tom__w

I had a 2006 Cayenne (that I loved) that got totaled 2 years ago. I am now looking at a 2002 996 Carrera 4 Cabriolet with 63K miles in silver for $23K. 18" wheels, Advanced Technic and a few other options.

Has a used motor from another car that was replaced in 2010. The receipt for the used motor says IMS Upgrade. Seller states slight weeping of main rear seal but other than that, the car is in good shape. (no history of clutch replacement)

Any initial thoughts? Anything else I should look for? I am OK (I think) with a RMS and even IMS replacement if I can get the cost down to $20K from the seller.

Chris(MA)

If you're not sure get a full inspection, does it say what IMS product? Weird they did IMS but no new RMS or clutch. You pretty much have zero records on the other engine? who did the work on the motor swap? the car might have 63k on the clock but what does the motor have?

tom__w

The used motor receipt says $600 for IMS upgrade on it (sounds like an LN or roller bearing). The company that sold it was out of Ga and they are now out of business. Sigh.

The company that put it in in 2010 said that the motor company would have recommended a new clutch it they thought it needed it. After all, like you say, the motor was easily accessible at that point. The RMS / IMS may have been new (or near new) in 2010 when they sold it.

The company that swapped the engine is out of NJ and they are fairly reputable from what I can see. I know it's not ideal, but the car seems like a pretty good deal, especially if it has been running well for 9 years.

And yes, I have a German auto repair specialist who would do a PPI on the car before I buy it. I am looking for a nice daily driver.

charlieaf92

Hard to give much advice without more information. I'd personally be cautious of any car that has an engine swap from a donor vehicle, and doesn't include comprehensive records to accompany it.

tom__w

With 9 seemingly reliable years on it (it was installed in 2010), I would presume that the engine is OK. Of course the engine could have 180,000+ miles on it, but I would doubt it.

If the engine was replaced in 2010 and only 20,000 miles have been added since, how bad could it possibly be. Particularly if you consider the RMS has lasted at least that long.

I suppose my question is, assuming the engine is in OK shape (sans the weeping RMS), is this a good deal for a daily driver?

cds72911

If you like the car, go for it.

edit: I think it was dporto that said it on another thread recently, but IMS bearing update isn't generally a permanent fix (except maybe the LN Solution, which wasn't marketed in 2010, AFAIK); the replacement bearings are treated as a wear item with a service life (miles/years). Even if it was replaced in 2010, it is likely due for replacement anyway. When you do that job, it makes sense to do the RMS at the same time, and likely the clutch assembly if there is any wear. The labor to take it apart is the same for all three jobs, so might as well do it while you're there.

Since it is a dealer, negotiate the IMS/RMS service into the deal... They surely have room in the selling price. Or negotiate it off and do the work yourself/with a good indy mechanic. Any knowledgable buyer is going to want either the work done, or the price adjusted to accommodate it and I'm sure they've factored that into their asking price.

I wouldn't be scared off by a replacement engine, but I would want documentation and more info. If it was an AT factory engine, then I'm all for it (you can tell from the engine serial number on the case). If it was a used engine, I'd want history: mileage and other provenance (or at least a clean bill of health/PPI from an unbiased source). I do think it can impact value and salability for a lot of cautious buyers.

My '02 has both an AT engine and a factory replacement transmission, both done by a dealer and I have the invoices. To me that is like having a new car, so a good thing. To the seller, it was priced into the deal as a negative. I suspect that it will be harder to sell if/when I ever try, as compared to a stock numbers matching example, even with clear documentation.

808Bill

With the IMSB being 9 years old, how do you know it's not the bearing leaking oil?

tom__w

I can ask for the engine serial number. Pardon my noob status here, what is a AT versus just a replacement? My understanding was the engine can from a reputable wrecker who parted it out of just another 911.

And yes, I have an indy right near me that specializes in German cars. He does the work (RMS / IMS) or subs it to a Porsche mechanic that he knows.

As far as resale, point taken. But I tend to hold onto cars until they are beaten to within an inch of death (lol), so I am not concerned about this daily driver's resale.

tom__w

It's what I was told (weeping RMS). Apparently the seller also is a mechanic.

cmoody127

Porsche factory remanufactured engine serial number includes "AT" while an engine rebuit (or not) from another source would retain the standard engine serial number, which does not include "AT"

I found this thread helpful when looking at a 996 with a reman engine: https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...-location.html

charlieaf92

Your logic is sound and the engine is probably just fine. As I'm sure you've seen in your research, engine failure is exactly unheard of in these cars - so its not out out of character to find one with a replacement. The point is you really don't know how many miles are on it. Without documentation, you have to assume the mileage is equal, or higher than the rest of the car. In my opinion, that's not as nice as knowing for sure what the mileage is - so it knocks the resale value down. If there isn't documentation of the IMS bearing being replaced, then it might as well not have been done as far as resale value is concerned. Just my 2 cents. I don't see anything about what you've posted that makes me think its a screaming deal, so it wouldn't hurt to shop around a bit as well.

docmirror

Keep shopping. This doesn't blow my skirt up. $20k is a decent price, but no screaming bargain.

If you like it, grab it up and enjoy. Maybe not a lot out there with the same features, C4, cab, tip, technics.

My experience is get what you really want, even if you have to shop for a year, and find it 2000 miles away. If this is your dream 996, write the check.

tom__w

I absolutely love the look of the car, especially from the back end with those fat tires. And the performance doesn't suck either.

I've been driving a real POS for the past 2 years (after I lost my Cayenne) and this feels a little impulsive. But that is why I want to do the test drive (Saturday @ 10 AM) and get a formal PPI.

BTW - I love these forums. I use them for work and play. Such good advice from people with nothing more to gain than just sharing their experiences.

tom__w

Also found a quick "in today's money" calculator:

https://www.saving.org/inflation/inf...?amount=91,000

Apparently this is a $129,000 car, less depreciation.

lol

808Bill

$15K if no documentation of motors history. What bearing does it have? If LN, they might have info if it was registered.