Bill Verburg

sometimes pulling the engine will reduce the cost by reducing the # of labor hours

To get at all the potential leaks a lot of 'stuff' has to come off, It's going to be a balancing act as to hrs to R&R the motor vs hrs to pull all the surrounding 'stuff' to get at the leak in situ.

If the shop is doing the work and they are reputable I'd go w/ their recommendation.

bcameron59

Great question from sugarwood - what's your guy quoting to drop engine to fix the leaks? Never hurts to make sure you're getting a fair price and you'll get lots of data points here on the forum to help you decide.

And what's your personal bias - would you prefer to fix the immediate problem as economically as possible? Or invest more (perhaps a lot more) to deal with other potential issues and preventative maintenance at the same time?

If you are budget biased, you might want to get the usual suspects fixed without dropping the engine (lower valve covers and maybe chain covers, both accessible without dropping) and see how things are before deciding whether to go deeper.

If you want the peace of mind of having most or all potential or common issues dealt with, dropping the engine is going to make this a lot easier and probably cheaper than doing everything with the engine in the car. I am amazed what some guys can do without dropping the engine, but if you are a professional mechanic and have to do six of those things it will be faster and cheaper to drop it.

But if you decide to do more "while you're in there", first make sure you decide just how far you want to go and what you are willing to spend. Top end, clutch, seals, sensors etc can start to add up pretty quickly. Your cylinder bases might be leaking a tiny bit of oil; so if you want to make it perfect you will have to pull the cylinders and you may as well do the top end including valve guides, as well as piston rings. Well, at that point might as well split the case and do the bottom end at the same time. And why not upgrade to 3.8 or even 4.0 pistons and cylinders, swap out your cams, replace your DME with a programmable unit ... and now you're looking at well north of 50 grand to fix some oil leaks.

red67vert

Hi guys, was gone for the day came back to find all of your valid opinions.
Will try to answer your questions:
1) The price just to drop the engine and replace complete assembly was 1750
2)Plus parts and labor to do the gaskets upper lower and chain
3)no I don't want to throw bunch of money at it, but I would like things sorted. And I'm sure once it's out, he will suggest things like wires and other maintenance items that you guys have discussed, thinking it probably will be cheaper to address some of these items with the engine out, if you think that's a fair price.
4)I am normally a DIY guy, and it's killing you not to be able to do this. But it gets pretty cold here in Michigan and things have changed lifestyle wise, and I do not have the time to do it at this point.
5)we did a leak down at thePPI it passed with flying colors
6)he also offered to keep it there for most of the winter, because besides the work mentioned above doing a suspension upgrade. MO33/FSD
7)not sure about clutch, but it's probably original. I'll ask him about it next time we talk.
Thank you all for taking the time to offer your educated opinions, really appreciate it

orangecurry

1) is the car in a garage now?
2) are you going to use it over winter?

If it's a low use car, and it's in a garage, I'd change the lower two cover-gaskets myself, clean the exchangers/exhausts and monitor the leaks.

If it's outside and a low-use car, wait until the spring?

Either way, if you do this yourself, if you later have to drop the engine (because the leaks are just as bad), the lower covers won't need doing again.

pp000830

Check the clutch, ignition wires, plugs power steering belt. Wire condition to smog pump, vacuum actuators, lifter cartridges. If the engine has nt been out before these items are worth inspecting at the miles you have on the clock. Likely many if not all will end up needing replacement by 100 to 120k miles so they are worth considering for service when the engine is out.

axl911

If you decide to have it dropped, like others said do full service on it. Then little things like

- cleaning up the engine bay
- change engine sound pad
- powder coat your fans
- clean/powder coat the engine tins
- get new/sporty mufflers installed

They will make you VERY happy.

red67vert

Thank you guys so much, this info is like gold! Doing what you suggest almost makes it worthwhile, to drop it.
No one has commented on the $1750 charge to remove, and re-install....is it reasonable?

Mike J

Ok, it should take perhaps 8 hours of labour to drop and reinstall the engine, plus oil/fluids to be replaced, plus an alignment. So $1750 to me is still expensive. What is the shop rate?

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Thats not bad, considering the scope of the job and the mandatory alignment. Prevailing labor rates frame whether this is reasonable or not, depending on where you live.

red67vert

$110/HR. 16HR
Quote says Engine_Replace-Complete-Assembly Without transfer of parts-Without AC- Carrera
Does not include, oil change, that is separate item.
But does include alignment, I assume(but I'll inquire)

Mike J

16 hours just to drop and install an engine at a pro shop? Wow, i am in the wrong business!

PRSWILL

I disagree- this a LOT to drop the engine- especially for oil leaks.. I had mine in for a wheel balance last week and asked how much for a clutch replacement- doesn't need it, but I thought i'd prepare the "toy account" for the future. total of 15 hours-including replacement of clutch parts-to drop and replace from a VERY good shop here in town. Unless you're leaking from the rear main seal, I would not drop the motor. As stated- do the gaskets yourself- this is not a hard job. Lowers, even uppers aren't bad- and this is the time of year to do it.
Now, if you ARE leaking at rear main seal- you may need a clutch too so this begins to make sense. Just my opinion, but I would not be looking for a reason to drop the motor- that opens the door to a LOT of additional expense.

NYC993

Doesn't mean it takes them 16 hours. They just charge for 16 hours.

bcameron59

True dat. The book time for some jobs is ridiculous. I guess it covers them for the occasional job where everything goes wrong.

In fairness, mechanics have to make a living too. I don't mind paying book times for labour as long as they don't try to telll me I need stuff I don't.

fatmike

I'd be getting a second opinion. Dropping the engine in these cars isn't typical.

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