flatsixforme

FYI...to my knowledge you can't get punitive damages in CA small claims court (any small claims court for that matter)...its intent is aimed at actual damages only. In addition and with all cases, actual/direct evidence is paramount as opposed to circumstantial evidence. The limit is $7500...was raised from $5000 a while back.

Good luck and beautiful car!

Chuck W.

Mike; Go for the small claims suit. I don't think you'll get much more out of a $22500 car fraud. I'll get you the paperwork and hand carry it to the court for filing. We'll set the court date far enough in advance that you can book a cheap flight. Fly in early, I'll pick you up at Onterio (or LAX if needs be), go to court with you and you can fly back that night. Or, I've got an extra bedroom (or 2) and you can spend the night (or 2).

dmw

If you pay an attorney his or her fee, they will take your case. Simple as that. The problem is that you are looking at $400/hr or more for the attorney. Best case scenario, you only invest 5 hours of attorney time ($2000) to have one draft and file a complaint, and then the defendant gives you what you want. That is doubtful. More likely, the defendant fights it and then the clock (and cost) really starts running. If you actually go to trial, a simple half day trial will cost you another 5-10 hours minimum of attorney time. Even if you win, your recovery will be the lost value of the car. You don't get your attorney fees back.

Unless you are very rich and money is no object, suing someone based on "the principle of the thing" is a horrible idea. If you must sue, take it to small claims court. Your damages in this case aren't anywhere near $5000.

If you really want a lawyer in LA, I can give you a referral. PM me. But you need to be prepared to pay a $20,000 retainer up front.

Best of luck and sorry to hear about your troubles.

fbfisher

^ what he said. And even if you win, collecting on the judgement may take the rest of your life, or longer, and you still may not see a dime.

You may want to consider having a beer with friends, vent, and then let it go and enjoy the car. Life is short.

scat

I agree with the two posts above:how much is your time worth,your agravation,etc.It seems you got a nice car for a good price.In your case only the lawyers will profit.Good luck!

patela

I'd take Chuck up on his offer and do the small claims thing. It's pretty easy from what I hear, and a lawyer will cost too much to be worth it. (ask me how I know).

Even if you don't get some money back, you can make life pretty difficult for him. A judgment in SCC will allow you to put liens on his property until he pays.

hddude

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe in CA an appeal of a small claims verdict by a defendant -- assuming this case is won by plaintiff -- means the matter will be heard as a new case by the superior court -- and of course that can involve attorneys/additional time/expense. So this might not be as simple and inexpensive to litigate in small claims court as some people here suggest. I realize most defendants would not appeal but if this becomes a grudge match as it seems to be, who knows.

vjd3

A judgment might be obtained through small claims court, the challenge will be actually collecting anything, especially with you being out of state.

Did you run a Carfax or Autocheck on the car before you bought it? Seems like there would be recourse there, as it should've flagged it.

I would ask yourself how much you would have paid for the car if you knew up front that the odo was broken (not an uncommon occcurrance on these cars) and then have a local lawyer draft a certified demand letter for that amount (couple grand maybe?), informing him that you intend to file the case in such-and-such a court under such-and-such a statute. If that gets ignored, file it in small claims and at least take satisfaction knowing that you are causing a hassle for the guy that he will have to deal with on some level. It's easy to ignore emails and calls, less so a certified letter, and even less so an actual filing. If you are a good writer, you can write the demand letter yourself; become a lawyer, even if it's just on letterhead for a day.

MarkD

Chuck, what an offer... you are good people.

inkatouring

Use small claims. The damages are the difference in value between the car with the miles you bought and the one you thought you bought. That will not be over $7500, which is he jurisdictional limit it in small claims. An attorney will cost as much or more than you'll ever recover.

Go here for the small claims forms: clickie here and select "small claims" group

Mark in Baltimore

No lie! Mighty generous, Chuck.

Chuck W.

It would be my pleasure to help Mike out and be part of the effort to correct this. This was a blatant calculated deception on the seller’s part.

Plus, it's always nice to give back to the Rennlist community!

Rennlist 993 - not a forum - a family....

Arena993

Chuck PM sent.

Everyone else thanks so much for the advice. I am not trying to be a pain in the ***. I just expect this guy to step up for whats wrong. I tried via phone and email to him and he just shut it down. I do not do business this way at all (and I have sold a ton of things on Rlist including 2 cars) and it is just a hard pill to swallow. I buy an sell over 50 high end cars a year and have had a few issues along the way, but I cut the check if I am responsible. Oh well, I am sorry for the rant. No one likes to take it up the #%. Thanks again for letting me vent.

Mike

bill930p

For small claims court, I believe, you can file the claim in the state where the property is located. At least that what it says on the Miami-Dade Courts website.

2Many Cars

I've done the small claims thing in CA and it's a straightforward process. You'll basically each get a chance to make your claim in front of a Judge who will decide. There are two hurdles you'll need to face. The first is to prove that the seller knowingly hid the odometer issue from you. That looks pretty much like a slam dunk but you'll want to anticipate the obvious defense the seller will use (I didn't know, you should have known, etc.) even though the arguements are weak. Second you'll need to convince the Judge about the amount of damages. This is a tougher issue as the Judge will likely not be a "car" guy who will understand and assign a good value to the loss. Your professional judgement won't mean much because you have an obvious interest. Work on getting data together that supports your damages case in as strong and concrete way as possible. If you can do that well you should get a good settlement.

Finally, If it were me, before I did all this I'd find a lawyer who would be willing to write a nasty letter basically asking for a specified dollar amount of settlement to end this. In the letter I'd state that unless you get it settled you'll file in small claims AND alert the authorities to the odometer issue. If the lawyer explains what the penalties are for the odometer problem and the fact that once alerted the authorities can not be called off, the seller may be a bit more incented to settle. If he doesn't settle, any action by the state will likely only help your case in small claims court.

Sorry you're facing this but keep a rational, even head (like it seems you are so far) and I think you'll get some good satisfaction in the end.