Really Bad Experience with Dealer
02-23-2006, 11:33 PM
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Really Bad Experience with Dealer
I have been trying to decide all day whether to post a message about what happened to me today. I am so mad and frustrated, I decided I would.
I have been looking for a 2001 or 2002 911 Turbo for several months. About three weeks ago I found an interesting listing for a 2002 Lapis Turbo being sold by Don Rosen Imports, a Porsche dealer in Pennsylvania. I emailed the dealer and was contacted by Tim Hoffman, a salesman. I interrogated him about the car. He told me that the car was perfect, never repainted and never in an accident. I had several detailed conversations about the condition of the car. I asked whether he used a paint meter and his response was that they meter every used car, including this one, and there was no repaint. This was important because if we were able to make a deal, I would be buying it site unseen. I would only do this because it was a Porsche dealer and the car would be CPO. It had already been certified when I first spoke to him.
I had many more conversations and he assured me that the car was perfect. During one telephone call, he even put me on hold and did a detailed walk around the car just to make sure it was perfect, which he said it was. We negotiated a deal including a trade in for my 2000 911 C2. I gave him a $500 deposit and made arrangements to pick up the car. That included, which he knew, me driving 100 miles in the opposite direction to pick up my car at my summer house, and then driving 200 miles to PA to his dealership.
I arrived at the dealership and the Turbo was parked outside. I had no reason to believe it would be anything other than perfect. When I walked up to the driver's side, I noticed an unusual orange peel on the door. I immediately knew the door was repainted. I had him bring it inside as it was raining to inspect the rest of the car. When I told him the door was repainted, he said I was absolutely wrong since the car was metered. The repaint was obvious. I then noticed unusual paint on the driver's side fender, which was obviously repainted. Then, I looked at the hood. I cannot even explain what it looked like. It looked like it was painted by a 5 year old. The front bumper was also repainted. It was clear that the bumper and hood were replaced. I believe the fender and door were also replaced. I was in complete shock that I had just driven several hundred miles for what was one of the worst Turbos, or cars for that matter, that I had ever seen. By this time, the salesman went to get the manager. He looked at the car and immediately confirmed what I had found. He then opened the hood and pulled the rubber seal from the metal, which looks like it was bent and straightened with a vise-grip. This car had clearly been in an accident and so poorly repaired it is almost indescribable.
The manager, of course, kept saying that he understood and was apologetic. He could not believe that his used car salesman took the car in on trade and made it available for sale. Everyone was playing ignorant. If you saw the car, there is no way it could have slipped by them.
I would not be surprised if this happened at a used car dealership, but this is a Porsche dealer. Finally, the manager offered me $250 for my time. That was an insult. When he asked me what they could do, I told him to give me an incredible deal on the 2003 Turbo that I knew they also had. That, of course, didn't happen.
Right or wrong, it was such a bad experience, I felt like I had to post this message. I will be following this up with a letter to Porsche of North America.
I have been looking for a 2001 or 2002 911 Turbo for several months. About three weeks ago I found an interesting listing for a 2002 Lapis Turbo being sold by Don Rosen Imports, a Porsche dealer in Pennsylvania. I emailed the dealer and was contacted by Tim Hoffman, a salesman. I interrogated him about the car. He told me that the car was perfect, never repainted and never in an accident. I had several detailed conversations about the condition of the car. I asked whether he used a paint meter and his response was that they meter every used car, including this one, and there was no repaint. This was important because if we were able to make a deal, I would be buying it site unseen. I would only do this because it was a Porsche dealer and the car would be CPO. It had already been certified when I first spoke to him.
I had many more conversations and he assured me that the car was perfect. During one telephone call, he even put me on hold and did a detailed walk around the car just to make sure it was perfect, which he said it was. We negotiated a deal including a trade in for my 2000 911 C2. I gave him a $500 deposit and made arrangements to pick up the car. That included, which he knew, me driving 100 miles in the opposite direction to pick up my car at my summer house, and then driving 200 miles to PA to his dealership.
I arrived at the dealership and the Turbo was parked outside. I had no reason to believe it would be anything other than perfect. When I walked up to the driver's side, I noticed an unusual orange peel on the door. I immediately knew the door was repainted. I had him bring it inside as it was raining to inspect the rest of the car. When I told him the door was repainted, he said I was absolutely wrong since the car was metered. The repaint was obvious. I then noticed unusual paint on the driver's side fender, which was obviously repainted. Then, I looked at the hood. I cannot even explain what it looked like. It looked like it was painted by a 5 year old. The front bumper was also repainted. It was clear that the bumper and hood were replaced. I believe the fender and door were also replaced. I was in complete shock that I had just driven several hundred miles for what was one of the worst Turbos, or cars for that matter, that I had ever seen. By this time, the salesman went to get the manager. He looked at the car and immediately confirmed what I had found. He then opened the hood and pulled the rubber seal from the metal, which looks like it was bent and straightened with a vise-grip. This car had clearly been in an accident and so poorly repaired it is almost indescribable.
The manager, of course, kept saying that he understood and was apologetic. He could not believe that his used car salesman took the car in on trade and made it available for sale. Everyone was playing ignorant. If you saw the car, there is no way it could have slipped by them.
I would not be surprised if this happened at a used car dealership, but this is a Porsche dealer. Finally, the manager offered me $250 for my time. That was an insult. When he asked me what they could do, I told him to give me an incredible deal on the 2003 Turbo that I knew they also had. That, of course, didn't happen.
Right or wrong, it was such a bad experience, I felt like I had to post this message. I will be following this up with a letter to Porsche of North America.
02-23-2006, 11:45 PM
#3
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Wow! I happen to live about 20 minutes away from this dealership, and I've heard from other people that they can be sleazy. Nonetheless, this story is just incredible. I guess they tried to make some amends with the $250 offer, but I don't blame you for being livid.
Please let us know what Porsche USA tells you once you relay this story. I know now I'll never set foot in that dealership.
Please let us know what Porsche USA tells you once you relay this story. I know now I'll never set foot in that dealership.
02-23-2006, 11:53 PM
#4
Drifting
i had a phone conversion with this dealership month ago, maybe the same "tim", can't remember.
the salesman is very rude. so i didn't proceed further. thank god this didn't happen to me.
don't have high expectation with user-car dealer. i mean, they are very good to even offer you $250 for your time.
the salesman is very rude. so i didn't proceed further. thank god this didn't happen to me.
don't have high expectation with user-car dealer. i mean, they are very good to even offer you $250 for your time.
02-24-2006, 12:06 AM
#5
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Try not to take it so personally. Yeah you drove a few miles, wasted time etc, but... you did not buy a piece of crap--sight unseen.
So take the $250 and count yourself lucky--very lucky. Furthermore, you've given us all a great heads-up.
And ask yourself if doing this sort of deal "sight unseen" is a wise decision.
good luck,
chris
So take the $250 and count yourself lucky--very lucky. Furthermore, you've given us all a great heads-up.
And ask yourself if doing this sort of deal "sight unseen" is a wise decision.
good luck,
chris
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02-24-2006, 01:02 AM
#8
You should definitely write to PCNA since this is a CPO. PCNA underwrites CPO cars. The fact that a poorly repaired car passed as CPO should concern PCNA and warranty some investigation.
I think my car was leased from this dealer by the original owner. Thank god it was new then.
I think my car was leased from this dealer by the original owner. Thank god it was new then.
02-24-2006, 01:59 AM
#9
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Originally Posted by djantlive
You should definitely write to PCNA since this is a CPO. PCNA underwrites CPO cars. The fact that a poorly repaired car passed as CPO should concern PCNA and warranty some investigation.
02-24-2006, 03:01 AM
#10
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Someone should pass this thread on to PCNA and the owner of Don Rosen imports. I count 4 people in the last six hours who will never darken the door of that dealership. maybe they'll learn something from it, but I doubt it.
02-24-2006, 07:42 AM
#11
better spending the time and checking it out..than sitting on a lemon! $250 is a joke, but believe me here in Newport Beach, you won't get a cup of coffee! and an arrogant attitude on top...
02-24-2006, 08:06 AM
#12
Rennlist Member
Let the pile on begin:
A few years ago I bought a Demo BMW from the Don Rosen Company, 2K on the clock. When I picked it up it wasn't even washed and the interior looked like a frat house. There was even a beer can in the back seat and cigarette butts in the ashtray. I had them detail the car and take another 1K off of the price and was on my way. I noticed the air conditioning didn't work as soon as it started to get warm so I took the car into the dealership with only 600 miles driven. They told me that there was a hole in the condenser and I had to file an insurance claim or pay 2K out of pocket. They said that I must have driven over a tree or something. I have bought 2 BMWs and 2 Porsches since and wouldn't even think of going to them for a quote.
A few years ago I bought a Demo BMW from the Don Rosen Company, 2K on the clock. When I picked it up it wasn't even washed and the interior looked like a frat house. There was even a beer can in the back seat and cigarette butts in the ashtray. I had them detail the car and take another 1K off of the price and was on my way. I noticed the air conditioning didn't work as soon as it started to get warm so I took the car into the dealership with only 600 miles driven. They told me that there was a hole in the condenser and I had to file an insurance claim or pay 2K out of pocket. They said that I must have driven over a tree or something. I have bought 2 BMWs and 2 Porsches since and wouldn't even think of going to them for a quote.
02-24-2006, 09:00 AM
#13
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As far as buying sight unseen I have in the past purchased sight unseen, and had great results. I 've also bought from dealerships that claimed a car was never in an accident, which at my visual inspection appearead to be clean. Aafter dealing with the car day in and day out I felt that the "no accident" calim was erronious. After confronting the dealership again...."well, it depends on waht you mean by an accident". Unfortunately, unless the repair is so bad(as in your case) we are left with the integity of the salesperson,lol! I think you were fortunate that the repairs were so poor; otherwise you may have bought a car that was not what you wanted.
Out of curiosity, did you ever run a CARFAX. Definitely something I would recommend before wasting time.
Out of curiosity, did you ever run a CARFAX. Definitely something I would recommend before wasting time.
02-24-2006, 10:36 AM
#15
Three Wheelin'
Cab2u, that is an dreadful story. It really pains me because I purchased my car sight unseen, but I had the benefit of knowing the owner of the dealership for nearly 20 years (my family has continued to patronize his company even though we moved 1000 miles away). On the one hand, you can count your lucky stars that you discovered the problem when you did instead of well after purchase. On the other hand, it really highlights the necessity of having someone give it the once over if you live too far away or dealing with highly recommended dealers. They beauty of Rennlist is that prospective buyers CAN post on the forum and request referrals from a lot of the regulars here and also ask if one of them in the area might pop over for a quick look-see. I'll tell you this, even though I know my dealer is a great source, I'll always swing by here first to get fellow Rennlisters' thoughts on the car, price, and purchase. It's an invaluable resource. And to save everyone else the follow-on, don't forget to become a member if you do get a Pcar....best 20 bucks I ever spent. 