NYC993

-I stall in reverse all the time, still can't get used to it.
- A spoiler light is fine, but have to make sure the wing motor still works. Many here disable auto operation to preserve the wing motor/drive
-From what I understand, suspension should be replaced at 70-90k miles, surprised it is original.
-what about steering rack, that can be on its way out and can be expensive to fix
-swirl marks are ok, the paint back then wasn't what it is today, and if its DD you should not care too much.
-with 140k miles you should see quite a bit of wear and tear.
-PPI with car like this is a must including compression and leak down tests.
- make sure CEL works but is not on.
-I would not pay more than 30k for this, car so offer 25k and subtract for any discovered items.
- I've seen similar condition NBs going for low 20's but no way of knowing the whole story.
-Considering it's basically one owner car is a big plus IMO.

Foxtastic

Morning folks. Thanks for all the responses already! Just trying to get out the door to work and will respond in more detail then, but so many good comments. The fundamental one is whether the mechanicals are in the same state as the cosmetics. The owner isn't short on cash and appreciates 911's (he has a '06 997 and the C2S hasn't been driven much since apparently). The 'full engine' was done around that time in prep to be passed on to his kids. The car is being given to his son but his son would rather have the cash so is selling it.
There is no asking price - just sensible offers, which the son was requesting before showing the car. I said, based on mileage $30-35k, but have obviously, having seen it, am thinking NYC993's suggested $25 k is more appropriate, and less depending on PPI results.
How much would the suspension take to sort, $3-4k or nearer $5k?

Regarding the reference to the Viper Green RS clone, I'd love that for a weekend car... Not sure about it's applicable as a DD and the occasional client facing meeting!

Falcondrivr

If the PPI comes back clean on the mechanicals, get it for under $30k. You can fix all the cosmetic stuff and throw a set of Konis on it for around $5k and have a nice driver. Don't be scared of high miles on 993s as long as the oil has been changed regularly.

branman

Hey Foxtastic,

I saw this car advertised and was curious about checking it out since it's in my neighborhood. I think the consensus is that you need to get a PPI done first - I used Tom Amon (http://www.mobileworkswest.com/) and was pleased with his assessment. I would think if this was a NB car that it would go for $25k so I would think if the PPI comes back positive on the mechanicals that low $30's for a WB is fair. I went the route of buying a car that had some minor needs but don't mind doing the work myself. Also consider that if you plan on using this as a DD (as I am doing with my 993) if you buy a "perfect" car you may be paranoid about mileage/parking/valet's/etc. FWIW there was a nice '98 C2S at Mohr Imports a few months ago I missed out on with 79k miles, 2 owners, no accidents, silver over grey that went for $42.5k.

doberdog

I picked up my car just over a year ago for a great price but it needed many of the same things, it has the same colour interior.
Mechanically it was up to date with top end rebuild, clutch and new brakes. The body also had been painted in spots due to minor parking lot incidents but I'm happy not to worry about it all the time. I had a garage queen before and this one is more fun knowing it isn't a princess.
I just picked away at the things that needed done. Got a used black hand brake and shifter, plus a steering wheel. All of these parts cost me about $1000.00 I had the seat bolsters repaired at a very good shop and had them install the parts and also change the centre console to black. It looks fantastic. Total interior update, with parts, cost about $1500.00.
The wheels you can pick up used for under $1000 and suspension will cost $2000-$3000 depending on the system you go for.
Get it checked. If it is in good mechanical shape, use the cosmetic stuff to knock the price down further. The other stuff you can work on.
Mine is where I want it now but I picked away at the things that needed done over the past year+. Just last week I updated the stereo....

holsen12

Neglected 993’s are expensive to bring back. Suspension being ‘original’ translates as ‘wholesale replace’. That means not just shocks. You’re looking at top-mounts, new bushings all around, springs, drop links etc. Think $3-4K in HW, and $1K++ in labor for a Bilstien HD level set-up which would include a quality alignment. If there are any torn boots or other issues, up the budget considerably. Those $15 rubber parts seem cheap until you understand the labor to put them in, and ‘original condition’ also means an extensive ‘while you’re in there’ list. A sexy, but troubled, 993 can reach much deeper into your pocket then you think.

The motor being recently ‘rebuilt’ looks suspicious to me, the fasteners seem to have their cadmium plating missing… if they did a re-build and didn’t use new fasteners, I’d be super suspicious. Talk to his mechanic, but certainly have someone else do the PPI.

The oil gauge being pegged way past the top of the scale is curious.

The interior looks pretty beat, but the suggested budget for fixing that looks in-line. Consider a re-dye job…

I bought a ’97 C4S (~80Kmi.) from a neglectful owner for the price point being suggested (near $30K) But it had many options like HB seats, Litronics, Motorsound, Alu package, TurboS spoilers, etc. Within 6mos I put another $27K into it. I expected to ‘revive’ it, but it still went deeper than I anticipated. Much was wrong with it from a blown stereo, rotted speakers, burnt out instrument lights to ‘original suspension’, paint issues, etc... Even the rims had 5 flat spots on 4 wheels. Redoing the undersides cost me $8K which included brake work to un-seize the spring-plates in the ‘big red’ calipers. The rest was dropped into the engine. All the work was done by a high quality shop near Boston. At least I can look forward to many miles of satisfaction knowing the car has a solid base-line.

All that aside, it’s a helluva ride and fantastic fun. Good luck, but getting a quality 993 up-front has much to recommend it.

cgfen

VERY unlikely you will have the opportunity to buy the car for $25K, but if you do, don't pass and good on you.

cgfen

Pretty car, is your midnight or iris blau?

H.H.Chinn

From these photographs this car looks pretty much worse for wear. With all of the mechanical work done, the mechanic doing your PPI along with documentation for the work done previously should provide a pretty good idea of what you have in store. There will be a time when all of these cars will require restoration to some level depending on how well it was cared for. However restoration done properly is not an inexpensive proposition.

The interior bits are pretty straight forward remove and replace and can be done in time while you can still enjoy driving the car.

The body prep and paint is the most expensive item you would be faced with, but again it's not something that you need to do immediately.

All in all if you can get it at a fair price and you like periodic projects, it can be worth it in the long term as it is a 993 C2S to put in the effort to bring it back to top form.

holsen12

Hi cgfen -

It's 'Ocean Blue', which seems to change color depending on how the light hits it. Sometimes it has a 'purple' hue to it, sometimes more metalic, and at night it's almost 'black'.

The color sticker in the trunk says: 3AZ 9 4 'Ozean Blau Metallic'.

Our 993's look like twins !

inkatouring

If he'll take $25k and you pass on it, let me know. Yes, as holsen12 points out there can be a lot of work to revive a neglicted car, but the obvious things on this -- interior and suspension -- are easy and not wallet-killers. Plus, they're both potential for a nice upgrade (996 sport seats, steering wheel, and a suspension are the first things I'd do to a 993 anyway). If the motor was done by a reputiable shop and the clutch and tranny are solid, the rest is not so bad....

fatmike

I wouldn't consider that car - too many red flags. Could turn out great, but why take a chance?



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Foxtastic

You hit my nail on it's head here. My preference is to find a more sorted car, with the options and maintenance work I want all ready done. I'd likely get a better deal as the cost of those improvements would have depreciated somewhat. The downside is I can't move as quickly on a $45-$50k purchase as that's the top of my budget and the funds are tied up a little ($18k in the car I'm currently driving!). The Black C2S could overcome that hurdle, so long as it's not a total money pit!... Which I guess is where the PPI comes in.

I did take a bit of video footage as well, which I just uploaded to youtube:

General walk around -
Instruments -
Test drive - (the gyros in my iPhone clearly didn't realise the phone was on it's side... please don't crick your necks...)

Also, apologies for feeble dialogue, I was using it to remind myself of what I saw, felt etc.


Anyway, I guess my biggest concerns relate to the points holsen12 calls out regarding the engine rebuild and why the oil gauge is off the top.

I'm going to look at a 60k mile C4S this afternoon - will report back if it's nice and if out of my price range will pass on the details!
I'm currently thinking that I'll check whatever paperwork there is on the Black C2S, float my offer price assuming mechanics are sound (and pending a PPI) and if that's palatable with the seller have a PPI done (probably using your recommendation branman).
I share the findings and if I pass I let you know inkatouring.

Thanks for all your help again folks... I never thought buying a 993 could be so all-consuming!

mongrelcat

re: the car in the OP, I'd move on no matter what the price.

iPhone, lol. Certainly not your fault. There are a lot of reasons Android has 80% of market-share.

Best of luck in finding a good car, be patient.

Kiwiinchicago

I certainly enjoyed the video's - car seems to go well. Best of luck. Keep us posted.