mgianzero

Okay guys, I've been setting up my new speakers in my doors. I'll show you what I've got, but I need some input.

I rigged up a system to mount my Focal 165 KRX2's. The 6 1/2" subwoofers fit perfectly using this technique and provides some really nice bass (no need for woofers for me as this is plenty with this setup.) Perhaps I'll submit all my photos as a little DIY at some point.

However, here's my problem ...

I wanted to reuse my stock hi-fi speaker covers like most everyone to keep a somewhat stock experience. I've tried the technique that a lot of rennlisters and even professional stereo installers recommend by placing tweeters inside the double speaker enclosure (behind old subwoofer/midrange grille). You can see my picture below. But I find this really compromises the quality of the nice Focal tweeters. Am I missing something here? Are people really wanting to use this midrange spot for a tweeter and really feel that they have good separate sound?

To me, the tweeters really sound best when they are separated more from the subwoofers (Focal even recommends a 20cm vertical separation b/w subwoofer and tweeter in their manual.) I believe my system really sounds ideal when using the stock tweeter location on top of door, but, obviously the Focal tweeters won't fit like many of us have discovered.

So do I just keep a pure stock look by placing my tweets behind my hi-fi cover and not really hear my hi's, or do I just go ahead and cutout a 2" hole in my door like I've seen others do and put the Focal in the stock spot on my door? If I cut the hole, I believe I can still "hide" my Focal tweets behind the stock tweeter grill so the car still "looks" stock from the outside although it is not fully reversible should I ever sell the car. I also know it's not Kosher to cut metal on these cars, but I do stand to lose a little bit of weight and we all want lighter cars, right!

Thoughts?

Tonydec

The Focals don't fit in the stock pods as you found. My installer made new pods to fit the Focals, looks stock, same angled placement and no cutting to the panels was done. They don't look exactly like the stock ones, but unless you look at them side by side you wouldn't know.

mgianzero

Tony can you take a snapshot of your tweeters so that I can see what you mean?

Thanks -

Marc

Tonydec

They are the K2 tweeters. I tried putting the pics here, but files were too big. PM me your email and I'll send them that way.

serval

I am going for the same set-up but will install the tweeters high, at a point 1/3 - 2/3 (left-right). I also found that I needed to use some strategically placed dynamat strips to dampen the excesive vibration from the mid-woofers. My choice was easy because a) properly cut and re-zinc-ed hole (is that a word?) should pose no issues, and b) themain reason for buying Focal was to get great sound so any location compromises would defeat that.

mgianzero

I agree with you. If we are going to upgrade out cars with superior equipment (such as the Focals) then they should be placed in the correct location.

What do you mean by 1/3 - 2/3 (left-right)? Can you show me exactly (with a photo) where you are planning on placing your tweeters? How do you re-zinc a hole? You mean paint with primer?

I've looked at the door underlying structure a bit and, if you ask me, it appears that the best place (where there is enough door depth AND does not appear to impair the door structural integrity) is exactly where the tweeters are now. Besides, I believe the location of the tweeters where they are is strategically a good place for sound, provided you can maintain the same angle towards the driver. That's why I am trying to reuse the stock tweeter cover to direct the sound.

But I've heard others on the forum say the tweeter location is not ideal. And why is that?

serval

I will definitely send some pictures, but I am travelling till the end of May, so a bit of a wait

Location wise, moving the tweeter high-up on the door (vertically), and placed 1/3 towards you horizontally from the front of the panel. And contrary to popular belief it should not be oriented to fire towards the driver. High sound waves travel faster than mid and bass waves, resulting in out-of-time delay coherence in reaching the driver's ear. That is why a lot of speaker home speaker manufacturers either angle their speakers bottom to to or stagger driver locations vertically.

In a car, the issue is more complicated due to non-central listening position and hard-reflective surface. After the install, I plan to use correction software (my deck allows that) which consists in altering levels and cross-over points for each driver according to an in-car microphone that will measure all output.

There are zinc kits on the market that would allow you to seal the wound I'll look it up.

The text above comes with my apologies to the purists for whom the music of the engine is more than enough

mgianzero

Okay, so what you are saying is the tweeter location on the door the way it is now (stock position) is actually a good location? Because, according to what you said, I measured things and the "rough" measurements show that the door panel is about 36" long (from the farthermost point forward - the door shape in the front is somewhat triangular) and the tweeter is about 12" from the front furthermost point as well as 10" above the subwoofer. (Please see my attached pic).

I apologize but I do not understand your comments regarding the angle to be set by the tweeter. You are saying you should point them down to my toes or stagger them how, vertically or horizontally?

I must confess that when I turn the tweeters straight perpendicular from the doors or down, I seem to lose a lot of the sound of the tweeters. By same reasoning, when I place my tweeters very low in the same hi-fi box as the subwoofer, I can barely hear the highs from the tweeters. Am I missing something?

serval

The location on your last picture is spot on. I thought you were going to mount it next the mid driver as shown in your first pictures

The issue with car audio is that you don't have the same flexibility,in controlling sound waves reflections by strategically positioning absorbing materials to tame brightness. You can only control vibrations using dynamat or equivalent and bring all waves in time phase using electronics. The intentmis not to hear highs, mids and lows on their own but rather create a sound stage that will seem to emanate from right in front of you with your ears telling you that the source is somewhere midway on your hood.

I am travelling right now for an extended leg, but will be returning late May. I will then work on my set-up and if you'd like will send you exact positioning and cross-over points. One advantage with cars is that while our living rooms may differ, our 993s are realiably similar

mgianzero

^^^^ You make some strong points. ^^^^

For right now I am going to mount my tweeter in my old mid-driver spot simply because I have the room for it without really effecting the exterior appearance (looks all stock) as well as it's completely reversible.

I will re-entertain the more permanent place (including drilling a hole in the door metal) for my tweeter at a later time. I look forward to your more detailed explanation of how to do this once your time permits in late May.

Thank you for all your comments -

Marc