0-200 km/h times
11-20-2007, 05:35 AM
#31
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Thanks from comments to everyone!
What comes to that "aero headlight conversion", one possibility is to use more sloped headlights from another car like from new beetle, that would save $$$$ compared to Porsche parts..
I found english version link to this "revanche"
http://www.cartronic-motorsport.de/e..._revanche.html
What comes to those Revanche's performance numbers.. especially to that 350km/h speed and only 565 HP at 6550 RPm.. I doubt them a little but I'll check that by physics law:
With normal shaped 993TT body (1.93x0.34) and quite lightened driving weight (1480kg) and AWD(trans.loss 17%) and driving asphalt road (rolling resistance 0.02),
that speed needs 0.7 ratio 6th gear and about 645hp (620Nm @ 7277rpm)...
and if lightened more, like total weight 1380kg, that still needs 640hp! So mass doesn't affect very much at those speeds.
If "shaving body" down to 0.32 Cd (and keep 1480kg) that means still 610hp @ 7277 rpm
But because that tuned 930 is 2WD(trans.loss 11%) and it may weight only that 1380kg total and have 0.32 Cd that actually means it is possible to achieve 350km/h when engine has 6550 rpm and 605Nm (565hp).
Am I right, Jean?
Edited: I just read now that english written revenge article. That car weights only 1150kg! So no doubt anymore
Jean, could you tell more about that white "HKS" 964 Porsche with 997 headlights? I like to ask advices and experiences from that owner. For me, those lights look ok, not too ugly compared to improved aerospecs
What gear changing time others have measured? My 0.26s from 3rd to 4th and 4th to 5th are quite good?
Have you done gear change less than 0.25 sec?
What comes to that "aero headlight conversion", one possibility is to use more sloped headlights from another car like from new beetle, that would save $$$$ compared to Porsche parts..
I found english version link to this "revanche"
http://www.cartronic-motorsport.de/e..._revanche.html
What comes to those Revanche's performance numbers.. especially to that 350km/h speed and only 565 HP at 6550 RPm.. I doubt them a little but I'll check that by physics law:
With normal shaped 993TT body (1.93x0.34) and quite lightened driving weight (1480kg) and AWD(trans.loss 17%) and driving asphalt road (rolling resistance 0.02),
that speed needs 0.7 ratio 6th gear and about 645hp (620Nm @ 7277rpm)...
and if lightened more, like total weight 1380kg, that still needs 640hp! So mass doesn't affect very much at those speeds.
If "shaving body" down to 0.32 Cd (and keep 1480kg) that means still 610hp @ 7277 rpm
But because that tuned 930 is 2WD(trans.loss 11%) and it may weight only that 1380kg total and have 0.32 Cd that actually means it is possible to achieve 350km/h when engine has 6550 rpm and 605Nm (565hp).
Am I right, Jean?
Edited: I just read now that english written revenge article. That car weights only 1150kg! So no doubt anymore
Jean, could you tell more about that white "HKS" 964 Porsche with 997 headlights? I like to ask advices and experiences from that owner. For me, those lights look ok, not too ugly compared to improved aerospecs
What gear changing time others have measured? My 0.26s from 3rd to 4th and 4th to 5th are quite good?
Have you done gear change less than 0.25 sec?
Last edited by Jussi; 11-20-2007 at 06:07 AM. Reason: that revenge 930 weight only 1150!
11-20-2007, 06:07 AM
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After that they build a "Evo"-stage and run 370 km/h i think that was near 850 PS if my mind don´t play tricks on me!
Greetings Christian
11-20-2007, 06:14 AM
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http://www.cartronic-motorsport.de/e..._revanche.html
"..Bi-Turbo motor with a near 710 hp (racing version)..
..the top recorded speed: 230 mph.."
That is 370km/h !
Read also this:
http://www.theautobahn.com/forum/sho...article_id=273
That Revanche Speedo would be nice upgrade. Anyone know if they sell it or where to get one?
11-20-2007, 06:26 AM
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They say here
http://www.cartronic-motorsport.de/e..._revanche.html
"..Bi-Turbo motor with a near 710 hp (racing version)..
..the top recorded speed: 230 mph.."
That is 370km/h !
Read also this:
http://www.theautobahn.com/forum/sho...article_id=273
http://www.cartronic-motorsport.de/e..._revanche.html
"..Bi-Turbo motor with a near 710 hp (racing version)..
..the top recorded speed: 230 mph.."
That is 370km/h !
Read also this:
http://www.theautobahn.com/forum/sho...article_id=273
Ein straßenzugelassener Hochgeschwindigkeits-Sportwagen auf Porsche 930 Basis. Neben technischen Novitäten, wie ein Bi-Turbo Motor mit annähernd 720 PS in der Sportversion, wurden bereits damals Karosserieformen im Styling des Jahres 1994 verwirklicht.
Die getestete Höchstgeschwindigkeit auf deutschen Straßen lag bei sagenhaften 348 Km/h, die Vmax der aktuellen Evo-Stufe bei 370 km/h!
Die getestete Höchstgeschwindigkeit auf deutschen Straßen lag bei sagenhaften 348 Km/h, die Vmax der aktuellen Evo-Stufe bei 370 km/h!
And i know Thomas Kirchhöfer and i believe all dates!
Greetings Christian
11-20-2007, 05:30 PM
#35
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Well since you seem to enjoy the article, let me shed some light on this car... Courtesy of my well connected German friend ...Thank you.
The engine of the Revanche project was not built by Mr. Kirschloffer, but by a Porsche wizzard from the Düsseldorf area, and only now starting to get known by the Porsche community. No need to state his name
He (the secret builder) is a maniac who always tried unusual solutions. On an aircooled twin-turbo engine, which was used in a sort of sports prototype car, he decided to adapt upside down mounted heads, in order to position them into the airstream and to ensure a better cooling. During an interview, he stated that he used two 3.2 Carrera DMEs for his biturbo - twininjected, twinplugged engines. Pretty sure that the Revanche used the same principle on its Carrera based motor.
The text speaks of a "Double-Bosch-Motronic" and of twin injection. During the Vmax test - as consequence of a deep wave - the right rear wheel damaged an oil line and so they were forced to stop and couldn't break the 350km/h barrier. They "ONLY" reached 348km/h; The version of the rallye racing test was quoted to have 565hp, but you never know. At the end of the text they announced a 600hp upgrade.
In the original Revanche catalogue, they speak of 615hp. The top version was quoted to have 720hp for a Vmax of about 370 km/h. It seems like it was never verified, but some of those cars seem to still exist. It would be interesting to find out more details. Compared to the dream cars of that era, those projects, including a few other monsters, were closer to space shuttles.
...Thank you.The engine of the Revanche project was not built by Mr. Kirschloffer, but by a Porsche wizzard from the Düsseldorf area, and only now starting to get known by the Porsche community. No need to state his name
He (the secret builder) is a maniac who always tried unusual solutions. On an aircooled twin-turbo engine, which was used in a sort of sports prototype car, he decided to adapt upside down mounted heads, in order to position them into the airstream and to ensure a better cooling. During an interview, he stated that he used two 3.2 Carrera DMEs for his biturbo - twininjected, twinplugged engines. Pretty sure that the Revanche used the same principle on its Carrera based motor.
The text speaks of a "Double-Bosch-Motronic" and of twin injection. During the Vmax test - as consequence of a deep wave - the right rear wheel damaged an oil line and so they were forced to stop and couldn't break the 350km/h barrier. They "ONLY" reached 348km/h; The version of the rallye racing test was quoted to have 565hp, but you never know. At the end of the text they announced a 600hp upgrade.
In the original Revanche catalogue, they speak of 615hp. The top version was quoted to have 720hp for a Vmax of about 370 km/h. It seems like it was never verified, but some of those cars seem to still exist. It would be interesting to find out more details. Compared to the dream cars of that era, those projects, including a few other monsters, were closer to space shuttles.
11-21-2007, 02:02 AM
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Well since you seem to enjoy the article, let me shed some light on this car... Courtesy of my well connected German friend ...Thank you.
The engine of the Revanche project was not built by Mr. Kirschloffer, but by a Porsche wizzard from the Düsseldorf area, and only now starting to get known by the Porsche community. No need to state his name
He (the secret builder) is a maniac who always tried unusual solutions. On an aircooled twin-turbo engine, which was used in a sort of sports prototype car, he decided to adapt upside down mounted heads, in order to position them into the airstream and to ensure a better cooling. During an interview, he stated that he used two 3.2 Carrera DMEs for his biturbo - twininjected, twinplugged engines. Pretty sure that the Revanche used the same principle on its Carrera based motor.
The text speaks of a "Double-Bosch-Motronic" and of twin injection. During the Vmax test - as consequence of a deep wave - the right rear wheel damaged an oil line and so they were forced to stop and couldn't break the 350km/h barrier. They "ONLY" reached 348km/h; The version of the rallye racing test was quoted to have 565hp, but you never know. At the end of the text they announced a 600hp upgrade.
In the original Revanche catalogue, they speak of 615hp. The top version was quoted to have 720hp for a Vmax of about 370 km/h. It seems like it was never verified, but some of those cars seem to still exist. It would be interesting to find out more details. Compared to the dream cars of that era, those projects, including a few other monsters, were closer to space shuttles.
...Thank you.The engine of the Revanche project was not built by Mr. Kirschloffer, but by a Porsche wizzard from the Düsseldorf area, and only now starting to get known by the Porsche community. No need to state his name
He (the secret builder) is a maniac who always tried unusual solutions. On an aircooled twin-turbo engine, which was used in a sort of sports prototype car, he decided to adapt upside down mounted heads, in order to position them into the airstream and to ensure a better cooling. During an interview, he stated that he used two 3.2 Carrera DMEs for his biturbo - twininjected, twinplugged engines. Pretty sure that the Revanche used the same principle on its Carrera based motor.
The text speaks of a "Double-Bosch-Motronic" and of twin injection. During the Vmax test - as consequence of a deep wave - the right rear wheel damaged an oil line and so they were forced to stop and couldn't break the 350km/h barrier. They "ONLY" reached 348km/h; The version of the rallye racing test was quoted to have 565hp, but you never know. At the end of the text they announced a 600hp upgrade.
In the original Revanche catalogue, they speak of 615hp. The top version was quoted to have 720hp for a Vmax of about 370 km/h. It seems like it was never verified, but some of those cars seem to still exist. It would be interesting to find out more details. Compared to the dream cars of that era, those projects, including a few other monsters, were closer to space shuttles.
11-21-2007, 05:58 AM
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@Jean: Is the picture with the white 964 and the 997 headlights photopshopped?
It looks a little bit like that with the "stretched" crest and the left fender has a "break" in the line!
Greetings Christian
It looks a little bit like that with the "stretched" crest and the left fender has a "break" in the line!
Greetings Christian
11-21-2007, 09:31 AM
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The white 964 narrowbody carrera is the car of Eddie Bello. It has a twin-turbo twin-plug engine with Garrett turbos and runs very high amounts of boost... It ran 219mph in the mile event in Texas and is claimed to do 160mph+ in the quartermile.
It is insanely fast, thanks to very high boost and its resulting amount of power, soft rear suspension for good grip, lightweight (2500lbs IMO), narrowbody configuration and narrowish tires.
http://s186.photobucket.com/albums/x...los_record.flv
It is insanely fast, thanks to very high boost and its resulting amount of power, soft rear suspension for good grip, lightweight (2500lbs IMO), narrowbody configuration and narrowish tires.
http://s186.photobucket.com/albums/x...los_record.flv
01-29-2008, 04:55 PM
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Jussi
A good German friend of mine who knows everything Porsche has reminded me of at least three other 911s with the DP sloped windscreen that have already been tested in magazines, besides the DP car itself, so I believe that there are quite a few more than 3 in the world. Back in the late 80s and early 90s these mods were being used quite often on some cars that wanted to beat records for their owners..
One of them was the Red 964/993 RS Tuning that we know about, another was a white 930 turbo that was built by the guru ex-partner of Reinhold Shmirler (before RS built the 993 bodied sloped windscreen) and it was the RUF Yellowbird killer back at the time (I have the article at home), and the third is the one here below that was used on a 930 turbo with all sorts of interesting mods
A good German friend of mine who knows everything Porsche has reminded me of at least three other 911s with the DP sloped windscreen that have already been tested in magazines, besides the DP car itself, so I believe that there are quite a few more than 3 in the world. Back in the late 80s and early 90s these mods were being used quite often on some cars that wanted to beat records for their owners..
One of them was the Red 964/993 RS Tuning that we know about, another was a white 930 turbo that was built by the guru ex-partner of Reinhold Shmirler (before RS built the 993 bodied sloped windscreen) and it was the RUF Yellowbird killer back at the time (I have the article at home), and the third is the one here below that was used on a 930 turbo with all sorts of interesting mods
Here is a pic of the car Jean refers to above, engine tuned by Pierre Ofsky who worked with RS with claimed 580hp and Guiness book of records top speed holder in the late 80s:
Out of idle curiosity
I asked DP about the cost of the sloped screen conversion and they said:"As far as the sloped front windscreen conversion is concerned it does not work on the 993 basis only with the old 911 models."
Now I am not about to argue with them but I thought I was sure that I saw a sliver 993 with the sloped screen which definately looked like a 993tt but ?
Just wondering how Jussi is getting along with his winter conversions - any updates or pics to share ?
01-30-2008, 07:06 AM
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02-12-2008, 03:04 AM
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Jean. is this the Bello car? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdm92VUkV7g
The white 964 narrowbody carrera is the car of Eddie Bello. It has a twin-turbo twin-plug engine with Garrett turbos and runs very high amounts of boost... It ran 219mph in the mile event in Texas and is claimed to do 160mph+ in the quartermile.
It is insanely fast, thanks to very high boost and its resulting amount of power, soft rear suspension for good grip, lightweight (2500lbs IMO), narrowbody configuration and narrowish tires.
http://s186.photobucket.com/albums/x...los_record.flv
It is insanely fast, thanks to very high boost and its resulting amount of power, soft rear suspension for good grip, lightweight (2500lbs IMO), narrowbody configuration and narrowish tires.
http://s186.photobucket.com/albums/x...los_record.flv
02-12-2008, 11:39 AM
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Jean. is this the Bello car? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdm92VUkV7g
But 1157 RWHP is too much to believe anyway..
3.6 Liter 2 valve OHC aircooler engine can't handle that much - at least it is my opinion
That hp reading means for example 8000 rpms and 2.2 bar boost level.. but maybe he's got pair of GT40Rs.. must be nice turbo lag
