996 or 993
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Three Wheelin'
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From: Indianapolis, IN
996 or 993
So, I'm getting ready to graduate from college with a computer engineering degree, and my first course of buisness after graduation is upgrading my P-car. Right now the prices for 996s are quickly approaching those of 993s. While I do like the looks of the 993 better, I like the performance and aftermarket for the 996 a little better. It seems like there are more tuners for the 996 than the 993. If there are any of you have owned both, what are you opinions?? Which one do you like better?? For those of you who have not ever owned a 993, what are the pluses and minuses of the 996 that you have found so far??
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FWIW
I've owned 964, 993 and 996. For good first dose of 911, go for the newest 993 you can afford. They just don't make them like that anymore! If I hadn't moved to a TT or a GT3, I'd still be grinning with my '97 C4S. BTW, there are plenty of tuning opportunities for a 993.
Cheers,
I've owned 964, 993 and 996. For good first dose of 911, go for the newest 993 you can afford. They just don't make them like that anymore! If I hadn't moved to a TT or a GT3, I'd still be grinning with my '97 C4S. BTW, there are plenty of tuning opportunities for a 993.
Cheers,
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From: dayton,ohio
Congratulations! on your soon to be graduation, Ah! 993 or 996 ??, a lot of folks have this question, and everyone in this 996 thread had chosen the latter, so obviously you'll get a lot of 996 votes, but unfortunately the answer...which had been the usual standard answer, is to drive both and pick the best for you.
I personally think 993 is better suited for performance aftermarket upgrades, and I hear the drive is more raw. But, 996 beats it in every other performance categories. But, lately this RMS issue is really troubling me, as with a 996 is it's a ticking time-bomb ready to cause problems. I like the 993 looks a little better too, so it really comes down to what you like.
But which ever you choose, will be a worthy reward for having stayed in school
I personally think 993 is better suited for performance aftermarket upgrades, and I hear the drive is more raw. But, 996 beats it in every other performance categories. But, lately this RMS issue is really troubling me, as with a 996 is it's a ticking time-bomb ready to cause problems. I like the 993 looks a little better too, so it really comes down to what you like.
But which ever you choose, will be a worthy reward for having stayed in school
Last edited by Sanjeevan; Dec 15, 2004 at 06:54 PM.
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From: Toronto, Canada
I did raise this question since I am thinking of purchasing a 993 as a second vehicle . If you search through the topics on this 996 forum you will see the 996vs 993 topic and a wide range of great responses.
Good luck
Cheers and safe driving
Good luck
Cheers and safe driving
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Wombat,
I have one of each. A 98 993 cab that I've had for a couple of years and a 99 996 that I bought new. The 996 has been a street car, a street/track car and now a club racer. The 993 is just for street fun.
Here are a few thoughts.
I love both cars. I really think the 993 was one of the best looking cars of all time. On the other hand, next to a 996 it looks beautiful but dated. You mentioned in your post on the 993 board that you loved the 993s classic curves. I love the curves too but I wouldn't call them classic. Most n/a 911s are actually pretty flat sided.
Both cars have overblown problems. Everyone talks about the 996's RMS problem like it's the end of the world. It's an $800 fix. If you can't afford an $800 repair you are looking at the wrong car. The 993 has a valve guide problem that is much more expensive to fix ($5k) but I'm not sure how frequently it really becomes a problem. Mine seems fine. BTW, it was mentioned on the 993 board that the 996 engine can't be rebuilt. That's BS. It just isn't cost effective to do it when you can buy a factory rebuilt for about half the price.
People like to talk about 993 quality as being much better than the 996. Again, I don't buy it. The 993 has a corrosion problem from leaky window seals. It's power window switches are so poor that I carry spares in the glove box. The inside door handles and the trunk release are cheap plastic. On the other hand, the doors shut like you're closing a safe and the body is just plain perfect.
The 996 has it's own quality quirks. The early 996s had a pretty cheap looking plastic interior. The hand brake in mine actually broke off in my hand. The doors are different but still of very high quality.
Interior design. The 993 looks cool. The 996 is 100 times more driver friendly. You decide what's important to you.
Performance wise, there is no question that the 996 has a much better chassis. It's longer, lower, wider, stiffer and lighter. Engine wise it's a tradeoff. The 993 has the tried and true dry sump, air cooled boxer. The 996 has the more powerful but cheaper wet sump with water cooling. Which is better. A combination of course. Take the 964 based 993 dry sump and give it water cooling.
Bottom line on performance, in club racing a standard, n/a 996 has to race in the same class as the 993 RS and the 993 TT. That should tell you something. So far the 996 has not been very competitive in the class but I think that will change as more 3.6L X51s join the crowd.
The fun factor. The 993 is frequently referred to as more visceral. I agree. In stock trim the 993 is more fun to drive. The 996 is much more "daily driver/long trip" friendly. I really think that difference goes away as soon as you add some coilovers to the 996. It quickly becomes a very "sporty" sportscar.
So, which should you buy? If I could only have one car and it had to be my primary driver plus my weekend track car the 996 would win hands down. It's more comfortable on the street and faster on the track. If I was looking for a car to take out on weekends to thrash through the canyons I would go with the 993. Either way, I don't think you can go wrong.
Just my 2 cents worth. Good luck and have fun.
Jim
I have one of each. A 98 993 cab that I've had for a couple of years and a 99 996 that I bought new. The 996 has been a street car, a street/track car and now a club racer. The 993 is just for street fun.
Here are a few thoughts.
I love both cars. I really think the 993 was one of the best looking cars of all time. On the other hand, next to a 996 it looks beautiful but dated. You mentioned in your post on the 993 board that you loved the 993s classic curves. I love the curves too but I wouldn't call them classic. Most n/a 911s are actually pretty flat sided.
Both cars have overblown problems. Everyone talks about the 996's RMS problem like it's the end of the world. It's an $800 fix. If you can't afford an $800 repair you are looking at the wrong car. The 993 has a valve guide problem that is much more expensive to fix ($5k) but I'm not sure how frequently it really becomes a problem. Mine seems fine. BTW, it was mentioned on the 993 board that the 996 engine can't be rebuilt. That's BS. It just isn't cost effective to do it when you can buy a factory rebuilt for about half the price.
People like to talk about 993 quality as being much better than the 996. Again, I don't buy it. The 993 has a corrosion problem from leaky window seals. It's power window switches are so poor that I carry spares in the glove box. The inside door handles and the trunk release are cheap plastic. On the other hand, the doors shut like you're closing a safe and the body is just plain perfect.
The 996 has it's own quality quirks. The early 996s had a pretty cheap looking plastic interior. The hand brake in mine actually broke off in my hand. The doors are different but still of very high quality.
Interior design. The 993 looks cool. The 996 is 100 times more driver friendly. You decide what's important to you.
Performance wise, there is no question that the 996 has a much better chassis. It's longer, lower, wider, stiffer and lighter. Engine wise it's a tradeoff. The 993 has the tried and true dry sump, air cooled boxer. The 996 has the more powerful but cheaper wet sump with water cooling. Which is better. A combination of course. Take the 964 based 993 dry sump and give it water cooling.
Bottom line on performance, in club racing a standard, n/a 996 has to race in the same class as the 993 RS and the 993 TT. That should tell you something. So far the 996 has not been very competitive in the class but I think that will change as more 3.6L X51s join the crowd.
The fun factor. The 993 is frequently referred to as more visceral. I agree. In stock trim the 993 is more fun to drive. The 996 is much more "daily driver/long trip" friendly. I really think that difference goes away as soon as you add some coilovers to the 996. It quickly becomes a very "sporty" sportscar.
So, which should you buy? If I could only have one car and it had to be my primary driver plus my weekend track car the 996 would win hands down. It's more comfortable on the street and faster on the track. If I was looking for a car to take out on weekends to thrash through the canyons I would go with the 993. Either way, I don't think you can go wrong.
Just my 2 cents worth. Good luck and have fun.
Jim
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The 993 is more of the pure essence of the 911 concept.
Originally Posted by wombat7
Fred,
What is it that you like about the 993 over the 996?
What is it that you like about the 993 over the 996?
The 993 is smaller. Every single thing about is more immediate and close at hand.
I had a C4S. Quite frankly, no 996 variant has ever matched those sensuous curves.
Is the 996 faster on the track? Yes, many are. But the 993 is a blast to drive. It's got a better engine and transmission. That said, neither model is perfect. Each have their faults. I'd be more concerned about ongoing RMS failures that about some remote possibility of emission's air passages becoming blocked in the head. I don't need to pass any smog test where I live, so I could live with this problem if I had to.
I had a C4S, ROW M030, Clubsport gear box, LWF, RS clutch, RSR mufflers. It was a joy to drive. Every up shift and downshift made you feel your where in a highly developed, well oiled machine. The same can't be said for the 996 engine/transmission driving experience.
Why did I change? I became a bit bored after 6+ years of ownership. I now have a TT that is a better car for long trips. The problem is, I just don't make as many long trips. There were opportunities everyday for me to enjoy the character of my 993. Without a lot of road in front of me, it's tough to utilize the capability of the 996TT.
At the end of the day, drive one or two of each, and you decide. Everyone else's opinion really doesn't matter.
Cheers,
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Joined: Sep 2004
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From: Toronto, Canada
Hey Jeeva ,
I'm glad I bring a smile to your face. It pretty much sums up the experience of anyone driving a Porsche....................we've all been there.
And by the way I am P Di Fiore.
Maybe I should start charging royalties. 
Cheers and safe driving.
I'm glad I bring a smile to your face. It pretty much sums up the experience of anyone driving a Porsche....................we've all been there.
And by the way I am P Di Fiore.
Maybe I should start charging royalties. Cheers and safe driving.
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Originally Posted by JimB
Wombat,
I have one of each. A 98 993 cab that I've had for a couple of years and a 99 996 that I bought new. The 996 has been a street car, a street/track car and now a club racer. The 993 is just for street fun.
Here are a few thoughts.
I love both cars. I really think the 993 was one of the best looking cars of all time. On the other hand, next to a 996 it looks beautiful but dated. You mentioned in your post on the 993 board that you loved the 993s classic curves. I love the curves too but I wouldn't call them classic. Most n/a 911s are actually pretty flat sided.
Both cars have overblown problems. Everyone talks about the 996's RMS problem like it's the end of the world. It's an $800 fix. If you can't afford an $800 repair you are looking at the wrong car. The 993 has a valve guide problem that is much more expensive to fix ($5k) but I'm not sure how frequently it really becomes a problem. Mine seems fine. BTW, it was mentioned on the 993 board that the 996 engine can't be rebuilt. That's BS. It just isn't cost effective to do it when you can buy a factory rebuilt for about half the price.
People like to talk about 993 quality as being much better than the 996. Again, I don't buy it. The 993 has a corrosion problem from leaky window seals. It's power window switches are so poor that I carry spares in the glove box. The inside door handles and the trunk release are cheap plastic. On the other hand, the doors shut like you're closing a safe and the body is just plain perfect.
The 996 has it's own quality quirks. The early 996s had a pretty cheap looking plastic interior. The hand brake in mine actually broke off in my hand. The doors are different but still of very high quality.
Interior design. The 993 looks cool. The 996 is 100 times more driver friendly. You decide what's important to you.
Performance wise, there is no question that the 996 has a much better chassis. It's longer, lower, wider, stiffer and lighter. Engine wise it's a tradeoff. The 993 has the tried and true dry sump, air cooled boxer. The 996 has the more powerful but cheaper wet sump with water cooling. Which is better. A combination of course. Take the 964 based 993 dry sump and give it water cooling.
Bottom line on performance, in club racing a standard, n/a 996 has to race in the same class as the 993 RS and the 993 TT. That should tell you something. So far the 996 has not been very competitive in the class but I think that will change as more 3.6L X51s join the crowd.
The fun factor. The 993 is frequently referred to as more visceral. I agree. In stock trim the 993 is more fun to drive. The 996 is much more "daily driver/long trip" friendly. I really think that difference goes away as soon as you add some coilovers to the 996. It quickly becomes a very "sporty" sportscar.
So, which should you buy? If I could only have one car and it had to be my primary driver plus my weekend track car the 996 would win hands down. It's more comfortable on the street and faster on the track. If I was looking for a car to take out on weekends to thrash through the canyons I would go with the 993. Either way, I don't think you can go wrong.
Just my 2 cents worth. Good luck and have fun.
Jim
I have one of each. A 98 993 cab that I've had for a couple of years and a 99 996 that I bought new. The 996 has been a street car, a street/track car and now a club racer. The 993 is just for street fun.
Here are a few thoughts.
I love both cars. I really think the 993 was one of the best looking cars of all time. On the other hand, next to a 996 it looks beautiful but dated. You mentioned in your post on the 993 board that you loved the 993s classic curves. I love the curves too but I wouldn't call them classic. Most n/a 911s are actually pretty flat sided.
Both cars have overblown problems. Everyone talks about the 996's RMS problem like it's the end of the world. It's an $800 fix. If you can't afford an $800 repair you are looking at the wrong car. The 993 has a valve guide problem that is much more expensive to fix ($5k) but I'm not sure how frequently it really becomes a problem. Mine seems fine. BTW, it was mentioned on the 993 board that the 996 engine can't be rebuilt. That's BS. It just isn't cost effective to do it when you can buy a factory rebuilt for about half the price.
People like to talk about 993 quality as being much better than the 996. Again, I don't buy it. The 993 has a corrosion problem from leaky window seals. It's power window switches are so poor that I carry spares in the glove box. The inside door handles and the trunk release are cheap plastic. On the other hand, the doors shut like you're closing a safe and the body is just plain perfect.
The 996 has it's own quality quirks. The early 996s had a pretty cheap looking plastic interior. The hand brake in mine actually broke off in my hand. The doors are different but still of very high quality.
Interior design. The 993 looks cool. The 996 is 100 times more driver friendly. You decide what's important to you.
Performance wise, there is no question that the 996 has a much better chassis. It's longer, lower, wider, stiffer and lighter. Engine wise it's a tradeoff. The 993 has the tried and true dry sump, air cooled boxer. The 996 has the more powerful but cheaper wet sump with water cooling. Which is better. A combination of course. Take the 964 based 993 dry sump and give it water cooling.
Bottom line on performance, in club racing a standard, n/a 996 has to race in the same class as the 993 RS and the 993 TT. That should tell you something. So far the 996 has not been very competitive in the class but I think that will change as more 3.6L X51s join the crowd.
The fun factor. The 993 is frequently referred to as more visceral. I agree. In stock trim the 993 is more fun to drive. The 996 is much more "daily driver/long trip" friendly. I really think that difference goes away as soon as you add some coilovers to the 996. It quickly becomes a very "sporty" sportscar.
So, which should you buy? If I could only have one car and it had to be my primary driver plus my weekend track car the 996 would win hands down. It's more comfortable on the street and faster on the track. If I was looking for a car to take out on weekends to thrash through the canyons I would go with the 993. Either way, I don't think you can go wrong.
Just my 2 cents worth. Good luck and have fun.
Jim
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From: Apex, NC
I have to echo JimB's comments (although i am a 964 man with a 996 daily driver)
so don't forget about the 964 - awsome and overlooked and unloved except by thier owners.
I am planning on adding a 993 S (2 or 4) to the stable in the future.
I started out looking at only 993's and moved to the 996 which i finally bought.
Both are unique in thier character and thier faults - but the same can be said of any model of 911 (tried rebuilding an MFI sytem in the past few years? - $$)
Drive a bunch and see where your heart takes you
One car only (JimB) a 964 carrera cup usa naturally who needs stuff like A/C and stereos - it was my daily driver for a year and half and i would gladly do it again
so don't forget about the 964 - awsome and overlooked and unloved except by thier owners.
I am planning on adding a 993 S (2 or 4) to the stable in the future.
I started out looking at only 993's and moved to the 996 which i finally bought.
Both are unique in thier character and thier faults - but the same can be said of any model of 911 (tried rebuilding an MFI sytem in the past few years? - $$)
Drive a bunch and see where your heart takes you
One car only (JimB) a 964 carrera cup usa naturally
who needs stuff like A/C and stereos - it was my daily driver for a year and half and i would gladly do it again
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"One car only (JimB) a 964 carrera cup usa naturally who needs stuff like A/C and stereos"
I could not agree more.
BTW, I'm a big 964 fan. I've had my butt kicked by well prepared RSAs and cup cars many times.
fast, thanks. I love them both. Actually I love all cars.
I could not agree more.
BTW, I'm a big 964 fan. I've had my butt kicked by well prepared RSAs and cup cars many times.
fast, thanks. I love them both. Actually I love all cars.
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Another point to consider........
One of the reasons I recommend the 993 over the 996 as your first 911 is that there are going to be fewer and fewer of them available in the future with low miles. It's a bit like a vintage of wine. Sooner or later they are all consumed and you've missed an opportunity. 996 will be available for a much longer period as they were produced in far greater numbers. You can always move up to a 996 or newer car later. Enjoy the classics while you still can.
Another point.....no 911 is cheap to maintain. Parts are more expensive, and the hours required to do some of the work are high. These are complex cars, extremely tightly packaged. And by all means avoid a '99 996. If your looking to get into the newer 911's at the lowest entry fee, these will catch you eye. They simply had far too many first year production problems.
A final point, and a bit of fatherly advice........don't sink too much of your disposable income in a car, any car, at this stage of your career. As a mechanical engineer, I never could have afforded any 911 before I had about 5 years of seniority. Houses make better investments than cars. You just can't drive a house!
Happy hunting...
Another point.....no 911 is cheap to maintain. Parts are more expensive, and the hours required to do some of the work are high. These are complex cars, extremely tightly packaged. And by all means avoid a '99 996. If your looking to get into the newer 911's at the lowest entry fee, these will catch you eye. They simply had far too many first year production problems.
A final point, and a bit of fatherly advice........don't sink too much of your disposable income in a car, any car, at this stage of your career. As a mechanical engineer, I never could have afforded any 911 before I had about 5 years of seniority. Houses make better investments than cars. You just can't drive a house!
Happy hunting...
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Three Wheelin'
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From: Indianapolis, IN
Wow guys, Thanks a lot. Your opinions have been very helpful. I definately think I'm going to have to drive both and then see which one I like the best. Both definately have their upsides, but definately have thier downsides as well. I personally like the raw feel of a sports car. While my 944 definately isn't a very high performance machine, I like the raw feel of it, but I also need to think about comfort on long drives, I will be about 4 hrs away from my girlfriend for the first year.
Fred, you definately make a good point about not sinking too much disposabel income into a car. The thing that is goign to help me out, for my first 4 years at least, is the fact that I'm going to be in the Air Force. While I will not be making "market value" for a computer engineer, pretty much my whole salary will be going straight into my pocket since I will be recieving a housing allowance, food allowance, etc. I think I'm going to start my search soon, and then wait until I find one I REALLY like before I get it, so that could be i year, or 3 years...
Cupcar#12 - I never thought of looking at 964s. I will have to start looking at those too...
Again, Thanks so much for your input it definately helped a lot.
Fred, you definately make a good point about not sinking too much disposabel income into a car. The thing that is goign to help me out, for my first 4 years at least, is the fact that I'm going to be in the Air Force. While I will not be making "market value" for a computer engineer, pretty much my whole salary will be going straight into my pocket since I will be recieving a housing allowance, food allowance, etc. I think I'm going to start my search soon, and then wait until I find one I REALLY like before I get it, so that could be i year, or 3 years...
Cupcar#12 - I never thought of looking at 964s. I will have to start looking at those too...
Again, Thanks so much for your input it definately helped a lot.