firecall

LOL - I used to be like you in my youth... but then I got old and traffic drives me insane

Maybe I should have got a manual...

maj75

I went to see the C4S and what a steaming pile of crap. It was so bad I didn’t even take it for a test drive. Terrible paintwork on the outside, a taillight that needed duct tape to stay on the car, interior window moldings that were dissolving and torn up back seats. I mean how does that happen. Who could even sit back there.

Still looking. If I was in the market for a Turbo, I think I’d consider the Tip, mainly because I’d never track it. But for the Carrera, I think I’ll look for the 6mt.

I have a Lexus LS460 FSport with the flappy paddles and manual mode that’s my daily driver. Also a ‘69 427 Corvette 4 Speed. My track car is a C5 Corvette 6mt with 440 rwhp. Selling the C5 to get a 996.

Mike Mullins

Next

Billup

What's your rating levels of buzz killingness?

Detonated IMSB - High Buzz Killington
Driving a Manual vs.Tip Porsche - No Buzz Killington, Smiles for Miles

Get what you want, these questions always garner a bunch of unnecessary bickering, you're going to be the one driving the car so will it kill YOUR buzz? Personally I find the Tip just as fun to drive as a 6MT, but it Tip wouldn't give me the same satisfaction at this point in life.

xpierro

I come from France where automatic don’t exist, I had never seen or used one before. I only had cheap little french cars (a renault super 5 and a peugeot 206) and after a few years in Hong Kong I missed driving so much I had to find a cheap car. The cheapest car I could find and trust was a 9000 euros 996 and everyone here has automatic.

I was actually blown away, it’s convenient and easy, it can switch to manual (and for me having to switch to the British stupid right-side wheel made the transition less painful), I barely miss the “manly” “switch up when it revs too high”. As you can see I’m an idiot driver who can’t believe he owns a Porsche so might not be the advice you’re looking for, but definitely not as off putting as I would have thought having grown up manual only.

Maybe one thing, if you drive on slow roads, it switches to 5th gear at around 80 km/h with a howling sound, but there are ways to configure it to shift less aggressively.

911Syncro

Not sure what is means to shift to 5th gear with a "howling sound". Yes, it upshifts very early in the lower shift maps, and sometimes that can be annoying but can you explain more about what the howling sound is?

There are some other inaccurate things with the Tiptronic that I've found (this is the Mk2 Tip):

• On a manual downshift from 3rd to 2nd it doesn't do a real good job matching engine RPMs. I find I have to add a little gas to get a smooth shift.
• It can't detect when the car is going uphill. So on a longer uphill the car needs more power to maintain speed, and therefore uses more gas, and often will downshift. But the Tip computer thinks that the driver is invoking "sporty acceleration" and then puts the car on a higher shift map, which is still in place when you get to the top of the hill. So I find myself upshifting manually sometimes at the top of an uphill when once again on flat terrain.
• I practice getting the computer to downshift when flooring the accelerator when in auto mode, but that isn't always so smooth or predictable. Usually when I do this I really want ot accelerate very fast, and I often am not sure which gear the Tip selected -- so I have to glance down at the dashboard when I would prefer to be watching the road.
• Sequential gears only: on all the sticks I drive, I sometimes skip a gear, like downshifting from 4th to 2nd. Can't do this with a Tip.
• When driving a car that is very familiar and a manual transmission, I hardly have to think at all about shifting. It seems like through all the years my right arm, left leg, and brain have all synced and I always know subconsciously which gear I am in, and what the next shifting action is. With the Tiptronic the control is via fingers and no left leg -- and I am still not trained enough to make the manual shifting somewhat subconscious. So I have to think more about each shift, have to glance more at the dash to see which gear I am currently in. This might get better, but honestly I find that manual shifting the Tiptronic takes more concentration that manually shifting a stick on a car that I am very familiar with.
• I always have to worry about which "mode" I'm in, auto or manual. Going to manual isn't much a problem, there is an explicit decision to do so since you shift gear while in auto and then flip the stick left. Now, that is kind of a pain, since there are 2 actions required to downshift and get into manual mode. And I sometimes forget to flip it back into auto mode. Anyway, the point is that if you use manual mode on the Tip you kinda have to be aware, or remember, which mode you are in.

These things don't matter too much, they are pretty small problems, I really like the Tip since I sometimes use the 996 as a daily driver. Oops, here's a boulevard with about 23 traffic lights coming up, or here comes the freeway -- just flip into auto mode and driving is easy. But after 2 years, sometimes practicing, I can't get to that level or driving experience as with a sports car with a stick. You know, when you precisely time the release of the clutch to hit the curve exactly right. Or like I wrote above about being on auto pilot with a familar stick car, it's the union of man / machine in a powerful sports car, when that combination makes everything work so beautifully; that is the state when the driving experience really is a sport. No Nirvana yet with the Tip.

Dranon

Daily driver here NO track time. I had the same questions a few months ago. Taking one for a test drive will NOT answer your question. I have a C4 cab 6mt and a Turbo S cab Tip. I find myself enjoying driving the 6 speed more. BUT I am getting "used" to the Tip on the Turbo. No question as a daily driver the Tip is "better". My 24-year-old son chided me for getting a tip but last week he called me told me how his knee hurts from shifting in traffic. I'm 60 now I great shape but I seem to always reach for the clutch in the Tip!! Probably because I switch off the cars too much. I hated it at first which is why I said a test drive will not tell you much. After 6 weeks of ownership, I am appreciating it much more! What I do not like is the exhaust note. I LOVE THE PORSCHE SPORT EXHAUST on my C4! I wish I could get the same kind of note on the Turbo. So I may be selling the Turbo...

xpierro

Oh just the sound a car makes when it’s in 5th gear at low speed, you know, when it clearly under-rev and your only desire is to downshift but you don’t know how to and you grind your teeth and press the pedal to try and make the tip downshift

It’s surely limited to HK where most roads are limited at 80kmh, just above the 5th speed upshift threshold grrr

I would shift at 90 instead if I was in manual mode or when the revs sound “healthy”. That feeling for the engine revs is something I miss a bit, but uphill start without the break is a dream.

Dranon

YES! That's it exactly! NOW I M CONCERNED SINCE YOU STILL HAVE THAT FEELING AFTER 2 YEARS!

lowpue

+1
This is precisely why i only track my 996....my double clutch cars stay at home. nothing beats a perfectly timed heal and toe at the limit....since it only happens for me 10% of the time i have a long way to go before i get tired of it

911Syncro

Yeah, well it depends on your own individual evaluation of the pros and cons. Although that perfect driving experience is still a shortcoming for me, I still favor the Tip at about 90%, because it makes driving the 996 so much more accessible, and easier to share it with my wife and kids. If I can ever save enough pennies, it's a 997.2 with PDK for me.

peterp

Although there is no absolute answer, I think this statement is true -> If you don't need a automatic, get a 6-speed.

The converse, of course, is that if you do need a Tip, get a Tip. If you are on the fence about whether you need an automatic or not, definitely drive both. Neither is better or worse depending on individual circumstances, but the difference between them is not subtle and it's best to try both.

I honestly believe most people can tell which is right for them in one drive. The Turbo Tip isn't a fair comparison -- the Turbo giveth what the Tip taketh away . In naturally aspirated against naturally aspirated, it's a much bigger difference (or at least it was in my 2 NA 996's). Which one is best is entirely dependent upon each individual driving situation. For anyone who encounters frequent traffic, or has frequent leg pain, Tip is a godsend (even if it isn't perfect, and it isn't). For anyone that doesn't have traffic or physical issues (and likes driving manual), 6-speed is the way to go.

RSBro

I stayed away from the 996 (I should have bought a Turbo years ago when prices were even lower than now) bc of the IMS/RMS (which to be fair is a legit concern on lower mileage cars, but can be fixed cheaply) and the hate on the TIP transmission. After driving one now almost exactly 1.5 years (C4S) as my DD, I'm glad I have it. The transmission is adaptive in it literally does exactly what that sounds like, and adapts to your driving style. There are a few threads around on it.
Plus, living in the greater Houston area, there is nowhere at any time of day you aren't sitting in traffic, so it makes the most sense as a DD. When you want it to hang on to that last rev, kick it over to Manual and there you go. Plus I've gotten good at the 'kick-down' function, when called upon, and don't even need the wheel buttons anymore for most DD use.

So to answer your question:
1. Buzzkill? Really close to 0
2. Do you want/need a TIP, you gotta drive it. Just when you do, push your foot down like you would on any sports car and see how it goes. My take is you won't be disappointed.

sasilverbullet

Totally agree! (03 C2 Tip owner)

peterp

It would be great if somebody who has extensive experience with both mk1 and mk2 Tiptronics could contrast the two. I think there are fairly major differences between the two, with the mk2 being better. I couldn't find a way to love my mk1 Tip, but have never tried the mk2.