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Old 07-13-2018, 08:01 PM
  #31  
docmirror
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Originally Posted by Silk


Third radiator is not necessary.

No, no it isn't. Neither is a bunch of susp crap.
Ever been to Florida?
Old 07-13-2018, 09:06 PM
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Mike Murphy
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Originally Posted by docmirror
No, no it isn't. Neither is a bunch of susp crap.
Ever been to Florida?
To be honest, my car was hitting 110C (230F) indicated on the track in the summer without the 3rd radiator and I have been quite convinced that these cars were running hot.

Then I discovered actual water temps were quite a bit lower when checked via the ODBII or Durametric software. So now I’m curious to track again and monitor real temps rather than the factory gauges.
Old 07-13-2018, 10:31 PM
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Mbren1979
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Originally Posted by Blue Chip
Nobody there bites.... they're all pretty friendly. I'm a PCA instructor and am local - so if you have questions about tracking - I can probably help. There are some AWESOME indy shops local too. Florida Citrus goes to Roebling Road Raceway in October - great first track to learn on. Suncoast is headed to Sebring in September. There is also Oktoberfast at Daytona - it's an advanced DE, Club Race, and autocross on the road course and its a ton of fun.
Guess maybe i will have to join the club. I just always thought thoses kinda of clubs were all people who held their noses up like snobs and drove $200,000 911's. I'm just a hard working mechanic who wouldnt be able to afford a Porsche unless i could fix it myself......But the thought i tracking the car sounds fun as hell. Maybe i should get involved.
Old 07-13-2018, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by murphyslaw1978


To be honest, my car was hitting 110C (230F) indicated on the track in the summer without the 3rd radiator and I have been quite convinced that these cars were running hot.

Then I discovered actual water temps were quite a bit lower when checked via the ODBII or Durametric software. So now I’m curious to track again and monitor real temps rather than the factory gauges.
Fine with me. It's a semi-free country. Go search what Jake as to say on the subject.
Old 07-13-2018, 10:35 PM
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Mbren1979
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Originally Posted by hatchetf15
OP,
Good words from the Rennlisters. My fun was going through the car and making sure all the fasteners were correct and functional, checking the undertrays, all the hoses, all the cosmetics like the covers over the front trunk release and under the wipers. Did you put screens for the radiators in? Loved getting to know the 996 and made it mine! Downloaded the PET to get smart about the systems, cleaned the seats and carpets, addressed the crappy soft-touch painted parts, etc and ad nauseum. Drive the car hard for a couple months and then determine what the suspension needs. Welcome and enjoy your P-car!
I didnt even think about the screens. I got all done a about 9pm, cleaned up and then was sitting in bed watching videos and saw someone else who put screens. I guess i should have watched the videos before. Always next time.
Old 07-13-2018, 10:37 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by docmirror
Fine with me. It's a semi-free country. Go search what Jake as to say on the subject.
I'm not sure i understand the whole issue with the temps. The fans are not even comanded to come on until about 215 degrees. Most cars on the road run 200 to 225 actual temps while driving.
Old 07-13-2018, 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbren1979
I'm not sure i understand the whole issue with the temps. The fans are not even comanded to come on until about 215 degrees. Most cars on the road run 200 to 225 actual temps while driving.
Well, this is a public forum. Where people come to give free advice. Some people are engineers, and understand thermodynamics, heat stress, metalurgy, and how it is affected by temperature. If Porsche says you can run your car at 215F, then you can run your car at 215F. Go right ahead. I will guarantee that you will never have a D chunk, spun bearing, dropped valve, cylinder crack, head crack, or one of the other 842 failure modes on the M96 engine. In fact, I think you should actually go hotter. Take out the t-stat and find or make a hotter one, and install that. Cuz - if some heat is ok, then more heat must be better.

Have a nice day.
out
Old 07-13-2018, 11:07 PM
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Originally Posted by docmirror
Well, this is a public forum. Where people come to give free advice. Some people are engineers, and understand thermodynamics, heat stress, metalurgy, and how it is affected by temperature. If Porsche says you can run your car at 215F, then you can run your car at 215F. Go right ahead. I will guarantee that you will never have a D chunk, spun bearing, dropped valve, cylinder crack, head crack, or one of the other 842 failure modes on the M96 engine. In fact, I think you should actually go hotter. Take out the t-stat and find or make a hotter one, and install that. Cuz - if some heat is ok, then more heat must be better.

Have a nice day.
out
funny, i was actually asking because i was interested in hearing an educational response. But instead i got a smartass response. Thank you for your assistance in educating us on why we should lower the temps.
Old 07-13-2018, 11:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbren1979
Guess maybe i will have to join the club. I just always thought thoses kinda of clubs were all people who held their noses up like snobs and drove $200,000 911's. I'm just a hard working mechanic who wouldnt be able to afford a Porsche unless i could fix it myself......But the thought i tracking the car sounds fun as hell. Maybe i should get involved.
Actually around here there are PCA members that drive $200,000+ Porsche GT3s, RSes, GT2s, etc...but they will stand around and talk to me about my 16 year old $20K Porsche 996 that I only own because I could fix the minor issues it had myself.
They’re even cool with me about my unusual mods.
It might not be their style, but they applaud me for making it mine.
I thought they wouldn’t accept me, because I’m just a regular guy.
Turns out they’re regular guys...with a lot more money.
They buy the toys I would be buying if I had their cash.
There are also lots of DIYers, and DIY-want-2-be guys.
If you’re a technician they will want your help with their cars.
I sometimes just sit and watch them work in my garage with my tools and offer advice when they run into problems.
They’re just normal guys too.
I’m a tool *****, so I’ve got almost everything needed for working on just about anything.
Old 07-14-2018, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by docmirror
Fine with me. It's a semi-free country. Go search what Jake as to say on the subject.
No, I have. Read though countless threads about temperature and read all the Hartech white papers, listened to Jake. And then discovered that my DME reported temps are 10-15 colder than what the gauge reads. So all this worry about temps and my coolant wasn’t even hitting 100C most of the time on the track.
Old 07-14-2018, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by TexSquirrel
If I were you, I’d get a 2qt deep sump, and Fabspeed exhaust.
Also consider a spin on oil filter from LN Engineering.
a deep sump will not protect you from anything. The position of the oil pick up is flawed and a deeper sump will not remedy that, eventually the oil-level will drop too low. We managed to see significant oil pressure drops on the street. At least such that you have to be worried.

When talking to the guys that develop deep sump kits eventually when you keep asking all of them will admit that it is not 100% safe and you need a accusump.
Old 07-15-2018, 09:54 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Silk


a deep sump will not protect you from anything. The position of the oil pick up is flawed and a deeper sump will not remedy that, eventually the oil-level will drop too low. We managed to see significant oil pressure drops on the street. At least such that you have to be worried.

When talking to the guys that develop deep sump kits eventually when you keep asking all of them will admit that it is not 100% safe and you need a accusump.
Not true. Just because you want to engineer a swinging oil pickup or over-engineer some solution to a perceived problem which was discussed at length on another thread, the fact is that there are hundreds, if not close to a 1000 people running our 2 quart deep sump with race oil with zero issues. We stopped offering the Accusump at the same time we released the 2 quart deep sump as it was far more effective than an Accusump. Opinion is opinion and fact is fact. Just because you think the 2 quart deep sump doesn't work doesn't mean it is so.
Old 07-15-2018, 10:21 AM
  #43  
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Or you can just run the car as is. I’ve done 2 DE events and May do one or 2 a year going forward. “They” say you can get oil starvation even on street tires. Im running at lime rock and maybe im not good enough or the track is in a way I haven’t seen a drop in pressure. For a DE event every now and then no deep sump for me. As time goes on and I get better maybe I’ll add one. But plenty of people track their cars without a deep sump and haven’t blown up an engine... fingers crossed it stays that way
Old 07-15-2018, 12:36 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Anestheticg
Or you can just run the car as is. I’ve done 2 DE events and May do one or 2 a year going forward. “They” say you can get oil starvation even on street tires. Im running at lime rock and maybe im not good enough or the track is in a way I haven’t seen a drop in pressure. For a DE event every now and then no deep sump for me. As time goes on and I get better maybe I’ll add one. But plenty of people track their cars without a deep sump and haven’t blown up an engine... fingers crossed it stays that way
Truth be told, it's very hard to get oil starvation with Porsche N-spec street tires. You cannot pull enough Gs. It takes a really skilled driver and very specific conditions to see a dip in oil pressure. Road America in the Carousel is one such place. The 1/2 quart deep sump is good for 1/2 bar increase in pressure through the Carousel in those conditions, running Mobil 1.

The less spoken about issue is oil aeration and thinning at high temps experienced on track that coupled with starvation caused major engine damage. 200 treadwear or stickier tires compound this issue and at that point, a 1/2 quart deep sump, even with X51 baffle, is useless, requiring more drastic changes like a race oil and 2 quart deep sump.

Using a quality oil and changing it more often is wise, even with street tires, and especially if you are DE'ing the car. Take your pick of factory approved 5w40 oils if you are set on using an A40-approved oil, like Motul 8100 X-Cess 5w40.
Old 07-15-2018, 01:31 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by Charles Navarro
Truth be told, it's very hard to get oil starvation with Porsche N-spec street tires. You cannot pull enough Gs. It takes a really skilled driver and very specific conditions to see a dip in oil pressure. Road America in the Carousel is one such place. The 1/2 quart deep sump is good for 1/2 bar increase in pressure through the Carousel in those conditions, running Mobil 1.

The less spoken about issue is oil aeration and thinning at high temps experienced on track that coupled with starvation caused major engine damage. 200 treadwear or stickier tires compound this issue and at that point, a 1/2 quart deep sump, even with X51 baffle, is useless, requiring more drastic changes like a race oil and 2 quart deep sump.

Using a quality oil and changing it more often is wise, even with street tires, and especially if you are DE'ing the car. Take your pick of factory approved 5w40 oils if you are set on using an A40-approved oil, like Motul 8100 X-Cess 5w40.
thanks for the response


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