hal m

I had the smoking problem as well and had my turbos rebuilt to hybrid specs. However, there is still significant oil residue remaining after replacement so that it takes a while to burn it all off. I have been smoke free since the second week after replacement. New power is great as well.

mjims

OK, No problem

I will take some pictures of the standard Pipes when I get home.

Should be interesting to see what the difference is.

mjims

Hi Guys,

Right I couldnt get a good shot of the current Oil pipes whilst on the car, but I did find one of the originals that I had kept.

As you can see that it is much straighter in comparison, the left side screws into the centre of the crankcases just behind the cam chain covers and then right runs across and down to the lowest part of the Turbo sump.

This is the right hand back as you look from behind the car.

My understanding of this then, is that, as the turbos sit lower than the engine and heads, the oil runs back down these oil pipes, fill up each turbo sump and run up into the turbo's central bearing housing finding a ground level across the entire engine and both Turbos. So as your turbos cool down the oil can take up some of the temperature. The downside is, as the turbo's bearings arnt a 'total' seal, oil eventually seaps through the bearings into the intake and exhaust turbine housings,which burns off when the car is started....blue smoke

Please, anyone correct me if this is wrong.

I assume that the Andial pipes create a 'high' point in the pipe and as such stop the oil running back down into the turbos. etc. etc.

My worry would be if there is no oil in the Turbos (or less of it) would this produce more heat damage and hence more wear on the turbos, at the expense of no blue smoke on startup? but for how long?

Please anyone correct me if I'm wrong.

anyone??

Just to confuse me more.. yes that's me...

I still think that these pipes are oil 'returns' yet they are listed as oil 'feed' pipes.

Kevin

Jim;

The turbo's need oil to cool the shafts. The minute that you shut down the engine, you will get the equalization effect. However, another equation is that the oil inlet lines will siphon oil into the turbo's. Time will tell how this fix works. I will post the actual lines on my 996TT engine..

grcdvm

Jim;

It has been 3 weeks since I have replaced those oil lines with the Andial type. Still zero smoke...Car runs terrific.

Bill S.

Ruf places one-way stop valves on all of their 993 Turbo R cars. These valves go on the top of the turbo. You can purchase these from Ruf.

I've had smoke once with a bad engine oil filter. Since replacing the filter, I've not seen any smoke. With the valves installed, I don't even see a small puff at startup.

Note that some engine oil filters could be bad. You may want to try another just to be sure. I've had two bad ones with the newest revision level. Also, the correct installation as printed on the filter is critical.

BTW, I worked with Andial on my problem in the beginning. They installed one-way valves in the lower lines. This did not fix the problem. Only a good engine oil filter and the Ruf one-way stop valves solved my problem.

mjims

Bill

have you got any photo's of the Ruf items, are they the same as the 996TT Pipes. I understand these have one way valves in them.

How much did they cost?

thanks for the info. Much appreciated.

Kevin, If you could post photos of your Pipes, this should make interesting viewing.

Thanks guys

grcdvm

It is my understanding that Andial's original lines were valved like Ruf"s. The concern was that if that valve ever malfunction everything down stream is at risk for failure. Hence the current design which prevents excess oil being siphoned and overflowing the turbos as the car sits over a period of time has proved to be a better fluid mechanic solution to the problem according to Andial......I think the fact that so many 993tt smoke to varing degrees on start up is why this question has alot of discussion. Good debate...usually leads to enlightment in one form or another.

mindovermotors

Hello,
I will share some personal expierence that we have had at our shop. We had four different 993 twin turbos come in our shop in the last year with excessive oil smoking on start up. All with different mileage, turbos, horsepower, etc.. In all four cases we installed "new dealer purchased porsche oil filters", and all four cars have never had a problem with smoking again.
I do believe the Andial oil lines can solve the problem but they are not addressing the problem correctly. The Porsche oil filters have a check valve in them to prevent the oil from draining back into the turbos while the car is sitting. The check valve in a mahle oil filter or a mann oil filter is not the same or sufficient to prevent the oil from draining back into the turbos.
Please note that Porsche oil filters can fail or even have the same problem out of the box new.
I have seen many porsche oil filters fail after six monthes , But it is still cheaper to replace oil filters, than turbos, oil lines, etc...
I have worked on cars that a delership has preformed thousands of dollar worth of unneeded repairs only to have an oil filter fix the problem.
When a turbocharger fails more often than not, the car smokes while running. not just on startup.
I believe that a lot of people have had turbo's replaced when there was nothing wrong at all.
Play in the turbine shaft is normal and not a sign of needed replacement.
There is specific max radial play numbers, and max end play numbers. that can be tested.
Many shops love to throw turbos on cars, good money job, or maybe lack of knowledge.
I had two of my customers come back from the race track this week with worries that they needed new turbos. Mechanics at the track had told them they probably needed turbos. Neither car has a turbo problem.
Hopefully that this will save you some timely and costly repairs.
Thanks for your time,
Chris Shaffer

grcdvm

Thanks Chris for the filter discussion. It has been well documented and I do feel that that is the first place to spend any money. I went through THREE oil filter changes [with proper torque] in a 2 week period, mind you with great discussion and debate with my certified porsche mechanic before I finally gave up on the oil filter cause. By the way it is only the smaller engine filter that has the check valve in it.

R993TBO

So, is there one small oil filter for both turbos or two (one for each turbo)?

mjims

There are Two Oil Filters for the 993TT

One Long, which fits in the rear wheel arch under the Oil Tank

One Short, which fits at the back of the engine next to the Hydraulic Pump.

There is no specific Filter for each Turbo.

Bill S.

Here's a picture of the Ruf oil stop valve placed on top of the turbo. These are added to all Ruf Turbo R cars. With a good engine (small) oil filter and these valves, there's no smoke at all, not even a puff on start-up.

BTW, notice the Ruf hose clamp.

Kevin

Bill, sorry that isn't the picture of the valve! That's a picture of the banjo fitting... The valve is alot longer, I'll post a picture of it... It is the same valve that is used on the 996TT engine..

Bill S.

I know. It's the best picture I could take without taking the car apart.

I didn't know the 996 TT also used these valves. Do they use the braided lines also?