Sound Insulation
08-20-2003, 08:37 PM
#31
Originally posted by motion
My stomach is churning...
Best ways to make your 993 LOUDER:
1. RSR mufflers (or others)
2. Open or drilled airbox
3. Bald tires
4. Make sure its a Cab
5. Remove sound pad - 993s have one right?
6. Remove engine tray
7. ?
My stomach is churning...
Best ways to make your 993 LOUDER:
1. RSR mufflers (or others)
2. Open or drilled airbox
3. Bald tires
4. Make sure its a Cab
5. Remove sound pad - 993s have one right?
6. Remove engine tray
7. ?
Tom
'95 993
08-20-2003, 09:35 PM
#32
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Originally posted by motion
My stomach is churning...
Best ways to make your 993 LOUDER:
1. RSR mufflers (or others)
2. Open or drilled airbox
3. Bald tires
4. Make sure its a Cab
5. Remove sound pad - 993s have one right?
6. Remove engine tray
7. ?
My stomach is churning...
Best ways to make your 993 LOUDER:
1. RSR mufflers (or others)
2. Open or drilled airbox
3. Bald tires
4. Make sure its a Cab
5. Remove sound pad - 993s have one right?
6. Remove engine tray
7. ?
08-21-2003, 12:07 AM
#33
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noise reduction issues
Hello all,
Sorry, but as an individual I have to agree that excessive automotive noise is annoying: to comprehend this, try think of the kinds of automotive noises _you_ probably don't like, such as boombox cars or loud Harleys on your street. Then, try to put yourself in your neighbor's place when you drive by with _your_ supercups.
However, the reason I write this is to say that, as a physician, I must indicate that noise is dangerous to one's health. To each his own, of course, as its a free country. But I don't think that LexPilot is either stupid nor pathologically unsuited to drive our cars simply because he wants to reduce his personal level of noise exposure. I say this as a Porsche owner since about 1980 (starting with a 1966 912).
With regards to danger: An enlightening self-experiment is to drive in our cars for a half hour or so with one foam earplug and the other ear unprotected. I challenge everyone to try it. When you get out of your car, you'll almost certainly notice a bit of high frequency loss (temporary) in the unplugged ear. If you drive a cabriolet with the top down at simply legal speeds, you'll almost certainly notice substantial high frequency loss in the unplugged ear, with a longer duration before it resolves. This is your ear telling you that humans aren't evolved to accomodate prolonged exposure to high sound pressures.
Examples of dangerous levels of sound pressure (if repeated day in and out) would be 85 db exposure over 8 hours per day (an idling machine like a bulldozer or loud diesel truck at a construction site would produce this level) or 100 db for just one hour (unprotected use of a power drill, leaf blower, or lawnmower). Those of us driving cabriolets at expressway speeds with the top down and no ear protection are exceeding the latter standard, as are most people mowing their suburban lawns. Deafness (even partial) is one of the most disabling and frustrating (to the patient and family) problems I have encountered. I won't drive in an open top car without earplugs, nor will I mow my lawn without them for these reasons. If I use a chipper shredder or chainsaw, I actually use _both_ earplugs and noise-reducing headphones. Does anyone who's getting older (like me) noting that they have tinnitus (soft ringing in the ears) at night when everything in the house is quiet? The most common cause is cumulative exposure to noise in our industrial society.
Therefore, I certainly won't cast any stones at LexPilot about noise. He's got a good idea that I've actually considered myself. In the case of my Vanagon (a Synchro Camper!) I plan to dissassemble the interior this winter and install some 3M noise deadning material before the next camping season. I don't personally plan to further insulate my 993 C4 coupe, but on the other hand I'm not going to remove my undertray or install louder mufflers.
Call me crazy....
Mike Lincoln MD
Associate Professor of Medicine, U. of Utah SOM
Sorry, but as an individual I have to agree that excessive automotive noise is annoying: to comprehend this, try think of the kinds of automotive noises _you_ probably don't like, such as boombox cars or loud Harleys on your street. Then, try to put yourself in your neighbor's place when you drive by with _your_ supercups.
However, the reason I write this is to say that, as a physician, I must indicate that noise is dangerous to one's health. To each his own, of course, as its a free country. But I don't think that LexPilot is either stupid nor pathologically unsuited to drive our cars simply because he wants to reduce his personal level of noise exposure. I say this as a Porsche owner since about 1980 (starting with a 1966 912).
With regards to danger: An enlightening self-experiment is to drive in our cars for a half hour or so with one foam earplug and the other ear unprotected. I challenge everyone to try it. When you get out of your car, you'll almost certainly notice a bit of high frequency loss (temporary) in the unplugged ear. If you drive a cabriolet with the top down at simply legal speeds, you'll almost certainly notice substantial high frequency loss in the unplugged ear, with a longer duration before it resolves. This is your ear telling you that humans aren't evolved to accomodate prolonged exposure to high sound pressures.
Examples of dangerous levels of sound pressure (if repeated day in and out) would be 85 db exposure over 8 hours per day (an idling machine like a bulldozer or loud diesel truck at a construction site would produce this level) or 100 db for just one hour (unprotected use of a power drill, leaf blower, or lawnmower). Those of us driving cabriolets at expressway speeds with the top down and no ear protection are exceeding the latter standard, as are most people mowing their suburban lawns. Deafness (even partial) is one of the most disabling and frustrating (to the patient and family) problems I have encountered. I won't drive in an open top car without earplugs, nor will I mow my lawn without them for these reasons. If I use a chipper shredder or chainsaw, I actually use _both_ earplugs and noise-reducing headphones. Does anyone who's getting older (like me) noting that they have tinnitus (soft ringing in the ears) at night when everything in the house is quiet? The most common cause is cumulative exposure to noise in our industrial society.
Therefore, I certainly won't cast any stones at LexPilot about noise. He's got a good idea that I've actually considered myself. In the case of my Vanagon (a Synchro Camper!) I plan to dissassemble the interior this winter and install some 3M noise deadning material before the next camping season. I don't personally plan to further insulate my 993 C4 coupe, but on the other hand I'm not going to remove my undertray or install louder mufflers.
Call me crazy....
Mike Lincoln MD
Associate Professor of Medicine, U. of Utah SOM
08-21-2003, 12:24 AM
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Mike, Thanks for the useful information. You probably won't find too many people on this board who are overly concerned about temporary or permanent high-frequency hearing loss due to the beautiful sound of their 993s. I guess some things in life just aren't worth giving up. I'd say whisky and strippers fall into that category, also
08-21-2003, 12:36 AM
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Hi,
I agree that "to each his own". I was only prompted to comment because I saw an old patient of mine a few weeks ago when he was into the ER. He had become increasingly and then profoundly deaf due to working on the deck of an aircraft carrier years ago. When I was seeing him several years ago, he was deaf as a stone and pretty much completely disabled. Luckily, he told me in the ER that he has responded well to his recent cochlear implant and can now hear again, after a fashion. But he'll never appreciate music again, he said, which was a great sorrow to him, because the state of the technology is not adequate.
A simple set of earplugs, and attention to the noise factor, can prevent some of us from inadvertently suffering the same fate....
Best, Mike
I agree that "to each his own". I was only prompted to comment because I saw an old patient of mine a few weeks ago when he was into the ER. He had become increasingly and then profoundly deaf due to working on the deck of an aircraft carrier years ago. When I was seeing him several years ago, he was deaf as a stone and pretty much completely disabled. Luckily, he told me in the ER that he has responded well to his recent cochlear implant and can now hear again, after a fashion. But he'll never appreciate music again, he said, which was a great sorrow to him, because the state of the technology is not adequate.
A simple set of earplugs, and attention to the noise factor, can prevent some of us from inadvertently suffering the same fate....
Best, Mike
08-21-2003, 12:54 AM
#36
Drifting
To each his own I guess, but if I were my neighbors and I saw my car drive by, I would quickly dash outside to listen to the intoxicating exhaust note! I have Mille Miglia's which are much louder than RSR's, but I still find them too quiet. I think I going to try some cat bypasses. Personally, I think it has a bit to do with being an enthusiast or not. I get an adrenaline rush listening to engines, and 993's with supercups are (1) not as loud as most Harley's with obnoxious pipes and (2) no offense to Harley people- but Harley's suck, there is nothing cool about them. If I am somewhere with my dad, I get him to drive my car and I take his so I can listen to mine (and watch it) drive down the road! Something makes it totally different "in action." Tire noise does suck, but I am sure it is not worse than mine (worn Yokohama AVS) and mine does not bother me at all (NOT intended as a flame to lexipilot, just my opinion). You only live once- good ears won't do me any good when I am dead, so why not listen to what you love while you can (of course- that is OT since none of us love tire noise).
08-21-2003, 02:11 AM
#37
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My car has Supercups exhausts installed by PO. Till recently I used the car only for weekends getaway trips.....Two months ago I decided to use my 993 as a daily driver...Almost a year of ownership of this car....but the daily usage of it is quite a different from a "weekends only" car. At first it became quite evident that the mufflers shaking inside of the supercups are quite annoying ...so...i removed them...removing them definitely made the noise to go away...but another problems raised..the sound level...which made me feel the pressure in my left ear...it would take only 10 minutes of driving for my ear to start to feel that pressure....which lasts for two hours....easily...the only way to eliminate it is to replace the supercups mufflers to the factory ones which I still have).....Just today ...as a test...I put the sound protective headphones while driving the car with supercups...Those headphones tend to dump the low-frequency noise only...and I was able to hear ALL the sound that comes from the Supercups...THERE ARE A LOT OF THEM!!!! and they don't seem to be HEALTHY for your ears! THE RESONANCE SO DAMAGING...in headphones it sounds terrible....just terrible...This product should be forbidden for resale. PERIOD. Or they should be used only with RED INKED WARNING saying that those exhausts cause PERMANENT UNRECOVERABLE DAMAGE TO YOUR EARS!
Now do you wanna buy my supercups?
Now do you wanna buy my supercups?
08-21-2003, 08:07 AM
#38
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Mike,
I find it difficult to view excessive tire drone as a serious health risk.
There is such a thing as over-sanitizing our life experiences in the name of eliminating all risk. Ever see the cartoon with two men in their 80's or 90's sitting in their wheelchairs in an assisted care facility? One says to the other, "I'm glad we never did anything fun or dangerous so that we could be around to enjoy this."
Carpe diem!
I find it difficult to view excessive tire drone as a serious health risk.
There is such a thing as over-sanitizing our life experiences in the name of eliminating all risk. Ever see the cartoon with two men in their 80's or 90's sitting in their wheelchairs in an assisted care facility? One says to the other, "I'm glad we never did anything fun or dangerous so that we could be around to enjoy this."
Carpe diem!
Last edited by Anir; 08-21-2003 at 08:47 AM.
08-21-2003, 09:14 AM
#39
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Originally posted by Anir
Mike,
I find it difficult to view excessive tire drone as a serious health risk.
There is such a thing as over-sanitizing our life experiences in the name of eliminating all risk. Ever see the cartoon with two men in their 80's or 90's sitting in their wheelchairs in an assisted care facility? One says to the other, "I'm glad we never did anything fun or dangerous so that we could be around to enjoy this."
Carpe diem!
Mike,
I find it difficult to view excessive tire drone as a serious health risk.
There is such a thing as over-sanitizing our life experiences in the name of eliminating all risk. Ever see the cartoon with two men in their 80's or 90's sitting in their wheelchairs in an assisted care facility? One says to the other, "I'm glad we never did anything fun or dangerous so that we could be around to enjoy this."
Carpe diem!
I love the sound of 911 (among other great things) and I like it quite loud for sure. However, when I do a long trip (i.e. 3 hours to Sebring) I wear earplugs or listen music with my mp3 player (w/ headphones) and my son have to wear them, no matter what he says (on long trips).
Come on NineNine3,
Harley's DO NOT suck and there is plenty cool about them.
You can say you don't like them but to say they suck...
There are many Harley owners who just buy them & try to be cool (sound familiar to Porsche owners?) but don't blame bikes for that (if you are blaming them for that).
If you don't "see" the beuty of that V-2's sound, well, some peole don't "see" the beuty of flat-6's sound either.
08-21-2003, 12:02 PM
#40
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Talk about Off Topic! 
Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. And I behold little beauty in Hogs either. Give me a screaming four anyday (Sigh, sold mine years ago...), or if it must be a twin, the sound of a Duc....now THESE are beautiful....second to our flat six, of course
But in deference to Petu, I do find something attractive in some of the "cleaner" (Spartan?) Hogs. The 883 Sporter comes immediately to mind.
Anir, You hit a chord with me! "Sanitizing" one's life is the equal and opposite evil to living a self-destructive life, IMHO. There is too much to miss and MUCH to enjoy while we still are capable. If I were playing absolute safe cards, I'd still be saving for the rainy day while Porscheless. Thank goodness for my wife who told me to "just get it (the 993)" before I'm too old to enjoy it. Here's to Carpe Diem, AND to good wives!!!
Edward
Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. And I behold little beauty in Hogs either. Give me a screaming four anyday (Sigh, sold mine years ago...), or if it must be a twin, the sound of a Duc....now THESE are beautiful....second to our flat six, of course
But in deference to Petu, I do find something attractive in some of the "cleaner" (Spartan?) Hogs. The 883 Sporter comes immediately to mind.
Anir, You hit a chord with me! "Sanitizing" one's life is the equal and opposite evil to living a self-destructive life, IMHO. There is too much to miss and MUCH to enjoy while we still are capable. If I were playing absolute safe cards, I'd still be saving for the rainy day while Porscheless. Thank goodness for my wife who told me to "just get it (the 993)" before I'm too old to enjoy it. Here's to Carpe Diem, AND to good wives!!!
Edward
08-21-2003, 05:13 PM
#41
After years of standing in front of a Marshall stack without ear plugs, I can vouch for the seriousness of tinnitus. I am fortunate that I still have some high freq sensitivity, as I "roll off" around 14kHz, but the ringing is noticeable when it's quiet. Also, I always wear ear plugs when riding my motorcycle, talk about wind noise!
If I had to do it all over again....I'd still do it though.
If I had to do it all over again....I'd still do it though.
