OT - MBZ E AMG or Audi S4 DD
05-08-2010, 10:47 AM
#16
Rennlist Member
The S4 and the W211 E55\E63 is not really a comparable comparison. These cars are worlds apart in performance and size and target different buyers and market sectors.
After I recently drive the 420hp RS4 I found it not as fast as my friend's mildly modified Mitsubishi EVO VIII let alone my E55.
The S4 has a great cabin as most modern Audis but the E63\E55 does as well. Most of the E55\E63 AMGs have the Dynamic seats which are amazing, probably the best set of seats to be fitted to any modern car for comfort (long distance, travel, spirited driving, traffic and quality of material as well) especially if you get lucky and buy one that has the A\C option that blows through the seats (cooling).
As mentioned the brakes on these cars are simply amazing and beautiful to look at, most of my friends are drawn to their sheer girth.
I really feel the S4 and even the rare RS4 is well behind the AMG products.
Yasin
After I recently drive the 420hp RS4 I found it not as fast as my friend's mildly modified Mitsubishi EVO VIII let alone my E55.
The S4 has a great cabin as most modern Audis but the E63\E55 does as well. Most of the E55\E63 AMGs have the Dynamic seats which are amazing, probably the best set of seats to be fitted to any modern car for comfort (long distance, travel, spirited driving, traffic and quality of material as well) especially if you get lucky and buy one that has the A\C option that blows through the seats (cooling).
As mentioned the brakes on these cars are simply amazing and beautiful to look at, most of my friends are drawn to their sheer girth.
I really feel the S4 and even the rare RS4 is well behind the AMG products.
Yasin
Last edited by slownrusty; 05-09-2010 at 01:13 AM.
05-08-2010, 01:53 PM
#18
Also, an old A4 isn't comparable to a new S4, and an old E-class isn't the same as a new 6.3 E-class either.
One could make an argument that comparing an old A4 to a new S4 or your ownership of an old E-class to a new 6.3 is ignorant as well, and really, it's just your opinion.
For example, whatever benefits the 6.3 has over the S4 performance-wise are mitigated by the fact that the E63 looks like an ugly stodgy old man's car, whereas the S4 is great looking by comparison.
Ignorant? No. Just my opinion. Everyone here is entitled to one.
05-08-2010, 02:20 PM
#19
Race Director
Differences of opinions don't necessarily equate to ignorance.
Also, an old A4 isn't comparable to a new S4, and an old E-class isn't the same as a new 6.3 E-class either.
One could make an argument that comparing an old A4 to a new S4 or your ownership of an old E-class to a new 6.3 is ignorant as well, and really, it's just your opinion.
For example, whatever benefits the 6.3 has over the S4 performance-wise are mitigated by the fact that the E63 looks like an ugly stodgy old man's car, whereas the S4 is great looking by comparison.
Ignorant? No. Just my opinion. Everyone here is entitled to one.
Also, an old A4 isn't comparable to a new S4, and an old E-class isn't the same as a new 6.3 E-class either.
One could make an argument that comparing an old A4 to a new S4 or your ownership of an old E-class to a new 6.3 is ignorant as well, and really, it's just your opinion.
For example, whatever benefits the 6.3 has over the S4 performance-wise are mitigated by the fact that the E63 looks like an ugly stodgy old man's car, whereas the S4 is great looking by comparison.
Ignorant? No. Just my opinion. Everyone here is entitled to one.
My A4 was a total beater compared to the new S4, but that doesn't mean I have no experience with a new S4.
That is simply nothing for me to get fired up about. Acres of cheap plastic.You can think whatever you like about the appearances, but I disagree. The E63 takes over from the old buick Grand National as "going fast with class".
05-08-2010, 03:59 PM
#20
Pro
Drive a Mercedes, any kind or style and you're most likely close to retirement. They're safe and forgiving cars and have enough e-gizmos to keep you safely on the road, regardless if you can't turn your head, don't know how to back up or stay in lane or just need that plush seat for the perfect Sunday drive at 20mph etc.
Drive the Audi and you extend the range of everything above.
Just my opinion of what I see in traffic everyday.
Drive the Audi and you extend the range of everything above.
Just my opinion of what I see in traffic everyday.
05-08-2010, 05:11 PM
#21
Drive a Mercedes, any kind or style and you're most likely close to retirement. They're safe and forgiving cars and have enough e-gizmos to keep you safely on the road, regardless if you can't turn your head, don't know how to back up or stay in lane or just need that plush seat for the perfect Sunday drive at 20mph etc.
Drive the Audi and you extend the range of everything above.
Just my opinion of what I see in traffic everyday.
Drive the Audi and you extend the range of everything above.
Just my opinion of what I see in traffic everyday.
I would never buy a car based on a stereotype. I buy what I enjoy to drive and honestly want. To do otherwise shows some incredible insecurity, imho. I don't think anyone here would either (at least I hope not.)
Many of the Porsches I see on the road are driven by TV reality show producers, dentists, and ambulance chasing lawyers. And retired old men. I guess driving a Porsche puts me in that group. Right? But that wouldn't stop me thinking about a new 997 someday. And anyway it's just a stupid stereotype.
I think the OP just wants to hear what might be good for a DD. It would be nice if people who currently own an E63 or a S4 would respond. Instead we're getting hearsay based on urban myths, car magazine opinions, and various stereotypes. BMW= cocksters; Audi= accountants; MB= old retired men.
fwiw, the AMG Black Series SL65 was one of the most amazing cars I have driven. Sorry I don't own one so I can't truly comment, but it's not a car for old men who "drive on Sundays at 20 mph." I know a few AMG owners and none are anywhere near retirement. And many own exotic sports cars but use the AMG as a DD. A lot of young people make good money in LA.
In addition I've driven an Audi R8. I can't really comment other than it was a blast to drive and certainly not a car for accountants.
An AMG E Class (or S Class) can make for a very comfortable and practical DD with gobs of torque. And the S4 can, too. Although it's a much smaller car. Why not look at the Audi S6, also? Or does it have a stereotype that's too unbearable?
Whatever the OP chooses, I'd personally recommend a DD that's very different than a 993. Like more room, comfort, amenities and an auto tranny (for traffic.) Unless they are really looking for something similar (then the S4, RS4, M3, 335i, etc., with a MT would do fine.)
p.s., if the OP is serious about an AMG, then they might want to look into a CLS 63 if they are worried that some folks might think they're driving a "stodgy old man's car." Yikes, it really sounds like there are too many people going through their midlife crisis here on RL.
Last edited by Canyon56; 05-08-2010 at 09:45 PM. Reason: can't spell
05-08-2010, 08:06 PM
#22
Racer
fwiw, I have a 2009 E63 as my DD. My take is that it makes for a great DD since it's so super comfortable. In addition, it has the AMG tuned suspension, transmission (7 speed) and of course, the 6.2 liter V8.
It's not as "sporty" as an Audi, but it was never meant to be. It's a mid-size, luxury, Autobahn cruiser. Bigger than the C63 but not as huge as the S63. It's a good fit for me, personally. Despite that it's a mid-sized car, it has exceptional turning radius. It feels a lot more nimble than it looks.
I find that it's a great compliment to the 993. They are so far apart that it makes sense to have both.
As far as reliability goes, MB had a bad period from 2000-2005. And so did Audi. But both brands have overcome that, imho. A new MB and a new Audi should be as trouble-free as one can expect from a modern German car with major high tech electronics. fwiw, mine has been flawless for the 20k it has on it so far.
And with all the modern amenities (the 2009s have the newest HDD COMAND nav and voice control system), the car makes for a really excellent long distance cruiser. The seats have nice Nappa leather and are heavily bolstered (and great electronic lumbar support.)
The air suspension has variable settings and on comfort mode it simply eats up potholes. In Sport II mode, it handles pretty well for a big sedan. The massive binders (360mm composites with 6 pots up front) allow for hard braking into the corners and the 465 lb-ft torque (torque comes on fairly early even for a n/a motor) gets you out fast.
If you drive like an old lady (not from Pasadena), you can actually get decent mpg. I've had 19 city and 23 highway with the tranny in non-sport mode.
The current S4 would be a great choice especially for AWD. And if you can live with the smaller cabin. But I will say this: I thought the Audi 4 felt it had a much heavier steering and chassis feel than the E63 (AWD?)
The E63 is for pure comfort and slamming your passenger into the seat just for fun. There's no question that the E63 is very, very quick off the line.
It's not as "sporty" as an Audi, but it was never meant to be. It's a mid-size, luxury, Autobahn cruiser. Bigger than the C63 but not as huge as the S63. It's a good fit for me, personally. Despite that it's a mid-sized car, it has exceptional turning radius. It feels a lot more nimble than it looks.
I find that it's a great compliment to the 993. They are so far apart that it makes sense to have both.
As far as reliability goes, MB had a bad period from 2000-2005. And so did Audi. But both brands have overcome that, imho. A new MB and a new Audi should be as trouble-free as one can expect from a modern German car with major high tech electronics. fwiw, mine has been flawless for the 20k it has on it so far.
And with all the modern amenities (the 2009s have the newest HDD COMAND nav and voice control system), the car makes for a really excellent long distance cruiser. The seats have nice Nappa leather and are heavily bolstered (and great electronic lumbar support.)
The air suspension has variable settings and on comfort mode it simply eats up potholes. In Sport II mode, it handles pretty well for a big sedan. The massive binders (360mm composites with 6 pots up front) allow for hard braking into the corners and the 465 lb-ft torque (torque comes on fairly early even for a n/a motor) gets you out fast.
If you drive like an old lady (not from Pasadena), you can actually get decent mpg. I've had 19 city and 23 highway with the tranny in non-sport mode.
The current S4 would be a great choice especially for AWD. And if you can live with the smaller cabin. But I will say this: I thought the Audi 4 felt it had a much heavier steering and chassis feel than the E63 (AWD?)
The E63 is for pure comfort and slamming your passenger into the seat just for fun. There's no question that the E63 is very, very quick off the line.
05-08-2010, 09:36 PM
#23
Rennlist Member
To the original poster, have you driven all 3 of these cars for 30 minutes or more? Which one are you leaning towards? My neighbor where I used to live 2 years ago got an E63 and took me for a ride in it. I'll never forget it. I wanted one, badly after being driven in it. Total rocketship. The Audi is probably just as good a product. This one really comes down to personal choice. I highly doubt one is literally that much better than another other than subjective opinion, and that's it. It's not like saying a Mercedes S63 is so much better than a Hyundai Elantra. I think we can all agree with that. But when you're talking about this Audi and the MB E63, it's too close to say that one is dramatically better as a DD. Only the OP can decide that.
I wish I had your problem. Report back when you choose!
I wish I had your problem. Report back when you choose!
05-09-2010, 02:08 AM
#25
AutoX
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Between the older E55 and E63, the E55 might be a better choice then the E63 if you are looking to tune the engine. The E55 is supercharged and can get over 500whp pretty easily. Also the E63's have an air suspension that could potentially be costly down the road.
Also, no manual option for the Mercedes and I don't believe 4-matic is an option either. If you live in the northern states, the mercedes might not be the best fit for icy winters. The S4 also has much more aftermarket support and is connected to the VW communities which offer a wealth of knowledge and have well attended events.
Tough choice, but the S4 is a better daily driver in diverse conditions.
05-09-2010, 11:19 AM
#26
Race Director
I don't agree with this one bit. The Mercedes lists at ~$35k more when new. Several 2005's are selling around the $30k mark when 2005 S4's are only $10k+/- less.
Between the older E55 and E63, the E55 might be a better choice then the E63 if you are looking to tune the engine. The E55 is supercharged and can get over 500whp pretty easily. Also the E63's have an air suspension that could potentially be costly down the road.
Also, no manual option for the Mercedes and I don't believe 4-matic is an option either. If you live in the northern states, the mercedes might not be the best fit for icy winters. The S4 also has much more aftermarket support and is connected to the VW communities which offer a wealth of knowledge and have well attended events.
Tough choice, but the S4 is a better daily driver in diverse conditions.
Between the older E55 and E63, the E55 might be a better choice then the E63 if you are looking to tune the engine. The E55 is supercharged and can get over 500whp pretty easily. Also the E63's have an air suspension that could potentially be costly down the road.
Also, no manual option for the Mercedes and I don't believe 4-matic is an option either. If you live in the northern states, the mercedes might not be the best fit for icy winters. The S4 also has much more aftermarket support and is connected to the VW communities which offer a wealth of knowledge and have well attended events.
Tough choice, but the S4 is a better daily driver in diverse conditions.
05-09-2010, 02:22 PM
#27
That's correct.
fwiw, you can also purchase air components from Arnott Industries which is less expensive than buying from the dealer. MB, BMW, Lexus, Jaguar, Range Rover, Citroen pneumatic system components are all available aftermarket. btw, the Audi Allroad (C5) also had air suspension.
fyi, there is a fairly large AMG community. MBUSA even has their own forum for AMG owners. Granted not many AMGs were/are manufactured compared to the much more common Audi/VWs. There are more Porsches built than AMGs. But aftermarket support comes in the form of highly respected tuners such as Renntech, Kleemann, Lorinser, and Brabus. There are also smaller tuning houses such as Evosport, MHP, VRP, Eurocharged, etc..
The downside is the cost of aftermarket stuff and Daimler parts in general. One needs to know that going in. Audi will be the less expensive route.
Again, it would be nice if actual owners of E63/E55 and S4/6 owners could respond.
I shopped the S4/S6 and I'd like to hear something from owners, too.
fwiw, you can also purchase air components from Arnott Industries which is less expensive than buying from the dealer. MB, BMW, Lexus, Jaguar, Range Rover, Citroen pneumatic system components are all available aftermarket. btw, the Audi Allroad (C5) also had air suspension.
The downside is the cost of aftermarket stuff and Daimler parts in general. One needs to know that going in. Audi will be the less expensive route.
Again, it would be nice if actual owners of E63/E55 and S4/6 owners could respond.
I shopped the S4/S6 and I'd like to hear something from owners, too.
05-09-2010, 04:01 PM
#30
Rennlist Member
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w211-e55-amg-e63-amg/
I've just spent 2 hours looking at every post going back a few months regarding the E55's vs E63's. Fascinating reading for my own interest and I'm sure you'll find what you need, here too.