For some of us following the saga of "is RMS such a big issue?" and other topics the reality is that we are facing bills for totally new engines.

Most of our cars have not covered substantial mileage (usually 16k-40k), they have never been raced and they have been fully serviced at Porsche Centres.

It is widely agreed that latent defects in some of the 996 engines mean that total replacement is inevitable. cost between $10,000 to $17,000 to which Porsche will contribute $0 in most cases.

PORSCHE DENY THAT THERE IS A PROBLEM!!

In the USA most Porsche centres replace engines on a "good will" basis regardless of their age but in europe and england, this is at all common. Further Porsche put us through various unnecessary hurdles to try to get out of paying to the effect most people cough up when they do not need to

I have set up an email address penteluk@yahoo.com please send me the details of your car and please get others that you know to do the same. I need all those that have had total engine replacements carried out either for free or at cost.

what i need to know is

1. The reg of car and date of first reg so that we are not acused of making up the numbers

2. The mileage and how many years old the car was when it failed.

3. What the technical problem that caused the failure eg cylinder cracked

4. How much it cost you

5. offers and time scale from Porsche eg i was first offered £0 by Porsche GB the £800 a week later

6 If you had to fist pay for the technical inspection

I will try to get an electronic profoma but just mail me at that address. Its real and i am serious about getting this going

Finally we have to say that we have no axe to grind against Porsche Centres nor are we against the brand we just want the truth.

 

It is? I don't think so. Last survey I saw on this forum, actually very few, a tiny minority, had any major problems with their 996.

Anyway, to help you, may I suggest that you get on all the Porsche forums you can find and ask for the names. You may get a more representative sample, but I seriously doubt you'll find that "total (engine) replacement is inevitable".

 

BTW, heres a link to that survey: 996 Reliability

 

Well, EJ took on a similar task w. 993 wiring harnesses. By compiling all the specifics of each car that had the problem, he came up with a substantial database of hard facts, that lead to a US gov (NHSTA?) agency investigation, which lead to a recall on all affected cars.

I think a methodical approach to gathering all the pertinent information is to be commended. It'll give everyone some hard facts to go on, rather than the emotional gut reactions which don't really get you anywhere w. Porsche if you have a problem.

Good luck w. the project, n4das; you might think about putting your name in your sig file if you're going to become point man on this project, FWIW.

 

I agree with Robert that it's a good idea to gather the information but I would suggest doing so without the inflaming BS. Very few cars will need their engine replaced and those that do will cost $8k, not $10k to $17.

 

Might be UK prices. Norcal dealer quoted 10K to a forum contributer.

It should be remembered when engines are replaced; they are replaced with the MY96 block, that has the design failure. The good news is they have a long warranty.

 

I love how you already have your conclusions before you get your data. Who has widely agreed that there is a latent defect and do you have any information to back up your statement that Porsche "in most cases" contributes $ 0 to repairs when there is an engine failure.

Is that a picture of your engine or one you just found on the internet. Perhaps you should give some information about the engine in the picture and state whether that is a failure caused by a latent defect and one that Porsche has refused to cover. Lastly, it may be helpful if you are willing to use a name to validate this thing or what you are saying.

BTW, thanks for the bizzare PM. You are one strange dude . . . or chick.

 

RE: Wiring harness v. Engine issues

An inherent problem in engine issues is that an individual starring at a new engine bill may very well disagree with the computer which indicates a blown shift or an over rev. and swear that they never abused the car or that the car was never tracked by them or the prior owners. With a wiring harness, there is little question about cause.

 

Might we cut some slack to someone who is trying to potentially help the rest of the 996 owners (or future 996/997 owners - like me).

Robert said it best - keep it methodical, keep it factual and good luck!

 

Kinda hard to give slack to someone who starts out with an unsubstantiated claim but states it like gospel truth. Con artists and snake charmers start out the same way. Simillar allegations have been made on this forum, have been discussed ad nauseum, and all these doomsayers are getting to be nothing but as irritating as telemarketers selling a nonsense product. Check the archives, and you'll see what I mean.

Give me facts, give me numbers, give me stats, and I'll join your crusade. Give me rumors, nasty allegations, unsubstatiated innuendos, BS inflammatory statements, and I'll give you flack.

 

Good points Palting. I can't argue with logic. Sorry if I came on too strong

 

If you want to be scientific about this matter you'll need hard numbers instead of anecdotal observations off the internet. Unfortunately, PAG is probably the only source for that kind of data. While I have misgivings abouit certain aspects of the 996 engine design, I do not believe they are inherently flawed or particularly weak...quite the contrary in fact.

 

Thank you all for the response. I note the following:
1. I agree that it may be a minority of people, but when Porsche centres deny any incidents have occured then it becomes an issue. No one has ANY figures. All i want to know is an answer to the question how many peolpe have had their engine changed even with "normal" use?
2. I agree that some defects may not require total replacement, nor is this an inevitablity, but as above all i want to know for the moment is those people who require one.
3. The prices quoted are UK prices £9,750(=$16,770 at rate of 1.72) for a new engine from a Porsche centre fitted inc VAT this is constant from all centres in the UK as PGB has a fixed price policy for all centres. If you require the engine to be stripped to prove cause of fault 40 hours approx £2,000.
4.The picture is that of an engine block from taken of the inside of one of the cars that at present has undergone an independant inspection and awaiting porsches comments.It shows what happens when you get a free steam clean of the cylinder due to a cracked liner (I got a few more but cant seem to upload them on my replies!!). Its a 2000 c2, covered 23k miles not raced, fully serviced at my Porsche centre since new. The independant inspector found the fault not to be due to normal useage. Its not coverd under Porsche warranty, PAG has contributed £0 towards replacement. The owner now wants to install a recon engine and trade in the car.
5. So far no one, i have been contacted by, here in the uk, has had any contribution from PAG if outside the 2 year warranty.
6. In my and the case of the others here in the UK our on board computers have shown no over reving or misuse.
7. I dont disagree that all the engines are inherently flawed nor are they weak but some have been and in these cases all i am asking that Porsche puts up its hands and admits its mistake.

I will only report facts nothing more nothing less. I have begun an excell work sheet, and have asked contributors here in the UK to supply me with the reports of the cause of the failures.

Sorry Doug i am not a chic

All comments are welcome please keep them going

 

If you cut down on the rhetoric and sensationalism, you will cut down on nasty replies. I would suggest changing the title of the thread to something less doom and gloom end of the world sounding so that you don't get branded as a fruitcake off the bat. I though you WERE a fruitcake .


Not raced, but damage not due to normal usage. How was it not "normal usage"? Does this mean the engine was abused, just not in a race? If it truly is the case, I'm not so sure Porsche would be responsible. Was there a PPI before the used car was bought, and did the dealer certify it? If so, there should be resposibility from Porsche.

I wouldn't limit it to just UK, though. There's a huge market here in the US. If there is a problem to be found, go where there's a huge number. You may want to get in touch with Scouser, another poster here in the board. He's got a website dedicated to RMS failures.

I can't end this post without saying you probably won't find much. But I also wish you luck.

 

As far as the inspectors report goes "there were no signs within the engine of missuse". Yes the car did have PPI prior to new registration but the car is now 4 years old.

I am not limitting it to the UK but those that have been in touch personally are from the UK so far.

Scoucer and i are already in touch thanks