Alright,
I am/was about to buy a car across the country that I found on Ebay. I had a local Rennlister check out the car, and he said it was great. Storms Motors did a PPI on the car, didn't find anything mechanically wrong with the car, but they did find the odometer broken.
Looking back at the Carfax and the Ebay pictures, the mileage was 47,789 in 7/20/2006 and 48,455 in 1/8/2009. The car was listed for sale and shows a pic of the odometer reading 48,455 two weeks ago!
So now, obviously the actual mileage is incorrect. The owner admitted to having the speedo fixed, but claims he had no idea that the odometer was broken.
Currently the car is a good deal at $24,000 (including $1000 for shipping), but with a True Milage Unknown branded title I am not sure what the value is.
I really like the car and want to purchase it since it seems fine mechanically but I dont want to lose my **** on it either.
Any suggestions?
Thanks,
Peter

 

Is the title held by the seller a TMU title?

 

If you have the previous owners service records, try to find the last service and or tire install. Look at the dates. All service shops will have the mileage and date of service on the receipt. Also, check the tread wear on the tires. You know, most tires only last about 10,000 miles on our cars. You should be able to get a good indication of the missing mileage from the remaining tread wear. It sounds like you got a good deal regardless. Good Luck!

 

BS! This odo could have been broken for years. With the owner digging that fact that no miles were being racked up on his prize. I would ask for more evidence to back up the lack of miles since 2006. When an auto title is transferred, the seller must complete an odometer disclosure statement that includes an affirmation that the odometer mileage shown on the odometer statement is either the actual mileage, exceeds the mechanical limits of the odometer, or is not the actual mileage. Based on what you and the seller know the "correct" answer is NAM. Odometer fraud is no joke.

If this Porsche is in great shape like you believe, it might be worth $24K with 80K miles! The NAM brand will always be a cloud on this car. But it may also be a great car at a great price. Only you can decide if you really care.

 

cdmdriver,
Thats a good idea. I will try and find out when the last tires were purchased. I am estimating there are now 55,000 miles on the car, just by averaging the mileage out over the previous seven years of ownership and adding to the last known mileage. Obviously there could be a LOT more or a little less than that.
I will try and find out more tomorrow and will post here.
Thanks again

 

I can't think of two bigger red flags.

As cdmdriver noted, unless the owner did all their own work there have to be service invoices with noted mileage in the past few years. If the owner threw the receipts away or they were otherwise lost simply ask for the name of the shops that did any and all work; oil changes, alignments, tires, etc., they will have the records. Even a JiffyLube type place will have such a record.

If he/she balks, in any way, I'd walk. My $.02.

 

Since you mentioned PPI done with no mechanical failure found, it is worth the price despite it might already run 80K or 100K miles. Many 911s have broken odo. Mine too. It is no big deal.

BTW, we have seen many 911s over 200K or 300K miles with their engines still in tact. You can literally say 80K or 100K the night is still young.

 

The night is still young, agreed, but you want to have some idea what she looks like under the dress before you take her home. You don't want to propose to a 22 year old only to find out she's actually 42. Not that there's anything wrong with 42, but if you were expecting 22... you get the point.

 

It may be a great car, but with a TMU title, now its a "story car".

"Story Cars" become an issue when its time to sell becuase you have to tell the next owner a Story...Personally I rather stay away unless you get a significant discount, 15- 20%, but that just me.

 

I am STILL waiting to Storms to fax me the complete inspection report, but I have been doing some online investigating into this dilemna.
I am still interested in the car (call me crazy) because it is a good deal even with 80k miles on it, but based on trending the mileage since the current owner bought the car I suspect it has closer to 53,000 miles. (see graph).

I also looked on the CA DMV website and I think I may have an out for the branded title issue. I would of course still have to be honest about the "mystery miles" when I sold the car, but if I could avoid a branded title that would be great.

When Do I Report Odometer Mileage Readings?
Odometer mileage readings are encouraged for all motor vehicles, but are mandatory when:
you initially register a motor vehicle or transfer ownership, and
the vehicle is less than 10 years old.

Are There Any Exceptions To This Requirement?
Yes. Reporting the odometer mileage reading is encouraged, but not mandatory if:
the vehicle is 10 years old or older,
the vehicle is a commercial vehicle with unladen weight of more than 8,500 lbs (more than 16,000 lbs gross vehicle weight),
the vehicle is sold directly by a manufacturer to any agency of the United States, or
the vehicle is a new vehicle transferred prior to first retail sale by a dealer.

So if I don't post the mileage when I register it, then I might not need to sign the TMU document or lie about the mileage?

 

To answer some inevitable questions about the graph:
yes, I am obsessive and yes, I am bored
I will repost once the fax comes through.

 

One other way to get an approximation of true mileage is to divide the mileage of the vehicle by the operating hours. Hours can be determined via the PPI with a OBD scan tool. The number should be between 30 and 45 which will be the approxmiate MPH the vehicle was driven. Again, this is just an approximation but better than a broken odometer with potential stories.

Example: 42000 miles on a vehicle with 900 hours on it would mean the average MPH is 46.6

Just my .02

Good luck.

 

Went to take a look at a local '97 Carrera S at an Audi dealership on Sat. The Carfax showed a TMU problem only this one was 8 years in the making. The last reliable mileage with approx 46K on the clock was in 2000. Ever since then the report as well as all service records show 46K. Who knows what the mileage is now....and they want almost $37K for it.......

 

CorrdoBrit,
As long as they were up front about it, they can ask whatever they want. Finding someone to pay that much for a "mystery mileage" car is another story all together.

Storms Motors finally got back to me. They screwed up yesterday when they told me the odometer was broken. It does work... because it was just fixed about three weeks ago... right before the car went for sale.
How Storms screwed up was the technician copied the inspection report from the previous time the car had been in to Storms without verifying that the odometer was actually broken. Fortunately their screw up opened my eyes to what was going on, but Storms is completely incompetent if the techs just copy old reports without verifying them. What if I had okayed them to to fix the odo last night for $1060???
Anyways, I am trying to renegotiate the deal now since the car obviously has a mileage issue, even if it is minimal (<10k hopefully )