forhamilton

Why is this in the 993 forum?

Greg H.

1) Because we are car guys (and gals).

2) Because we have already discussed 99.97% of everything about the 993.

Greg H.

996racer

The GT-R is not a plain car, but it is an ugly one. That's a personal position and to each his own. However to say that it outperforms a 911 turbo is a different story. In an impirical sence that is correct b if it were all numbers all the time we would all be driving stiffly spring, heavily modified and uncomfortable street racers. My point is there are intangables, for example my 1997 993TT looks sounds and turns heads like every Porsche 911 even after 12 years. Do you think people will be as passionate about thier GT-R's 12 years from now? Not likely as the design is nuveau and not at all classic. I liken it to some of the supercars of the 80's. For example the Ferarri Testarossa, a very capabile and exotic of its time, but just doesn't cut it as a classic as say a 288 GTO or a 308 GTS does. The GT-R Might be faster than the 997TT around the 'ring but how may times have any of you been to the 'ring? and i am sure if you give Porsche engineers the extra 300lbs of electronic do-dads the the GT-R has they could make it go faster. And BTW, that car that went "faster" that the 997TT on the 'ring had R-Comp tires a totaly different suspension and a 100 octane in the tank (and most likely more boost), all things you dont get when you take delivery your GT-R

Kit_Chris

We'll agree to disagree, this car may not be the most inspired pencil stroke but it looks unlike anything to me, very mechanical in the robot-like way Japanese designers set out to make. Nissan's boss, Carlos Ghosn, specified that the look must follow Japanese heritage. Offended? In all due respect, I don't think the Japanese need to be told when they should feel "offended", the fact is this car was designed by free Japanese hands and people absolutely dig it there. Most Japanese cars are, indeed, generic, but this one is taken straight out of Gundam cartoons, and this fascination for high-tech living machines in popular Japanese culture is precisely what the GTR is made of, but Europeans would rather evaluate its looks by European standards, and that's the flaw at the heart of most GTR criticism IMO.

Regarding my comments about the NSX, a quasi consensus was achieved in the press when the car came out, it was acclaimed for many things, but severely criticized for being a failed Italian style design. It's been said countless times, Japanese are terrific for making generic looking automobiles, this time we'd rather blame Nissan guys for being too Japanese.

We can blame Nissan designers for bad taste, but not for lack of originality or authenticity, and that was my point.

For more on this, see this documentary segment, about 8 minutes in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnmZ7...eature=related

And also this segment, 2 minutes in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-A4E8...eature=related

Regards,
Chris

ScottMellor

Remember the "Oh no! I blew a tranny" thread.

JJayB

Like it or not, the GT-R warped the technology factor. You can rationalze all you want but I guarantee Weissach is testing a GT-R even though they didn't get the times Nissen did. Remember porsche makes more per car than any other manufactuer so maybe they should give the customer a little more for their money. So do you want a stripped 911 or a GT-R? BTW, try speed shifting a 993tt gear box, you'll soon find the shift forks look like pretzels. How many modular motors did porsche have to replace? So I wouldn't dis the GT-R's.
I'll always remember what the sales manager told me when I asked what the warrantee was on a '64 Plymouth 426 if I took it to the strip. "30 seconds or 30 feet which ever comes first."

DM993tt

I prefer a drivers car which is why it took me a long time move on from my '79 930, and 1 of many reasons I have not moved on from my 993TT. Let those who need all the techno garbage to help them drive better buy these ugly 3800lb computers with wheels.

dbf73

I've read bits and pieces about this at various times - is this info collected in any one place?

996racer

Well said!

Kit_Chris

I know you'll find my commentary annoying, but I see a huge contradiction in your statement, and while I agree that tactile enjoyment is the fundamental interest in automotive driving, computers have proved to accompany spirited driving in a perfectly acceptable way. The 993 is miles ahead of even the 964, many thought the fun factor was diluted away with its trick rear suspension layout which dramatically reduces snap oversteer and other handling traits that made the 911 a lively car, yet the 993 remains a standard of driver enjoyment.

I haven't driven the GTR, I haven't yet read anyone who has who thinks it's any less enjoyable because of its technology. In fact, only those who haven't driven it state it's no more than a "techno garbage". Most criticism is based on speculation (how it'll hold up, how reliable it'll be, how desirable it'll be, etc.), we really like to dislike this car!

Regards,
Chris

Kit_Chris

GTR transmission update, from reported by Motor Trend:

Shortly before we crowned the Nissan GT-R our 2009 Car of the Year, a controversy broke out surrounding the durability of both the transmission and the warranty. In today's Video Find, tuners at Samurai Speed managed to break their own GT-R transmission, but they set a few records along the way.

According to Samurai Speed, their GT-R has run a claimed world-record 10.53 sec pass in the quarter mile thanks to its "600+" horsepower at the wheels. After "100+" launches down the drag strip using the controversial Launch Control program, the team finally managed to blow up their transmission, but that hasn't got them down. The team says that they were searching for the limits of the transmission and are now working on getting stronger gears for their new box, suggesting that the failure occurred in one of the gears. The company hopes to break into the 9 sec. quarter-mile range once the car is rebuilt, this time with even more power.

Assuming the 100-plus drag strip launches and 600-plus wheel horsepower are accurate, this would seem to indicate that the GT-R's transmission is far more stout than it has been rumored to be. Reports of the gearbox's fragility have centered around the complaints of a member of the North American GTR Owners Club who's transmission was destroyed after being used with the Launch Control system too many times. It eventually came to light that he had been driving the car very hard and that the owner's manual and warranty clearly state that such damage would not be covered by the warranty, but the incident has cast a dark shadow over the GT-R. While Nissan has confirmed that it will not warranty damaged caused by abuse with the nanny systems turned off, the company has also considered removing the Launch Control feature from future models. Still, it would appear that Samurai Speed has proven the gearbox capable of handling more than the car's rated power under a fair amount of abuse, more than any street-driven car will likely see. Still, at $20,000 per transmission, racing a GT-R is not for the weak-of-wallet.

http://wot.motortrend.com/6407784/vi...-hp/index.html

JJayB

I thought it might be worth mentioning, when I first got my 993tt I wanted to run some acceleration times so I could verify some of the published times. I had the first generation of accelerometers and after my third 3500 rpm dump the clutch launch, managed to bend the imput shaft and fry the clutch. THREE launches! Porsche denied my warrantee claim! Something about it being abused! Shortly thereafter porsche came out with a improved input shaft and they reimbursed me.
Jimmy

KASH '95 993

The GTR is a great car...love my porsche but I would take the gtr and $60K over a 911TT any day.

azmurciev12

wow! this is an old thread. yeah i like the GTR too. but it has to be tuned to something like 700-800hp. i have one and i enjoy it. it's really a decent car you can drive everyday and have so much power on tap for a reasonable amount of money.

amerlemans

Well, its been just over two years since this post and not only are the GT-R's NOT sitting in yards for a fraction of the price............they are holding their values better than any modern (996, 997.1 and 997.2) Porsche.