What do you guys think of seam welding?
09-18-2011, 01:55 PM
#46
Seared
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
09-18-2011, 03:14 PM
#47
Rennlist Member
Mark, we are talking about the same bars. I said crossbar, you said longitudinal. I never presumed my head would hit the front hoop or the main hoop if I am restrained. Any 911 with a full cage has had the longitudinals mere inches from my head, well in range of an impact, which could be a function of my size. Enough empirical evidence for me! 
I'm of the opinion I'm further ahead in safety with my roll bar than I am in a stock car.
I'm of the opinion I'm further ahead in safety with my roll bar than I am in a stock car.
I only used the A-pillars as an example. Your statements, save for your assertion that your head will hit your main hoop, are pure conjecture, just as mine are. My main hoop is very far away from my head (I sit super-close to the steering wheel), as are the main hoops of almost all of the cup cars I've seen. Regardless, the real issue is the longitudinal bar near the top of the doors where I can hit my head.
This reminds me of roll bar threads on Miata.net where the available roll bars are close to the back of the head, so the choice is to run with zero rollover protection, thereby guaranteeing death or paralysis in a roll over versus having the back of your head potentially hit the roll bar. I made my choice and run a roll bar in my Miata.
For camlob, the choices are similar but different. We're talking about a car with a roll cage versus a car without a roll cage and, in a crash, I'll take the caged car over the non-caged car, all day, every day. Cross an intersection and get T-boned? I'll take the caged car. Lose control and back into a jersey barrier at an angle? I'll take the caged car. Flip the car? I'll take the caged car.
I'm not saying that there aren't safety compromises with the cage, for the tubing may cause fractures. But I always find it interesting that people seem to ignore the fact that behind the alcantara or leather or plastic is cold, hard steel that can {{{conjecture}}} do as much or nearly as much damage as an SFI-padded tube. Yes, I have no data.
I agree that this can be a problem, but I'd love to see data to support it. I still maintain that I'd rather be in my caged 993 than my multi air bagged Sequoia
This reminds me of roll bar threads on Miata.net where the available roll bars are close to the back of the head, so the choice is to run with zero rollover protection, thereby guaranteeing death or paralysis in a roll over versus having the back of your head potentially hit the roll bar. I made my choice and run a roll bar in my Miata.
For camlob, the choices are similar but different. We're talking about a car with a roll cage versus a car without a roll cage and, in a crash, I'll take the caged car over the non-caged car, all day, every day. Cross an intersection and get T-boned? I'll take the caged car. Lose control and back into a jersey barrier at an angle? I'll take the caged car. Flip the car? I'll take the caged car.
I'm not saying that there aren't safety compromises with the cage, for the tubing may cause fractures. But I always find it interesting that people seem to ignore the fact that behind the alcantara or leather or plastic is cold, hard steel that can {{{conjecture}}} do as much or nearly as much damage as an SFI-padded tube. Yes, I have no data.
I agree that this can be a problem, but I'd love to see data to support it. I still maintain that I'd rather be in my caged 993 than my multi air bagged Sequoia
09-18-2011, 03:45 PM
#48
Driving drunk limber freaky girls home from the club with a pocket full of 12" zip ties, I'll take the caged car.
Driving in Jurrasic Park with a trunk full of rib eyes, I'll take the caged car
Driving in Jurrasic Park with a trunk full of rib eyes, I'll take the caged car
09-18-2011, 03:56 PM
#49
Rennlist Member
Ed, when I referred to longitudinal bars, I was talking about the bars that connect the B-pillars (aka main hoop behind the seats) with the A-pillars that are located "above" the door frames.
09-18-2011, 04:22 PM
#51
Rennlist Member
At any rate, the bars you note are what scares me when I sit in a Porsche with a cage, as my head could hit in the case of a side impact. I am tall, as stated previously, and that could affect my opinion on a full cage in a street car.
