems.

986Jim

That simply is not true. If you have spent any time tuning or dynoing a car you would understand why and how this is not the way an engine works..

You do not need to re-map the ecu on a car or add headers for an intake to work. This is as old as the thought needing backpressure on a normally aspirated engine to make hp. It's not true and proven over and over on a dyno. Your ECU has two modes, open and closed loop. Do a search on google for how and ecu works in Open loop and it may help you to understand how simply adding a properly designed intake to a car can add hp.

Simply adding an intake to the car will make HP over a particular range (generally upper) during all driving conditions, not 1% where do you get that? I can post up a dyno for 50 different cars where only an intake alone made HP gains.

My eagle talon picked up 22whp from an intake alone. 17hp from 3" exhaust. I make 424whp on pump gas at 22psi of boost though AWD (Built motor 9:1, comp cams, T3/T4 50trim and some tuning on 660cc injectors). I have built and tuned everything you can think of an adding a well designed intake to any car will pick up some power, as a matter of fact there are almost no instances where adding an intake has not made at least some power over even a small range on just about any car you can think of. Even the Honda S2000 with 2.0L and 240hp made 9.5hp between 6200-8500rpm with an AEM intake and no other modifications. Thats 120hp / liter which is a pretty strung out engine by any standards and it still made power.

I don't disagree totally that this particular intake may not work on the 996, I have never tested one, however there will be something out there that will work with the proper engineering. Factory design is compromised with thing like noise restrictions and warranty, and lasting 100,000k etc.. If you take all those other factors out and make it nothing but HP, the design would be totally different and gains could be made. Thats where the aftermarket comes in.

Regards,

TBH996

I've been reading this thread and then walked into my garage, opened the hatch and looked at my stock intake system. I had just driven the car and noticed that the entire system is very warm to the touch (thank you captain obvious!). This got me thinking about the whole cold air intake system argument. What I'm wondering is if anyone has tried to thermally isolate the OE intake system (i.e. wrap it in metal backed dynamat as a heat shield and insulator) and if so, would insulating this system to reduce radiated heat temperature in the intake passage produce any positive effects since the outside air coming in through the wing, in theory, wouldn't be travelling through as warm an intake system thus creating a true cold air intake system. I know the shield, if done right, would help reduce the temperature of the airbox and its parts, what I don't know is if it would net any legitimate performance gains when used in conjunction with a high quality OE replacement filter.

I know this may seem like a "cheesy" project but it seems to me that any "cold air" system is still at the temperature mercy of its surroundings since a hot intake system would heat the air anyway unless you had a way to keep the heat out of the system to begin with.

E

teflon_jones

If you really have that much experience then you should know that every car is different. The 996 is not limited by the intake side of the system. I agree that the power from an intake mod generally comes in the upper end of the RPM range. My 1% figures comes from the fact that hot engine compartment air is getting sucked in most of the time so hence you'll probably lose power most of the time.

What does an Eagle Talon or Honda S2000 have to do with a naturally aspirated 996? Every car is totally different. You can only compare apples to apples. Again, the intake side of the 996 is not a limiting factor in making HP. The Porsche engineers didn't take tens of thousands of hours to design this car and then implement a design on the intake side of the engine that limits HP.

986Jim

Users of this system said it was drawing air from outside the engine compartment like the stock system though the stock air intake tube with that shield on the top. That should isolate it and at speed give it cold air with a freeer flowing system.

Yeah every car is different however there are gains to be made on every car which is why in racing you rarely see OE stuff unless the class rules restrict it then they try and modify it even then .

Even in certian cars drawing in more air even if it's hotter than before will still make more power based only on volume. I doubt this would be the case on a 996 however the stock air box is compromised with other variables like sound, size warranty etc..

[/quote]What does an Eagle Talon or Honda S2000 have to do with a naturally aspirated 996? Every car is totally different. You can only compare apples to apples. Again, the intake side of the 996 is not a limiting factor in making HP. The Porsche engineers didn't take tens of thousands of hours to design this car and then implement a design on the intake side of the engine that limits HP.[/QUOTE]

Talon nothing, S2000 a lot. It's a high strung NA engine much the same as a 996 NA motor is. Engineered to be all that it can be. The S2000 picks up power with a system properly engineered, so the 996 should be able to as well if somebody puts in the time to do it.

You keep saying that the intake is not the limiting factor which I agree however that doens't mean that you can make up some ground with the intake. You wont make 15hp but even 5hp is worth getting.

When you build a race car you don't worry about 10 hp and 100lbs you fight for 1 hp and 10oz of weight, thats what makes them fast. If you go after power and weight the same on a street car you can have a very fast car with little loss in daily drivability and reliability.

Simply stating that its only 1% of the time and not worth it means your not interested in going fast which is cool. Just don't try and stop others who may want that. If they do the intake and exhaust and chip etc.. they may only get 15hp more than you, if they shave 100lbs of stuff outta the car big deal. But guess what, the car is faster and handles better now because of that. To some enthusiasts it's worth the money and trouble. Thats all!

rleeq

I have one for sell if anyone is interested. I installed it, took the car a spin and heard a grinding noise. I had the same problem Melchior referred to in post #20. I thought it was from being rear ended last November. The stock air box was damaged the same way. It took two trips back to the body shop to fix the rubbing problem.
The heat shield is gouged from rubbing on the pulleys but is functional and you can’t see the damage when it is installed.
Send me a PM if interested in buying this at a savings.

Lee

nycebo

Why not just add a BMC or K&N replacement freer flowing air filter in the stock airbox? Totally sealed off from the hot air of the engine compartment and a freer flowing filter?